Notices
Marine Electronics Forum

Losing my gas tank configuration

Old 10-20-2011, 06:12 PM
  #1  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default Losing my gas tank configuration

Need some help from a Lowrance guru. I have a Lowrance 525c, an EP 60R, and EP 85R on my 2002 Yamah 200 HPDI. I am having a problem with tank configuration on my unit. Every time I turn my unit off, I lose the information on how many gallons my tanks hold. Everything else works, my network recognizes the EP 60R, and the EP 85R. I get fuel burn, seasonal use so I know the data is getting stored somewhere. I just bought the EP 85r hoping it would fix the problem but it has not. I have reentered
the data multiple times, but it still loses the data.

My goal is to be able to use the gas gauge overlay as a fuel gauge.

I did not wire up my NEMA network but it is wired to my wiring block and has power. I do have a battery switch but I still lose the tank configuration info when I turn the unit off with the battery switch on.

Any help on how to troubleshoot this would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
super spook is offline  
Old 10-20-2011, 07:50 PM
  #2  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 5,244
Default

I can't help you but can empathize. I have a Lowrance (see the connection) LCX26HD that I basically use as an engine monitor. It does the same thing. Every time I turn it off and then back on I have to go to Networking > Bus Setup and enter the fact that I have 2 engines and a fuel tank size greater than zero. I am getting pretty fast at it. Of course sometimes I have to smack the thing first because if I don't the down arrow and the "pages" button don't work.

Every Lowrance unit I have had personal experience with (4-5) have had something screwed up on them. I consider mine one of the better ones because it is just an annoyance versus the total failures I have seen on the other ones.

Someone tried to tell me it was because I needed the EP85 but you basically proved that is wrong. If you figure it out let me know.
DreamWeaver21 is offline  
Old 10-20-2011, 08:00 PM
  #3  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 458
Default

Exact same thing here on a Lowrance floscan. Always loses track of the original capacity although gallons used stays intact.
Probably just another example of Lowrance using consumers for field testing...
FishFat is offline  
Old 10-21-2011, 06:19 AM
  #4  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

Well at least I am not alone with this problem! Hopefully someone can chime in with a solution.
super spook is offline  
Old 10-21-2011, 08:55 AM
  #5  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

I did find this on Lowrance's site:

http://primus.lowrance.com/support/answerPagging.do

Seems you have to wait at least 20 seconds for the data to save before turning your unit off. I have a hard time believing this is my problem but will try at lunch today.
super spook is offline  
Old 10-21-2011, 09:25 AM
  #6  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 5,244
Default

All I get from that link is a message that says your session has timed out. I set the settings and then run all day before turning the thing off. It doesn't save it. It does save my custom pages screen layout where I display all the information though.
DreamWeaver21 is offline  
Old 10-21-2011, 09:44 AM
  #7  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

DW21, I agree, I can't believe this is my problem.
super spook is offline  
Old 10-23-2011, 07:57 AM
  #8  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

Well I have scoured the net and Lowrance's FAQ and no solution. It seems that this is primarily a problem with my unit, LMS 525c. I have checked all my connections, everything is showing OK on the Bus Network and I am stumped. I hate to lose though so will keep looking.
super spook is offline  
Old 10-24-2011, 05:27 PM
  #9  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,932
Default

Originally Posted by DreamWeaver21 View Post
I can't help you but can empathize. I have a Lowrance (see the connection) LCX26HD that I basically use as an engine monitor. It does the same thing. Every time I turn it off and then back on I have to go to Networking > Bus Setup and enter the fact that I have 2 engines and a fuel tank size greater than zero. I am getting pretty fast at it. Of course sometimes I have to smack the thing first because if I don't the down arrow and the "pages" button don't work.

Every Lowrance unit I have had personal experience with (4-5) have had something screwed up on them. I consider mine one of the better ones because it is just an annoyance versus the total failures I have seen on the other ones.

Someone tried to tell me it was because I needed the EP85 but you basically proved that is wrong. If you figure it out let me know.
I think that your problem may be the engine interface you have, rather than the LCX. This is because the engine info is stored on the interface, not on the Lowrance.

I had a very similar problem with my setup (Suzuki 115 4 stroke, NMEA2K network with 2 x Lowrance HDS 5's. Every time I turned the engine off I lost the engine hp, year, etc. Very frustrating.

The solution was a software update for the Suzuki engine interface cable, which was a file emailed to me from Lowrance, copied it to an SD card and then uploaded via the HDS5. Once that was done, the settings were then retained.

If you have a Suzuki engine, I have a copy of the interface software update file and can send to you if you like - PM me with you email address and I'll send to you.

You can check the interface software version in the bus devices menu, open the interface and it should tell yo the software versiion somewhere there. The latest Suzuki version is V 2.30.

If you have another engine brand, it would be worth checking with Lowrance to find out if there is a software update for the interface - incidentally, they do not list the interface software updates on their website, you have to contact them and find someone who is familiar with the NMEA2K stuff!

Hope this helps.

Cheers

ML
Moonlighter475 is offline  
Old 10-24-2011, 06:53 PM
  #10  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 5,244
Default

Originally Posted by Moonlighter475 View Post
I think that your problem may be the engine interface you have, rather than the LCX. This is because the engine info is stored on the interface, not on the Lowrance.

I had a very similar problem with my setup (Suzuki 115 4 stroke, NMEA2K network with 2 x Lowrance HDS 5's. Every time I turned the engine off I lost the engine hp, year, etc. Very frustrating.

The solution was a software update for the Suzuki engine interface cable, which was a file emailed to me from Lowrance, copied it to an SD card and then uploaded via the HDS5. Once that was done, the settings were then retained.

If you have a Suzuki engine, I have a copy of the interface software update file and can send to you if you like - PM me with you email address and I'll send to you.

You can check the interface software version in the bus devices menu, open the interface and it should tell yo the software versiion somewhere there. The latest Suzuki version is V 2.30.

If you have another engine brand, it would be worth checking with Lowrance to find out if there is a software update for the interface - incidentally, they do not list the interface software updates on their website, you have to contact them and find someone who is familiar with the NMEA2K stuff!

Hope this helps.

Cheers

ML
Maybe. My unit is interfaced with Etecs. If that were the issue though I should be able to start the eninges, turn on the LCX, set the settings, leave the engines on, turn off the LCX and turn it back on without stopping the motors and I shouldn't lose my config right? I'll go try it tommorow and see what happens.
DreamWeaver21 is offline  
Old 10-24-2011, 08:25 PM
  #11  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,932
Default

You are right, PROVIDED that the power to your NMEA2K network stays on when the LCX is turned off, the settings should still be there if it's a problem with the interface the same as I had. Just make sure that the network power stays on when the LXC is off!

In that case, your approach should show where the problem is, as youve noted. Good luck, let us know how it goes!

Cheers

ML
Moonlighter475 is offline  
Old 10-24-2011, 08:33 PM
  #12  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 5,244
Default

Hmm. Good point. I am pretty sure that my LCX powers my NMEA2k network. It came out when they were still playing with the idea of having a device power the network and mine does. Not sure how to check if the other devices get power with the LCX off because all my network has on it is the LCX, the LCX antenna, and the engines.
DreamWeaver21 is offline  
Old 10-24-2011, 08:47 PM
  #13  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,932
Default

There must only be 1 source of power for the network, and yes, in the case of the LCX series I agree that the GPS antenna was powered from the LCX, so that's where the network gets it's power from too.

So you might be in a bit of a bind....I'm trying to think of a way to turn the LCX head unit off without also turning power to the antenna (and thus also the network power)..... but I dont think there is a quick/easy way to do that.

But I guess if you really wanted to you could disconnect the 2 power supply wires to the antenna and put in a separate power node and T piece into the network..... but if you do this and the problem turns out to NOT be the interface, then its kind of wasted effort/expense.......

Why not attack this from another angle.....

Suggestion: Contact Lowrance customer support and find out from them what the latest software version is for the E-Tec engine interface, and then compare that version with the version that shows up on your network devices list? If you have the same version, then this is a dead-end street and you need go no further.

If however you have an older version, get them to send the new version to you and upload, and see if it fixes the problem?

Cheers

ML
Moonlighter475 is offline  
Old 10-24-2011, 11:16 PM
  #14  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,932
Default

Originally Posted by super spook View Post
Well I have scoured the net and Lowrance's FAQ and no solution. It seems that this is primarily a problem with my unit, LMS 525c. I have checked all my connections, everything is showing OK on the Bus Network and I am stumped. I hate to lose though so will keep looking.
Sorry if this a repeat, but have you checked the software version on your LMS to see if it's the latest available? If not, update software. Might help, you never know!

If it is the latest, maybe try a "soft reset" as that will re-boot the software and it might sort the problem.

Lastly, maybe as others have said it's the EP60 that might be faulty. To check that, can you borrow someone's LMS or HDS unit and plug it in to your boat and see if it retains the data? That might at least show if the problem is definitely the LMS or the EP device.

One final thought - is the EP60 plugged directly into a network T piece? Or is it plugged into an extension cable and then that's plugged into a T piece? The reason is that good NMEA2K network design says that there should be no more than 6 meters between a device (ie the EP60) and a T piece. Can cause some weird data problems due to voltage drop, and this could explain why yours is not retaining tank size data. Outside chance, but worth checking.

This can be very frustrating. I went thru a similar issue with calibrating fuel flow in litres (metric system applies here in Australia) on my Suzuki NMEA2K network, Lowrance advisers had me checking everything that I'd done, basically assuming it was my problem/mistake and not their unit/software. But eventually it was proven to be a fault in the HDS software that only occurs when the units of measure is set to litres. They have promised to fix it in the next HDS software release.......But it took me over a year to prove that.

Cheers, and sorry for hijacking your thread with Dreamweaver's issues!

ML
Moonlighter475 is offline  
Old 10-25-2011, 05:21 AM
  #15  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

Originally Posted by Moonlighter475 View Post
Sorry if this a repeat, but have you checked the software version on your LMS to see if it's the latest available? If not, update software. Might help, you never know!
I have not checked the software version, this is my next step.

If it is the latest, maybe try a "soft reset" as that will re-boot the software and it might sort the problem.
I did a soft reset on the unit yesterday and it did not fix the problem

Lastly, maybe as others have said it's the EP60 that might be faulty. To check that, can you borrow someone's LMS or HDS unit and plug it in to your boat and see if it retains the data? That might at least show if the problem is definitely the LMS or the EP device.

My EP 60 works fine, it gives me MPG, Fuel flow, Seasonal totals, everything it is supposed to.

One final thought - is the EP60 plugged directly into a network T piece? Or is it plugged into an extension cable and then that's plugged into a T piece? The reason is that good NMEA2K network design says that there should be no more than 6 meters between a device (ie the EP60) and a T piece. Can cause some weird data problems due to voltage drop, and this could explain why yours is not retaining tank size data. Outside chance, but worth checking.
I do have the EP60 plugged into an extension cable but it is less than 6 meters, pretty sure it is the 15 foot extension cable.

This can be very frustrating. I went thru a similar issue with calibrating fuel flow in litres (metric system applies here in Australia) on my Suzuki NMEA2K network, Lowrance advisers had me checking everything that I'd done, basically assuming it was my problem/mistake and not their unit/software. But eventually it was proven to be a fault in the HDS software that only occurs when the units of measure is set to litres. They have promised to fix it in the next HDS software release.......But it took me over a year to prove that.

Cheers, and sorry for hijacking your thread with Dreamweaver's issues!

No problem, heck if he can get his problem solved that is great! That is what these forums are for.


ML
thanks,
super spook is offline  
Old 11-01-2011, 06:24 PM
  #16  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

Updated my head unit to the latest version, 2.5, and still have the problem. There has got to be a solution for this so I am still searching.
super spook is offline  
Old 11-01-2011, 09:31 PM
  #17  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 5,244
Default

I updated mine this year too and it didn't make a difference. I was actually at the marine electronics store talking about the unit and they called Navico or whatever it is called now. Navico said I couldn't display NMEA2K data on my unit at all. I tried to explain that I could with the update but they didn't believe me. The data displays fine but I don't have much faith that the manufacturer will be much help troubleshooting this if they don't even know their own product as well as a customer does.
DreamWeaver21 is offline  
Old 11-02-2011, 12:43 AM
  #18  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,932
Default

Superspook - have you checked the software version for the e-tec interface cable yet and verified with Lowrance that it's the latest release? I know we are grasping at straws here for the reason for the problem, but that would eliminate one more thing from the list of possibilities.....

Then, as per my post on BBC, the next thing is to change out the EP85r to see if it's faulty.

It's the old "process of elimination" I guess from here on.

Cheers

ML
Moonlighter475 is offline  
Old 11-02-2011, 08:50 AM
  #19  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Venice, FL
Posts: 1,901
Default

I had a very similar situation with mine, though I have an ETEC 200HO. I have an EP-85 which is a memory unit and I had connected an EP-65 which was a gas tank level sensor. I think the two of them were "arguing" on the NMEA2000 net which always resulted in a loss of gallons like you stated.

Originally, I thought that the EP-65 was level in the >>oil<< tank and configured it as such. Man, I was having low oil and high oil level alarms constantly AND simulataneously (duh!).

Once I realized the EP65 was gas tank, I doubted seriously that a level sensor would do as well in the sloshing around as the flow rate tracker would do. I disconnected the EP-65 and my problem with the gas tank capacity staying remembered went away pronto and has not recurred.

So to apply that in your case, is an EP-60 flow rate sensor required? Does your engine interface provide flow rate (as mine does in the ETEC) ? If so, perhaps there is a conflict between the two flow rate sensors (if you actually have flow rate reported by your engine, too.) As an experiment, you might try disconnecting the EP-60 and see what happens.
capecuddy is offline  
Old 11-02-2011, 05:35 PM
  #20  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 211
Default

I have a 2002 Yamaha motor so I can't interface to the motor, Yamaha did not start doing that until 2006. So to answer Cape Cuddy's question, the ep 60 is a flow sensor but I must have it to measure fuel flow since I can't get it from the motor.

Thanks again for your help ML, this has become a mission for me and while it is rare, I am not the only one to experience it. As soon as I figure it out I will post here and on BBC.
super spook is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread