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Basic Radar

Old 04-08-2015, 06:19 AM
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Default Basic Radar

Hello,

I'd like to get a minimum radar setup for my 22' Grady White that has a pretty solid roof that sits maybe 10' above the water level. I'm not planning on chasing birds across the horizon but I would like to weave my way with confidence into port on a dark stormy night . Also I'd like it to be able to mark a 30' boat up to 10 miles away.

My charging system is very limited. My often used kicker puts out 8 amps while trolling and my seldom used Yamaha F250 prime mover will generate 45amp (@5k RPM). I also have a portable Honda EU2000i (2000 watt generator). I'm hoping I can get away with a 2KW dome radar but I'd go to 4kw if I had to. I've got 3 batteries on board. I'm also running a fair amount of other electronics like downriggers (with bottom tracking), AP, Fishfinder ,160 lb. electric motor and a 5000 btu hatch AC...... And the list keeps growing . I know I can't run all this at one time but I think I can run what I need, when I need it, most all the time.

So, do I need to go up to a 4kw radar (dome preferred) to guide me into port and to mark craft at 10 miles range?

Thrillseekers

2x Grumman 17' square stern canoes (4hp), - Mithril and Seeker
1 x 14' Lonestar V bottom W/ 54# thrust electric
1 x Grady 22' 224G, Yamaha F250 w/ 9.9 Yamaha kicker and 160# electric
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Old 04-08-2015, 06:46 AM
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If you have a fair amount of surface space on your top you may want to think about adding solar panels. They don't make a ton of power, but can certainly help balance the score a bit. Not to mention can keep things charged when your not using the boat depending on storage location.
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Old 04-08-2015, 08:05 AM
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You're not going to see a 30' boat 10 miles away with a 'basic' radar. hell you won't see it with a 25kw bird fryer with the antenna height you are talking about.

Good thing is that there is no reason to see a 30' boat from 10 miles away that I can think of. More realistically, you will be able to reliably pick up 30' boats at 1 mile or so. This is highly dependent on sea state & other influences (rain/fog/etc).

with your limited electrical power available you should strongly consider broadband radar from lowrance/simrad. It is the best small boat radar and low power consumption is just one of the reasons.
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Old 04-08-2015, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by chainsaw42 View Post
You're not going to see a 30' boat 10 miles away with a 'basic' radar. hell you won't see it with a 25kw bird fryer with the antenna height you are talking about.
6 miles at best with optimal conditions, regardless of what the max range is listed.


Radar Horizon Calculator
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Old 04-08-2015, 09:52 PM
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All,

Thanks, Great ideas/ information! Also, what about seeing storms coming for 5 miles or so for avoidance purposes? Is that something a minimal radar would be good at?
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Old 04-09-2015, 06:58 AM
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3g/4g radars from navico will give much better close quarter identification. ie speed bumps (kayaks) pot markers etc. standard magnatron radars work much better for long distance. yes my furuno picks up storms much farther out then my 4g. but will not pick up anythi g within 50 yards of the boat. to capitilize on a radar on a small boat. you can post mount it or use a scan strut to get it up much higher. the higher the radar the farther it will see
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Old 04-09-2015, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by chainsaw42 View Post
with your limited electrical power available you should strongly consider broadband radar from lowrance/simrad. It is the best small boat radar and low power consumption is just one of the reasons.
Have you actually looked at the power consumption difference between a 4G and conventional 4kw dome? The 4G is 20W and a 4kw Furuno dome is 24W. That's a difference of 4 watts, or about 0.3A at 12V. For comparison, a single nav light is between 10W and 20W. Everyone seems to think there is some huge difference, but it's really very small - almost insignificant.
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Old 04-10-2015, 04:43 AM
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Originally Posted by twistedtree View Post
Have you actually looked at the power consumption difference between a 4G and conventional 4kw dome? The 4G is 20W and a 4kw Furuno dome is 24W. That's a difference of 4 watts, or about 0.3A at 12V. For comparison, a single nav light is between 10W and 20W. Everyone seems to think there is some huge difference, but it's really very small - almost insignificant.
Point taken
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Old 04-10-2015, 06:06 AM
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the is a nice JRC 1500 for sale on another site, if you Google jrc 1500 im sure it will come up , think the guy wants $300 complete
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Old 04-10-2015, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Thrillseekers View Post
Hello, ... but I would like to weave my way with confidence into port on a dark stormy night. ...
I think a quality chart-plotter (and/or backup chart-plotter) might a better investment, along with a good spot light. (Keep your chips/software up to date.) The power draw will be more within your limits and less likely to pop a circuit breaker at an awkward moment.

Additionally, if the boat is rocking on that 'dark and stormy night' your radar is going to spend a lot of time pointing to the sky and alternately at the water.

If you decide the radar is the best option for you, an extra battery or two might be a useful addition to the set-up.

Good luck!
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Old 04-10-2015, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by twistedtree View Post
Have you actually looked at the power consumption difference between a 4G and conventional 4kw dome? The 4G is 20W and a 4kw Furuno dome is 24W. That's a difference of 4 watts, or about 0.3A at 12V. For comparison, a single nav light is between 10W and 20W. Everyone seems to think there is some huge difference, but it's really very small - almost insignificant.
Someone concerned about power should switch to LED, I have done so for both navigation and cabin lights. A LED navigation light consumes 2-3W.

I know the wireless "toy" (7.2 degrees beam) radar of Furuno uses only 24W, but when checking DRS4D power numbers I get confused. In the specifications it's listed 0.5V at 48V when powered from an MFD, but with TZT which requires PSU017 to power the radar it's specified 4.0A at 12V and 1.9A at 24V.
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Old 04-10-2015, 07:34 AM
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I agree on both points. Way more power savings can be achieved by switching to LED lights.

And yes, the Furuno spec is a bit confusing. The 48V power is what the dome draws since that's how it's powered. I'm not sure why the specs on the stand-alone power supplies are so much more. They are either really poor supplies, or the spec is for a momentary peak power as opposed to average. My guess is that it's a peek power rating.

As another data point, the 1835 radar system which is a 4KW dome and complete stand alone display and processing unit draws 48W total. And I think it's safe to allot at least half of that to the display/processor.
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Old 05-22-2015, 09:36 PM
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Thanks all for your informative comments. This boat is turning into Frankenstein before my eyes. I bit the bullet and opted for a generator and a Furuno 12kw, 6' array... In the belief that size does matter.
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Old 05-22-2015, 09:41 PM
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Nice. Which model did you get? You won't be disappointed.
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Old 05-23-2015, 07:05 AM
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Thanks, I bought the FR7112... Impulse buy if there ever was one. The display is the size of a small dorm fridge and the array is big enough to have it's own wind pattern. I've read on this site that it's hard to beat a Furuno radar. So now I just have to make it fit.
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Old 05-23-2015, 07:24 AM
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Wow - 6' open-array on 22'? I want one. Post pics once installed.
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Old 05-23-2015, 07:54 AM
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Definitely post some pictures once you get it installed.
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Old 05-24-2015, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Thrillseekers View Post
Thanks, I bought the FR7112... Impulse buy if there ever was one. The display is the size of a small dorm fridge and the array is big enough to have it's own wind pattern. I've read on this site that it's hard to beat a Furuno radar. So now I just have to make it fit.
I thought power consumption was one of your concerns??
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Old 05-24-2015, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Thrillseekers View Post
Thanks all for your informative comments. This boat is turning into Frankenstein before my eyes. I bit the bullet and opted for a generator and a Furuno 12kw, 6' array... In the belief that size does matter.
Sounds like you should've bought a bigger boat instead....
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Old 05-24-2015, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by bbeardsley View Post
Wow - 6' open-array on 22'? I want one. Post pics once installed.

More like a rotor blade......
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