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Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Old 01-28-2005, 09:07 PM
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Default Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Help!
i'm looking for a fuel computer and am considering either :
1. Floscan (accutroll 5420-20A-1)
2. Navman F3100 or
3. Standard Horizon's FF41

Floscan is a very nice simple unit with very accurate low flo readings that could handle my aux. engine flows (T9.9hp) and main engine (yami 150), but i like the display on the navman. I checked out navman on their web and read that the fuel transducer has a life expectancy of 5000 litres! someone who burns lots of fuel or just boats a lot will need a transducer every other year!
Std. Horizon looks OK, but i don't know about it's quality.

Any users w/ input?
Old 01-28-2005, 09:23 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Can you post a link to the part of the website that shows the 5,000 liter life expectancy? That sounds awfully low, and I'd like to know too, as I've been looking at buying one of their chartplotters specifically for the built-in fuel flow meter.
Old 01-28-2005, 09:45 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

I don't know why I think this, but aren't Standard and Navman the same thing with different packaging? I bought a Standard 240 a few years ago, and that was my impression at the time, same transducers, etc. I know Standard is more into the radios, and Navman the plotters, GPS's , etc, but it seems like there as a crossover when small integrated fuel meters started competing with Flo Scan.
Old 01-28-2005, 10:15 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Yes, Standard FF41 = Navman 2100 series.

Old 01-28-2005, 11:53 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Regarding the link about navman fuel xducers (don't know how to link, so i'm quoting from the Navman.com web site from their F3100 manual which is easily found) {found this info while hunting to find the specs for how low of a fuel flow it can measure [yes, i've got better things to do!]}

p. 19 of F3100 manual
Appendix B - Toubleshooting
"8. d) The transducers wear out over time and should be replaced every 5000 litres of fuel"

if you don't believe, check it out!
Old 01-29-2005, 01:10 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Regarding Navman F2100 and Std. Horizon's FF41 being one in the same . . . from the specifications from the manuals, they look similar from the outside, but they (navman & std.h.) have different specs when it comes to fuel flow.

from the navman manual > 1.3 US GPH min. flow measured or 5 litres/hour
from the std. horiz. manual > 0.4 imp'l GPH min. flow measurable or 2.5 L/hr or 0.5 US GPH

The std. horizon FF41 can measure a lower fuel flow than the navman.
also just to point out, the floscan can do even lower 0.3 GPH!

I'm leaning toward the floscan, but wondering about other's experiences with these instruments.
Old 01-29-2005, 10:43 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

I am leaning toward Floscan now also. They seem to be sort of an industry benchmark for fuel meters, and although they don't mention anything about the sensor longevity on their website, it looks pretty solid:

http://www.floscan.com/html/gassensors.htm

I would think that the cost of sensor replacements for the Navman/Standard units would make it cheaper in the long run to just get the Floscan.
Old 01-29-2005, 10:52 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

I have the Standard Horizon FF41. Never had any problems with it and I will say that its accuracy is very good. At no wake speed my engine draws around 0.5 gals/hr, at WOT it’s around 16 gals/hr, at cruse it's around 4.5 gals/hr. When I go out for the day on a full tank, and fill up upon return the FF41 and the fuel pump at the gas station are with 1/2 gal of each other.
Old 01-29-2005, 11:04 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

The Standard and Navman ducers are identical, so the specs on one page or the other are bad (perhaps there was a design change between when the Navman info was printed and the Standard info.

FWIW, I have the 3100 with a twin engine kit and both ducers read down to .3 GPH without problems. On a typical trip I burn about 100 gallons and the unit has been consistently within 1/2 gallon. Those trips include 100 miles running and 6-8 hours power drifting with 4 strokes at idle most of the time (very low fuel burn).

Harry
Old 01-29-2005, 01:14 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Harry,
How many hours on the Navman's or how many approx. litres/gallons burned?
When filling up, do you notice any diffences between Pump meter and navman meters?
any diff. from when you started and now?

I read off of Floscan's site that their new accutrolls have superior low flow accuracy because they utilize saphire jewels for bearings which results in low friction and superior longevity (xducer good for life!)

anyone had to replace a xducer for std. horiz. or navman due to wear? if so what kind of use did you get out of it?
Old 01-29-2005, 01:25 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

i don't run the quantity of fuel thru my 3100 that harry does, but mine works beautifully...never more than a 1/2 gal to a gal difference in the fuel used reading on the navman to actual fuel replaced, and you can probably chalk that up to the fact that on a small boat like mine you'll never be able to fill it up exactly the same way twice

that replacement recommendation on the transducer is news to me...guess i didn't see it in the manual. if i ever do need to swap it out it could be done in less than 10 minutes
Old 01-29-2005, 01:32 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

cgrand,
how long have you had your navman and what would you guess as total fuel thru the xduer over it's life so far?
Old 01-29-2005, 01:44 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

i've had it since march 2004...have put approx 100 hrs on the motor since then, so at an avg of 5 gph that's 500 gallons (roughly 1900 liters). at that pace i'll get another 2.5 to 3 years out of a $70 transducer...

figure the price difference between the navman & the flowscan (hundreds) and i'll still be ahead for quite a while
Old 01-29-2005, 02:00 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

Some of the Floscans (7000 & 9000 series and even the 5500) are pricey, but consider this:

Navman F3100 (gauge and ducer) goes for about $275 - 350
Floscan Accutroll 5420-20A-1 (0-25 GPH) goes for about $258 - 335

I love the navman functionality and look, feel, etc., but my only reserve is the longevity. So i lean toward the floscan. I prefer to do things right once and not have to worry about replacing stuff, not to mention the install area in my boat is not easy to access. So the money saved goes to gear and time fishing.
Old 01-29-2005, 02:04 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

as long as that model floscan has comparable features (nmea interface, trip computer, hour meter, volt meter, etc) than it's a fair comparison

to my knowlege only the 9000 series floscan has the gps interface, at over $500.00...
Old 01-29-2005, 02:24 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

cgrand,
yes, you're correct about comparing the navman 3100 to a 9000 floscan price.
i was choosing to compare the navman to the floscan i was considering to buy (5400 accutroll) to take advantage of the ability to accurately measure the low fuel flow of either the main 150 hpdi during idle or low revs and for when i run my kicker T9.9 (both engines sip fuel and some ducers from what i hear are not great (accurate) for low flows).

would be nice if floscan made a modern looking and functioning unit like the Navman F3100 for a decent price. i'm probably going to buy the floscan accutroll and have to crunch numbers in my head underway to guesstimate the other numbers (range at current consumption, avg. fuel burn, etc.)
Old 01-29-2005, 03:53 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

BC,

I've run 150 hours in the past year averaging 30 GPH...that's 4500 gallons or 2250 gallons per ducer. The unit was on my last boat (I removed it before selling) which was a single engine and had over 400 hours at 25 GPH average...another 10000 gallons on one of the ducers. That's 12250 on one ducer and 2250 on the other with no problems.

As I mentioned above...if the gauge says 100 gallons, the pump puts in between 99.5 and 100.5 gallons. I always start with a full tank and always top off until it spills off the vents (fill on land, not on the water).

The accuracy has improved slightly by calibrating it. I keep meticuluous records of fuel usage and every 1000 gallons or so I run the calibration....worst cumulative error was 2.7 gallons, but that was +1.2 gallons on one side and -1.5 gallons on the other side.

If all you want is GPH, go with the 2100 or Standard equivalent...you can get them for under $150.

Harry
Old 01-29-2005, 04:10 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

harry,
i hope you run a charter or some other kinda business to take care of those fuel bills!!!
what kind of power are or were you running?
spent any length of time trolling, at low revs, or do you run a smaller aux./troll motor?

i spend hours at time trolling and downrigging with the gas miser T9.9 and wonder if the low flow and fuel consumed under these low flow conditions will effect the navman's accuracy?
Old 01-29-2005, 04:12 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

harry,
on avg. 30GPH?! what kind of power? and what boat? i'm guessing my 150 hpdi at full might get those ##'s, but for cruise or avg. 30? seems ultra steep.
Old 01-29-2005, 04:23 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Computers: Floscan, Navman, Std. Horizon

I run a Worldcat 330TE with twin Zuke DF250s. The boat weighs over 14K with full fuel, 4 guys, and a feww hundred pounds of fish/ice on board. Cruise is 37 at 1.25 MPG or 30 GPH. Key on to key off averages about 1.1 MPG. That's 100 mile round trip with 5 or more hours idling, power drifting, etc on some trips. Other trips are 4-5 hours high speed cruising, then trolling 6-10 hours, then running back home. The 150 hours I quote is running time at cruise, not idling time. As I said, I keep meticuluous logs of running time, idling time, fuel used, etc.

Fuel burn at idle is VERY low...I've seen as low as .3 MPG combined usage on the Navman. It may not always register, but if iI idle for 5 hours at less than .3, that's only 3 gallons of fuel...I carry 300!. If you only caryy 50 gallons, the kicker use may be a factor, but I'm guessing that 9.9 uses less than .1 GPH, so agin 10 hours of trolling on the 9.9 is only a gallon of fuel. I would not even bother putting the ducer in that part of the fuel line.

I do not do charters. I do however allow friends to share expenses, keeping my costs down. On an average weekend, we'll burn 100 gallons...so that's around $50 each. That $200/month is chump chnage compared to the mortgage on the boat. Heck, my insurance is more than my fuel bill!

Harry


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