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LMF-400 or HDS-10 MPG?

Old 09-22-2011, 09:35 AM
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Default LMF-400 or HDS-10 MPG?

Is it possible to get real-time MPG either through a LMF-400 page or an HDS-10 info screen?

On the LMF, I have a page that show SOG in MPH and Gal/Hr. Can I define a calculation that gives me real-time Miles per gallon?

I'm not thrilled with my mpg and as a new boater, I'm sure I'm a contributor to that. I'm getting about 2.8- 3 mpg with a ETEC 200HO and a Sea Hunt V225 wa. I spend a lot of time in no wake, then cruise around 4250 most of the rest of the time. Boat weight= 2700# dry hull, 503# engine, 91 gal tank usually full, maybe a hundred pounds of junk in all = about 4000#. Still trying to get a more natural feel for engine trim, but getting there.

Bottom painted....no trim tabs....radar arch with a usually open bimini top.
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Old 09-22-2011, 11:37 AM
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I have an LMF-400 and an HDS-7. I assume the GPH on the LMF is coming from the engines directly, or via flow sensors on the NMEA-2000 network.

In order for the unit to do the MPG, or NMPG, calculation you need an EP-85R Memory Module on the NMEA-2K network. Just add a "T", plug it in, and you will be able to have those calculations. You will also gain the ability to "fill your tank", then have the system keep track of total fuel used, and fuel remaining, until you "refill the tank".

Brian
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Old 09-22-2011, 12:37 PM
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I have an EP-85R and use it to keep flawless track of gas usage (I routinely am within 1 or 2 tenths on predicted fill-ups....apparently an unusual feat at the marina gas pump.

So are those calcs available in the "pre-defined screens" on LMF-400?

Thanks!
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Old 09-23-2011, 07:42 PM
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From page 11 of the LMF-400 manual:
Fuel Manager
The Fuel Manager page has a digital readout capable of displaying nine data types, including fuel flow, fuel used and fuel remaining.

From pages 35-36 of the manual:
Fuel Manager
The Fuel Manager page has three digital data boxes stacked one on top of the other. Each digital data box can display these data types: Fuel Flow, Fuel Economy, Fuel Remaining, Fuel Used, Fuel Range, Trip Fuel Used, Seasonal Fuel, Water Speed (Paddle Wheel Speed) and Ground Speed (GPS).
To customize the Fuel Manager Page:
1. Make sure the Fuel Manager page has been added to the page screen rotation.

2. Use the ENTER and EXIT keys to scroll the Fuel Manager page onto the main display.
3. Press MENU, select CUSTOMIZE and press ENTER. The data location menu will appear with three options: Top Data, Center Data and Bottom Data.
4. Highlight the desired data location and press ENTER. A list of data types will appear.
5. Select the desired data category and press ENTER. One of two things will happen, depending on the data category you selected.


A. If you chose Water Speed or Ground Speed, you will be taken back to the Data Location menu. Repeat Steps 4-5 for the other data locations you want to customize.
B. If you chose Fuel Flow, Fuel Economy, Fuel Remaining, Fuel Used, Fuel Range, Trip Fuel Used or Seasonal Fuel, you will be taken to the Select Engine menu which will have up to three options: Port, Center and Starboard. Select the engine you would like to use as the source for the data category you selected and press
ENTER. You will be taken back to the Data Location menu.

6. Repeat Steps 4 and 5 for each of the other data locations you want to customize. When all have been customized, press EXIT|EXIT to get back to the Fuel Manager page.

I have my Fuel Manager page set to show Fuel Flow (GPH), Fuel Economy (nmpg), and SOG (kts).

I have another page that has two digital windows, showing Fuel Used and Fuel Remaining.


In all cases, you have to set the system up so it knows number of engines and number of fuel tanks and total fuel capacity. If you have twin engines, then most of the data windows have to be set to read "Vessel" instead of "port" or "stbd", so the inputs are totaled.

Brian

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Old 09-24-2011, 08:06 AM
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Thanks! I got my LMF's set up now.

Next step the HDS-10....On data overlay for my chart screen, I added what was listed as Fuel Economy: ECOGPS, which I assume is miles per gal based on the GPS position movement. I selected it for the data overlay, it is on the chart screen now, but it doesn't show anything, while the LMF-400's happily show fuel economy in real-time.

I have found this to be one of the best indicators of optimum trim for my engine and the next result is that I'm now trimming higher than I used to. I used to stop around 20-22% up... now I'm finding incremental improvements and a "smoother sound" moving all the way up to 29%. Beyond that mpg slowly flags.

I'd like to get MPG live and active on the HDS overlay....can't seem to find any missing setup or configuration preventing it from working. Appreciate any and all ideas to bootstrap HDS ECOGPS into working for me!!
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Old 09-24-2011, 06:25 PM
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You will have to go into your data sources menu on the HDS and for fuel used, fuel remaining and fuel economy, set the data source as the EP85. If it's the same as my HDS5, you will be able to select fuel economy in mpg, the other way around etc.

That should sort it out.

Cheers from Aussie!

ML
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Old 09-25-2011, 04:58 AM
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Boat has to move to get data cant do it in the slip or driveway
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Old 09-25-2011, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by TerryS View Post
Boat has to move to get data cant do it in the slip or driveway
Normally, I'd agree of course, but the LMF page was dancing the MPG around at "tenths of MPG" as I sat in the slip and then would go on to give me the real deal when I went out. The HDS ECOGPS never moved off of - - - at any time.
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Old 09-25-2011, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Moonlighter475 View Post
You will have to go into your data sources menu on the HDS and for fuel used, fuel remaining and fuel economy, set the data source as the EP85. If it's the same as my HDS5, you will be able to select fuel economy in mpg, the other way around etc.

That should sort it out.

Cheers from Aussie!

ML
For fuel, I do tend to use the LMF gauges as I like the HDS for a big chart view. I'm trying to focus on Trim and MPG with an eye toward improving both, so I have them parked with medium sized font in the upper right of my chart screen.

I'll check out the data sources.....seems like I've been living in those screens and can never come up with anything actionable in them. Will try your suggestion. EP85 is the only fuel source I have connected to the network. I realized that my EP-65 level sensor was in the gas tank, not in the oil tank as I'd thought. (Boy did that give me crazy alarms!) I disconnected the EP-65 as it was always sloshing around.

Maybe it works better in Oz, like the water in drains spinning in the opposite direction?

Thanks!
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Old 09-26-2011, 12:12 AM
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I solved the HDS-10 MPG display issue.....I had to find and select the ECO GPS data source while the engine was keyed ON. The LMF-400 wasn't that fussy.
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Old 09-26-2011, 12:59 AM
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Ah yes, good work. Its probably because the NMEA2K network and EP85 need power to be on in order to retain changed settings. Works just like that here in the southern hemisphere Aussie, too

Just be warned though - I recommend that you should not use the HDS to recalibrate your fuel flow/fuel used when you refill the tank.

You may have seen my other post where we have pretty well proven (after 12 month's frustration) that that the recal equation in the HDS software is faulty. We showed that doing the fuel recalibrate process on the HDS resulted in fuel flow readings around 3 x the actual flow. But when we connected an LMS400 and did the recal process on that, it worked perfectly. Seems to do this both with engine interfaces and EP fuel flow meters.

Update: found out yesterday from Lowrance that the recal equation on the HDS units works ok when you are using US measures (eg gallons, mpg, miles) but the problem described above happens when you use metric measures like we do here in Australia (litres, km/litre, kilometers). Sounds like someone copied the recal equation for gallons into the metric section in the software....

The matter has been reported to Lowrance here in Aus and the US with all details necessary to enable them to pinpoint and resulve the problem. They are giving it the mirror treatment... "we are looking into it" , we can only hope they fix it in the next HDS software update.

Cheers

ML

Last edited by Moonlighter475; 09-30-2011 at 03:32 AM.
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Old 09-26-2011, 08:51 AM
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I hit the "Refill Tank" button on the LMF-400's when I gas up....it's so easy that way.

At first, I thought I wasted my money getting 2 LMF-400's in addition to the HDS. Now I'm sure I did not. THe LMF's are just simpler for certain functions and it allows me to focus my 10 inch display on Chart with Radar.
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Old 09-26-2011, 05:35 PM
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Capecuddy - I am tending to agree with you that it would be nicer to have the engine data on a separate gauge.

At the moment I just have the 2 x HDS5's on my network with the Suzuki engine interface. One screen I use as a sounder, the other, GPS.

Of course you can select the data screen on either unit to show engine data, or put the particular engine or fuel data items you want to watch on any screen using overlay, but....

I have the Suzuki analogue gauges (speedo, tach, trim) and am starting to think about removing the speedo, and putting an LMS400 or the SMIS equivalent gauge in there instead.

Cheers

ML
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