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AP24 install to existing N2K backbone?

Old 05-30-2016, 08:03 AM
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Default AP24 install to existing N2K backbone?

Searched but couldn't find a direct answer - Can I connect the AP24 components (AP24, AC12 and RC42 directly to an existing N2K network or do I need to establish a SimNet w/ MultiJoiner first and then branch the two? In this scenario, there are no connections between the AP components, and all comms is via N2K.

The existing N2K network is mostly Garmin with with some EP65 fluid level sensors.

I know there are "N" versions of the AC12 and RC42 to simplify the connections.
Old 05-30-2016, 08:10 AM
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It's the same electrical networks, just different connectors. Get AC12N and RC42N versions, these have NMEA 2000 micro-C connectors. Then you need an adapter for SimNet to micro-C for AP24 control head.

I installed both my AP24 pilots prior to the N versions. I still used standard NMEA 2000 cabling for both systems. For AC12 which has screw terminals I used a standard NMEA 2000 cable where I cut of one of the connectors. For RC42 and AC12 I used adapters.
Old 05-30-2016, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by abbor View Post
It's the same electrical networks, just different connectors. Get AC12N and RC42N versions, these have NMEA 2000 micro-C connectors. Then you need an adapter for SimNet to micro-C for AP24 control head.
Thanks abbor, I'm going to try to get the N versions when I order the package and found the SimNet to micro-C adapter cable.

Originally Posted by abbor View Post
I installed both my AP24 pilots prior to the N versions. I still used standard NMEA 2000 cabling for both systems. For AC12 which has screw terminals I used a standard NMEA 2000 cable where I cut of one of the connectors. For RC42 and AC12 I used adapters.
I found this in one of your earlier posts and have it as my plan B if, for some reason, i can't get the N versions or they're significantly more money. The packages (eg., AP2401VRF) aren't clear whether the N version is included. I'll be speaking with the THT vendor tomorrow to find out.
Old 05-30-2016, 03:15 PM
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FYI: I spent the extra money for an AC12N, and it has screw terminals just like an AC12. I had to cut the end off an NMEA 2000 cable to connect to my network. I'm not sure there is any difference between the AC12 and the AC12N except for the stickers (and Navico's profit margin).
Old 05-30-2016, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by yabbut View Post
FYI: I spent the extra money for an AC12N, and it has screw terminals just like an AC12. I had to cut the end off an NMEA 2000 cable to connect to my network. I'm not sure there is any difference between the AC12 and the AC12N except for the stickers (and Navico's profit margin).
Ok, so the AC12N still has the screw terminals (redundancy).

I'm confused, if you got the AC12N, I would have assumed it has an N2K plug on it and you wouldn't need to cut the end off and plug it into the screw terminals??? If not, why bother with an 'N" version?
Old 05-30-2016, 05:41 PM
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The cable for AC12N should still have a pigtail for the screw terminals in one end, but it should have Micro-C and not SimNet in the other end.
Old 05-31-2016, 01:15 AM
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Originally Posted by BayHouse View Post
Ok, so the AC12N still has the screw terminals (redundancy).

I'm confused, if you got the AC12N, I would have assumed it has an N2K plug on it and you wouldn't need to cut the end off and plug it into the screw terminals??? If not, why bother with an 'N" version?
The AC12N's screw terminals aren't for redundancy: there is no Micro-C (N2K) connector on it at all. The screw terminals are the only way to connect to the NMEA 2000 network.

Maybe there is an internal difference between the AC12N and the AC12... but I kinda doubt it. If I'd known the AC12N had screw terminals, I'd have tried an AC12 and I probably would've saved myself some cash.
Old 05-31-2016, 02:57 AM
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The simnet connectors are significantly smaller and therefore easier to pull through tight chases (if you have any) and the simnet network can be tied into a micro-c network easily (and vice-versa). The multi joiner is also more slick than a mass of Tee connectors as well. No idea why you'd cut the simnet connectors off? To each his own but I have a mixture of simnet and micro-c connectors. And, as said, the only difference between an AC12 & AC12N is the connector on the network cable. Then again the only difference between simnet and n2k is the connectors as well so not sure what people were expecting.
Old 05-31-2016, 03:53 AM
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I started aith an AC12 and made it into AC12N by taking a standard micro-C cable, cutting off one connector and connecting the wires in that end to AC12 screw terminals. The only difference between AC12 and AC12N is the connector in the end of the supplied cable, one comes with SimNet, the other with Micro-C, both have a pigtail for the screw terminals in the other end.
Old 05-31-2016, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by chainsaw42 View Post
And, as said, the only difference between an AC12 & AC12N is the connector on the network cable. Then again the only difference between simnet and n2k is the connectors as well so not sure what people were expecting.
It's not a big deal, but I paid significantly more for an AC12N than I would have for an AC12. Actually, at the time, the AC12N was selling for more than the cost of an AC12 plus a Simnet-to-MicroC adapter cable. Since the housing of the actual AP computer has different model numbers on the sticker, I thought that the two AP computers might actually be different.

Yes, many knowledgeable people (including you and abbor) are already aware that the AC12 and AC12N computers are identical, but I suspect that many potential buyers (especially first-time AP installers like me) do not know that.

I just think it's important to note (on THT) that the AC12 computer is identical to the AC12N computer, so that someone with a long spare Micro-C cable lying around can buy the less expensive or more readily-available of the two AC12 kits without compatibility concerns. That's all.
Old 05-31-2016, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by yabbut View Post
I just think it's important to note (on THT) that the AC12 computer is identical to the AC12N computer, so that someone with a long spare Micro-C cable lying around can buy the less expensive or more readily-available of the two AC12 kits without compatibility concerns. That's all.
I had assumed that the N version was a different model and included an N2K plug so very helpful with the clarification that the only difference is the cable that it ships with. Nice marketing ploy to get more money out of consumers.
Old 06-02-2016, 01:58 PM
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Ok, parts have been ordered and I'm ready for the install.

I've been thinking about the existing AP11/J300x install and what's different. The J300x has screw terminals for connecting the Radar (Data/Clock) and believe the current RFC35 provides heading data to the Radar.

The AC12 has no such connections so is there way to connect the AP24 install with the Furuno 1833c Radar? I don't use radar overlay (mostly open water running) and don't have a chip for local waters. The RDP139 is really only used for Radar and backup FF, Garmin devices are primary.

I'm not even sure what the Data/Clock connections enable, anyone?

Last edited by BayHouse; 06-02-2016 at 02:27 PM.
Old 06-02-2016, 02:10 PM
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You need a NMEA 2000 to 183 converter to get heading to an older Furuno radar.

http://www.actisense.com/products/nmea-2000/ngw-1/ngw-1
Old 06-02-2016, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by abbor View Post
You need a NMEA 2000 to 183 converter to get heading to an older Furuno radar.

http://www.actisense.com/products/nmea-2000/ngw-1/ngw-1
Thanks, think it would be easier to just get the 0183 off my my Garmin 76xx MFD.
Old 06-24-2016, 12:05 PM
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The install of the AP24 was pretty much plug and play with the most difficult part cutting the larger holes for the head unit. Did the dock and seaside setup and tested the AP last weekend. Worked like a charm with the old RPU80 pump.

Thanks everyone for the help!
Old 08-21-2016, 04:16 PM
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I have an AP 2403 kit on order from Simrad. I was under the impression that I could run the RC42 rate compass directly into the back of the AP24 head unit into the simnet port (J1), then tie into the N2k network out of the other simnet port on the AP24 head unit (J2) port... Using the simnet to Micro C adapter.? Doesn't Simrad have the ability to daisy chain the simnet components?

Thanks for the help.
Old 08-21-2016, 04:23 PM
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No you can't daisy chain AP24 and RC42. Daisy chaining can only be done for the backbone, not for the drop cables so only units with two female SimNet connectors can be daisy chained.
Old 08-21-2016, 04:26 PM
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You can cut off the RC42 connector and put on a Maretron field attachable micro-C NMEA 2000 connector, for AP24 the SimNet to micro-C adapter cable is needed. For AC12 I take a NMEA 2000 cable, cut off the female connector and attach the wires to the AC12 screw terminals.
Old 08-21-2016, 04:32 PM
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Thanks Abbor, So I will use an older NMEA cable like you mentioned for the AC-12 and just cut/attach it where required. For the AP24 and RC 42, I will just use the simnet to micro C adapter kit and run into existing NMEA T connection network. Part #24005729 I believe.

Thanks

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