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Boat picked out, Now the electronics

Old 01-03-2003, 06:16 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

O.K., After about 2 years of research I found the boat I can be happy with. It is the Hydrasport 2800 Vector. It will have twin Yamaha 250HPDI and every option that Hydrasport offers. It will be about 105,000. This is my dream boat. Will order when I move to Florida in 3-4 Months.
I will be boating with the family near Melbourne, Florida and will be traveling offshore, fishing in the same area. I will take the occational trip to to the Bahamas and the Keys.

I know I need the following:
Color Fishfinder
GPS Chartplotter
VHS Radio
Radar (would like it even though don't need it)

Was thinking about going with Raymarine all around because of their reputation. Am I leaving anything out? Any suggestions other than this equiptment?
Thanks in advance

[This message was edited by Saltwater Fishin on 01-03-03 at 10:06 PM.]
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Old 01-03-2003, 06:48 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

would stay away from raymarine. Bought out a few years ago and since themn i would no longer trust them. If you look at most larger boats and this includes charter captains i would use Furuno. I have the new navnet, 1833 with 10.4 inch screen, combo unit. It has the radar and chart plotter and the box with a 1kw fishfinder. IT comes with a 4kw 24" dome that if you know how to use it i have been able to see bird 20 miles away on it. great unit. I have a 23 regulator and it being a center console, you have to worry about the sun. Not with this one. go look at it. you will not be dispointed
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Old 01-03-2003, 08:29 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

Flounder who was Raymarine bought out by?

I just bought their GPS (Raychart 425), and the manual still says Raytheon is still the parent company.
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Old 01-03-2003, 10:53 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

If you don't think you need a radar why not put an autopilot on it instead? Both are items you will wonder how you lived without once you have them. But I find myself pushing buttons on the autopilot more than on the radar.
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Old 01-04-2003, 04:49 AM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

If you have room for them, I would mount a Furuno 1833C 4kW radar, get the "black box" sounder module with a 1kW high performance transducer (see if you can get the factory to glass in a mounting recess in the keel for you since you will be ordering the boat). This will give you a terrific color radar and fishfinder. Then put a Garmin 2010C next to it to use a GPS/plotter (yes, I know the Furuno can be used as a plotter, but it is a lousy one and you don't want all your navigation eggs in one basket).

Definitely spring for an autopilot, as yachtjim said, you will not understand how you lived without it. Go for a Simrad AP-11 with the rate sensor compass option and you can use radar/chart overlay on the Furuno.

I have heard very mixed reviews on the Raymarine equipment and certainly there is no reason to stick with a single manufacturer.

Also read the "Northstar 958" thread -- might want to consider that as well. Then you could skip the Garmin 2010.
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Old 01-04-2003, 08:38 AM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

RAYMARINE was not bought out, per se, but was set up as it's own corporation with recreational consumer electronics as its focus.

The Raytheon Corp lost a lot of it stock market value and had problems with debt back around 1999. The CEO at that time declared that Raytheon would focus it's operations on defense development. A few of the suits in charge of the recreational marine division, persuaded the right people to let them go their own way as a stand alone operation, separate from the Raytheon Group. They are presently surviving on investments made by Mercury Capital Management. The company now known as RAYMARINE has its head quarters in Portsmouth, UK with 2 additional locations in Nashua, NH and a development operation in Ft. Lauderdale.
The severance was not immediate in that the parent group, Raytheon, helped with development and underwriting of some of the newer technology such as their PATHFINDER radar. This project might not have made it into the recreational market except for the fact that the Dept Of Defense gave it a "thumbs down". So it was infused into the recreational area. The last strings connecting the parent to the child organization were cut in early 2001 when they officially became RAYMARINE. This corporation became proficient and profitable in outsourcing their componentry. The old HUGHES corp was taken over by them which included a large network of companies that produce printed circuit boards. For a while (they still might), the main chassis and components for RAY's radar product came from JRC. Gone are the days when you could buy a Ray product and say that it is made by the same guys who contol our ICBMs !

SALTWATER Fishin-

The state of current technology, features and reliability has created what I think (IMO) is the following “Can’t Miss’ list of electronics equipment:

1. Depth/Fish Finder: Go FURUNO
2. Radar: Go FURUNO
3. GPS/Chartplotter: Go Garmin
4. VHF Radio: Go ICOM
5. VHF Antenna: Go DIGITAL

That being said, I have the FURUNO 1732C NAVNET with C-MAP and Black Box Sounder. I also have the GARMIN 2010C GPS Chartplotter.

Why do I have the GARMIN even though there is WAAS enabled gps in the NAVNET?

For one, I like the redundancy. Above and beyond that, comparing the GARMIN to the FURUNO GPS is no contest… the FURUNO is TERRIBLE!! (RAYMARINE is about as bad from the 2 I have operated)

The redraw rate is agonizingly slow (and hair raising), satellite acquisition is slow and somewhat unreliable (I have experienced brief intermittent signal loss while the GARMIN still received), the detail is nowhere near as nice nor as current with C-Map as with the Blue Charts and the blue charts are cheaper for my area.

Both the FURUNO and RAYMARINE have the ability to overlay the radar and Chart screen, which is a nice feature when in poor visibility situations. But both require an external heading sensor (electronic azimuth compass) to do this . The GARMIN unit has a built in heading sensor and an NMEA output that I have tied to the FURUNO allowing overlay. This would also work for the RAYMARINE, thus avoiding additional expense of about $300 for a sensor. (An output from an autopilot would work as well).

The NAVNET uses time tested, dependable, plug-and-play ETHERNET hub technology. (Hub is only required if you are setting up multiple stations, not needed for a single station). The “Sea Talk” and HSB2 technology leaves a lot to be desired in that it is more complex and costly (cables required are additional and costlier than standard ETERNET hubs and cables) and performance and reliability are unproven.

Reading here and on a number of other forums, there are many more RAY units going back for warranty issues than there are FURUNO units. And it is not just screen fogging and visuals. I have seen issues with cold start problems, satellite acquisition or loss of signal that is repetitive and long term, antenna problems, and power-offs for unexplained reasons.

The FURUNO is not as intuitive, easy to navigate or follow manuals as the RAYMARINES are. Customer service for boith companies is excellent with easy access, courteous, knowledgeable service and 24/7 coverage. Phone contact is much more satisfactory than the e-mail approach.

Finally, as Flounder mentioned, go to a marina where there are a number of Charter and Commercial boats. Tell me what you see mounted on the vast majority of those boats.

Hope this helps.

TSLTW
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Old 01-04-2003, 11:16 AM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

When you are taking about the antenna, you say go digital. If I was to buy the ICOM IC-M502

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...sp=wa#relatedp

Does it have a antenna in it? If not can you direct me to the proper antenna for this unit.
Sorry but new at this electronics stuff. I used my last boat on a lake in NY where I didn't need any of this stuff.

Thanks
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Old 01-04-2003, 11:56 AM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

Saltwater Fishin when you get to Melbourne, go to Bethel Marine and talk to Rich. I live up the road in Cocoa and grew up in the Melbourne area. Bethel prices can't be beat and it is a local business. Bought my Furuno 600L from them.

http://www.bethel-marine.com/
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Old 01-04-2003, 12:19 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

Thanks for the info. they do sell hundreds of dollars less than West Marine. I will go see him when I get the boat. With all the products I am going to buy I might even do better than the store prices.
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Old 01-04-2003, 01:09 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

Saltwater, when you decide what you are getting, you should contact a couple of the big mail order places, especially Consumers Marine Electronics. They will give you a "package" price that can be quite a but less than their single item prices. Even West Marine and Boat/US will do this, though they usually are less competitive. The local guy might be willing to meet the price once you have them in hand.

Don't forget to take into consideration the large sales tax savings from buying out of state from a place like Consumers. They will usually ship a big order for free as well.

Big E, I agree 100%. The GPS/plotter function on the NavNet units (I have an 1833C) absolutely sucks. Mine is a Navionics and if it makes you feel better, it is just a awful and the C-Map for redraw.

It's really mystifying how Furuno could do such an excellent job on the radar and sounder functions and botch the plotter.
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Old 01-04-2003, 02:59 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

SF, you will need to buy an antenna for that unit. Here are two places you can consider ordering from: Consumer Marine Electronics and Defender.

Next you will have to decide what length. Do a search within this Electronics Forum and you will find several discussions about this issue.

Re the radar, we have one and do not use it everytime we fish. However, the first time you need it, you will be glad you spent the money.

Two quick stories: One morning we went out fishing and it looked foggy off the coast. We have gone out in it before and you could still see hundreds of yards until you broke through it. This time, we hit it and you could not see 30 feet. I looked up at the radar and drove right back home. That same morning, my friend beached his Blackfin after getting disoriented ($$$$).

Second story, we were out tuna fishing late one afternoon. We decided what time we would leave, as we prefer to not motor at dark. Problem was the watch we were relying on was almost an hour off. On the way in, we were glad to have the radar.

Anything can happen, you loose an engine and limp home on one, hook a large fish late, it gets rough and you have to come in slow. My advice is get the radar (safety) before the autopilot (convenience).
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Old 01-04-2003, 04:12 PM
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Saltwater-

Here is the URl for the DIGITAL Antennas.

http://www.digitalantenna.com/vhf500.html

You want to get their 500 series. I assume that you should have room for the 8 foot whip, which is the one that you should get.

I had thought about a DIGITAL . Halfway through this past summer, my friend broke his Shakesapeare and I suggested that he replace it with a DIGITAl. The best move he made! Side by side, the quality of construction and craftmanship is obvious. The proof was in the performance, where it should be! In known areas , he had an increase in audio quality and strength across the board. His receiving sensitivity increased as well.

I am currently doing a price shopping comparison, and Bethel Marine has the lowest price on the 8 ft at 107.95, Consumer has it for 135.00, Broken Leg DAve at 119.00 and DB Marine at 133.03.

Great choice on the Icom 502! Bethel is almost the lowest on that unit at 276.95, D & B has it for 276.43, Broken Leg Dave at 277 and Consumers at 289. There is a retailer on E-Bay that regularly auctions them wioth a "Buy Now" price of $269.95.

All of the above mentioned dealers (excepting the one on E-Bay) are top shelf in service, knowledge and reliability. Fast shipping and good return policies. I have purchased from them all. Consumers has an extremely knowledgeable and helpful staff, but it looks as if they are beginnng to charge for it in their pricing. Last year they were way more competitive than this!

Several RO's on this forum have also recommended 3- Rivers Marine Electronics, so put that on your list of prospective suppliers.

Hope this helps!

TSLTW
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Old 01-05-2003, 06:51 AM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

Our price for the M-502 is lower than all the above mentioned. We also carry Digital antennas.

I agree completely with Ed's list of "can't miss" items. The only change I would make is to also include Northstar in your list of GPS/chartplotters.

BTW, what is an RO?
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Old 01-05-2003, 04:27 PM
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Default Boat picked out, Now the electronics

I have been using raymarine electronics for the last 4 years (two different sets of elec.) and have never had a problem. Not saying they do not have problems, just a bit of personal experience. If you have not been to the website it is simply www.raymarine.com

PJ
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