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Building a Simrad Suite - Please Advise

Old 02-24-2015, 07:08 AM
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Default Building a Simrad Suite - Please Advise

I will be pulling the trigger on a complete Simrad package for my 31 Open. A couple of things I'm struggling with right now and could use some opinions. Please offer them up without considering budget.

On the list:

MFD (or a pair)
4G Radar
Airmar B175C-20-H-W
Possible LSS-2
SonicHub
WIFI Hub
AC12 (and possible AP28) Autopilot
RC42 Compass
Cabling AND connectors for N2K backbone

Am I missing anything?

Questions:

1) I have room for (1) NSS16 Evo2 or (2) NSS12 Evo2. Is there an advantage, other than the obvious screen area, to having a master/slave unit on the same helm?

2) I really like the AP28 Controller with the dial. I know the MFD has the autopilot function, but will I learn to like the control from the touch screen? Seems redundant to have the AP28 head unit right next to a perfectly capable display, but not sure I will like the touch AP control.

If I go with the twin 12s I will have no room for anything other than the displays on the helm, but they will be on center and leave a very clean look. If I go with the NSS16 and offset it I can have my AP control head (if that's what I choose to do), VHF radio, and fish hawk display on the helm panel also. If I mount it on center, I have about 4-5 inches on each side and that doesn't leave much room for anything else.

Any suggestions, comments, opinions, or just snide remarks? All are welcome.

Last edited by slipfit; 02-24-2015 at 09:00 AM.
Old 02-24-2015, 07:24 AM
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The resolution on the NSS16 and NSS12 is very similar. I would prefer 2x NSS12 myself due to this. You will have the ability to display much more information on 2x NSS12 then 1x NSS16. You do not need a SonarHub. You might want to get a SimNet to NMEA2000 cable to connect the 4G to NMEA2000 for MARPA. Navico sells a 4 port NMEA backbone that is smaller than 4 T connectors. I would suggest using that as the basis for your network along with an NMEA2000 starter kit.

I don't have autopilot, but abbor seems quite pleased with the user interface on the Evo2 for Autopilot.
Old 02-24-2015, 07:46 AM
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I would go 2 x NSS12 as well. NSS16 is very expensive and don't increase the resolution much. I don't have space for VHF at my helm (on any of my two boats). I have HS35 wireless handsets in wireless charging cradles at the instrument panel on both my boats. RS35 is a bit hidden away (but still accessible) in both installations. 4-5" is more than enough for HS35 and it will allow space for the OP10 autopilot controller as well.

I think the autopilot control integrated in NSS Evo2 is very nice. It's just to touch the autopilot field of the data bar to get the pop up version displayed, you can use the dedicated hw autopilot button to have it displayed or you can have one permanent autopilot window shown. It now has dedicated 1 & 10 degrees turn "buttons" which first generation NSS lacked. You can use the NSS rotary knob to set the course as with AP28. If the databar is switched off it's just to slide one finger down from the top of the screen and the control center with an autopilot is shown (or use the hw button). I think the NSS Evo2 integrated autopilot interface is very good, so if NSS Evo2 is easy accessible (and having two units for redundancy) I don't see any need for an additional controller. With only one screen or if accessing NSS Evo2 buttons are a bit cumbersome I would recommend the small OP10 controller in addition. I have NSS Evo2, first generation NSS, AP24 panel and OP10.

If you go 2 x NSS12 Evo2 there is no need for SonarHub.

'

Last edited by abbor; 02-24-2015 at 08:03 AM.
Old 02-24-2015, 08:01 AM
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What is missing from your extensive list is the NAIS-400 AIS transponder or at least a VHF with integrated AIS receiver (like RS35)
Old 02-24-2015, 08:31 AM
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I have pretty much the same set-up with twin 12's except that I have the AP24 head, sonic hub with dock and Fusion wired remote. No sonarhub (don't need it with the twin MFD's). Sonar with that 175 HW is awesome but I've been underwhelmed with the structurescan.
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Old 02-24-2015, 08:59 AM
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To keep a cleaner look, I use the MFD to control the auto pilot, avoiding the need for the separate control head. I agree that 2x12 can show more than 1x16 and would go that route.
Old 02-24-2015, 09:10 AM
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First off sorry, but I said sonarhub instead of sonichub as I intended.

Arbor - I do currently have the Standard Horizon radio with AIS (GX2200 I believe) and I think it has a NMEA connector. So I think I'm good there.

Thanks for the feedback on the AP interface, I think I may give it a chance.
Old 02-24-2015, 10:08 AM
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OP 40 can be used as buttonized AP and MFD controller.
But wit AP on Auto mode ther will be an annoying AP screen over the map on a fixed spot.

I bought an extra NSS7 evo2 for AP and instrument functions.
Old 02-24-2015, 10:15 AM
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Is your comment regarding the annoying AP screen related to OP40?

Without OP40, this window can be closed by touching the cross in the upper right corner or using the Exit button. I have no experience with OP40 outside boat shows so I don't know if this will influence the way AP control works. Alternatively one of the screen windows can be allocated for fixed autopilot control.
Old 02-24-2015, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by abbor View Post
Is your comment regarding the annoying AP screen related to OP40?

Without OP40, this window can be closed by touching the cross in the upper right corner or using the Exit button. I have no experience with OP40 outside boat shows so I don't know if this will influence the way AP control works. Alternatively one of the screen windows can be allocated for fixed autopilot control.
I know, but with closed AP window you can't use the rotary to steer when in A mode.
Since I don't use my steering wheel anymore, the AP window is almost always in sight.

The fixed AP screen loses focus after a few minutes, you have to hit the screen or rotary to engage it again.

Now I can use the NSO with a clear 16 inch screen in touch mode, or with OP40 and the NSS as steering and instrument machine aswell a an extra transducer source.
Old 02-24-2015, 10:57 AM
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When in Auto mode it's just to touch the green AP field (when the AP is not engaged it's just to touch the same field which then is gray) in the data bar to reevoke the AP pop up and use the exit button to close it. With a two screen setup this can be done on the sounder display not covering charts and radar.
Old 02-24-2015, 11:20 AM
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:-) that was one of the reasons for the 2nd mfd.
So I alway's have a clean big chart and echo screen or chart, structure and depthsounder on the wrecks.
On speed and long distances I use the AP in Nav mode
Old 02-24-2015, 11:31 AM
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Does anyone know who might be willing to draw this kind of package in Navico's system design app? I need to figure out what I will need for cables and connectors. Or maybe it's simple enough that someone can do it in their head. This gets confusing to me.
I don't want to waist any of our site sponsors efforts as I have already sourced the purchase.

All I have now is what stiletto suggested with the NMEA2000 to Simnet cable and the 4 port backbone. Thanks for that.
Old 02-24-2015, 11:46 AM
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To decide the cabling I need to know if you will have RC42 or RC42N, AC12 or AC12N?

I don't have access to the Navico app but except for the model numbers for the different cables I can easily put up a list.
Old 02-24-2015, 11:50 AM
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First make a new list of what you really want to install now.
Then you need to know the distances between the components.

Then connect all network abled devices together with a network cable (count the cables and lengths).
Make a basic nmea 2000 network... powersupply cable,T joiners and resistors to both sides.
Then a dropcable and T joiner to all nmea2000 devices are needed (count the cables ant lenghts).

For more info, look at an installation guide e.q the simrad NSS Evo2 guide.
http://www.simrad-yachting.com/Root/...-10597-001.pdf

page 15 and 17 will help you

If you do it yourself, you know your system better. Making it more easy to expand and/or find failures
Old 02-24-2015, 11:58 AM
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Assuming RC42N and AC12N, you will need the following:

NSS video cable (for NMEA 183 to VHF)
Simnet to micro-C male adapter (for RI10)
4-way NMEA 2000 micro-C joiner
NMEA 2000 starter kit
6' Navico Ethernet cable (between MFD's)
Old 02-24-2015, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by abbor View Post
Assuming RC42N and AC12N, you will need the following:

NSS video cable (for NMEA 183 to VHF)
Simnet to micro-C male adapter (for RI10)
4-way NMEA 2000 micro-C joiner
NMEA 2000 starter kit
6' Navico Ethernet cable (between MFD's)
+ Ethernet for Wifi 1
+ Ethernet for LSS 2 if you want a separate structurebox
Old 02-24-2015, 12:21 PM
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Great! thanks a bunch guys.

What are the pros and cons to the RC42/AC12 N or not. I know the N is for N2K compatibility and it seems that would make life easy, but is there a downside?

How about the interface between the rudder position sensor and pump to the AC12? Is that all going to be the same as my old Raytheon Autohelm connected with screw terminals?

Here is a pic of the helm before replacing the antique radio. Trying to get caught up with the modern day vessel.
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Old 02-24-2015, 12:24 PM
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What cables come with the NSS evo2s? Is it just the power cable and everything else needs to be ordered separately?
Old 02-24-2015, 12:25 PM
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Simrad is moving to Micro C, so N is more easy
Rudder position RF25N is nmea2000 with 5 metres cable
AC12N to Pump is solid DC cable. AWG depending to length

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