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furuno 582

Old 11-24-2003, 04:58 PM
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Hello all, I have a furuno 582l and I'm having trouble finding fish and structure on the manual mode, can anyone give me a hand. Thanks Bart
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Old 11-25-2003, 05:15 AM
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Having trouble spotting fish on what kind of boat in how deep water which is salt or fresh using what sort of transducer mounted where on the boat while moving or not moving and if moving at what speeds, and by the way, what frequency are you using? There is more to this than meets the eye ....

Thom
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Old 11-26-2003, 04:02 AM
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I have it installed on a proline center console 24' boat, I use it in the Gulf of Mexico off the coast of Florida. It is used in salt water and I have a transducer mounted on the rear of the transom, I can't seem to get a good picture of the bottom or able to spot fish in thwe manual mode, it doesn't seem to matter if I moving or sitting still. When I go the the auto mode and I seem to get a pretty good picture. When I'm on the move I usually use the "cruising mode" in the auto setting. Also what is a good speed to run the picture speed as it runs across the screen? I have been using the 5o hz for water deeper than 50-60' and the 200 hz for shallower water. Thanks
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Old 11-26-2003, 05:41 AM
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OK,

That's a very good start.

First thing is this, you have got it right that the lower 50 kHz frequency is to be used for deeper water and the 200 for shallower water, its just that your definition of deep and shallow is not what Furuno had in mind. Keep it in the 200 kHz setting until you are in water up to about 250 feet, not 50 feet. Furuno thinks that anything less than something like 250~300 feet is shallow, that machine thinks a thousand feet is deep, but not too deep for its capability.

The next question deals with your transducer mounting, I know the question doesn't sound pertinent, but it is. Do you loose depth readings when the boat is up and running, and if so at roughly what speed? Loss of bottom at low speeds tends to point at a transducer that is not well aligned.

For the moment, at least until you are sure that everything is lined up about right don't use the manual mode. Put it into automatic, on the fishing setting when you are not up on plane, and in the cruising setting when you are not.

About the screen advance rate, make it as fast as it will go and then generally leave it alone. It will slow down automatically as you move up through the range scales into deeper water. By the way, have you messed with the factory preset range scales? I ask because they are much much more important to you enjoying the use of the depth finder than just about any other setup adjustment you can make.

Also, how deep is the deepest water you normally find yourself in?

Thom
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Old 11-26-2003, 09:58 AM
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Dittos on what Thom said. When in the Manual Mode, I up the gain until I've got blue starting to appear over the screen (I use the white background).

Thom, I've never run fast screen, just about 1/4 speed. Maybe I'll give that a spin and try to relearn which signatures mean what.
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Old 11-26-2003, 11:05 AM
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Nimrod,

Each range scale has a maximum redraw rate at which it can operate. The redraw slows down as you get deeper. A couple of other things are controled by the range scale as well, among them pulse repitition rate and pulse duration. It is the reduction of the pulse repitition rate that govern's the automaic screen advance and establishes the maximum rate even if you are in manual mode. So one of the tricks to getting the most out of your machne is to set the range scales so that the breaks are just blow the changover points for those parameters. As luck would have it the standard factory settings break right at those depths so sometimes you can use some of the factory settings and just put in, or leave out, intermitent range scales not so much with the usual intent of avoiding a jump when you are in need of the machine (I'll explain) but more to control the internal parameters of the machine.

Now, here's what I meant. Lets say you pass through some shole water on your way off shore. Lets say the water depth drops all the way down to 10 feet with deeper water on both sides. You would not want your lowest depth range set at 12 feet in such a circumstance because what would happen is that comming into the shole from deeper water just when the bottom became of greatest importance to you (avoiding groundings and such as that) your machine would go off searching for bottom. How many times has your machine lost bottom just when you needed it most? When that happens it is almost always the result of poor planning on depth range selection. You need to bracket the depth's which are of greatest importance to you with the ranges you choose. Now add to that the factory settings which often coincide with shifts in the repition rate or pulse length and you find that you may need to end you brackets of range lower than you might have desired in order to hold the more desirable characteristics of the machine. Somehow I don't think I'm explaining this very well.

Maybe this will help. Lets say that your depth machine can only use its fastest screen redraw rate if its shortest pulse repitition rate is in effect, which would be coupled with its shortest pulse duration. These would only work in shallow water, lets say at a maximum of 10 feet. The factory setting on the bottom machine might have a default lowest range scale of 7 feet, which is fine, and allows everything to work at its most efficient. But lets also say that you have to pass over some 10 feet deep water, say a reef, so you have changed that first range to top out at 15 feet. You do this so your machine doesn't wonder off and start looking for bottom just as you pass over a reef. The problem is that you are now outside of the first set of parameters for pulse repition and duration, so both of them are increased automatically by the machine. Because of the range scale you set you will never be able to take advantage of some of the machne's shallow water capability because you are using a depth for your lowest range scale outside of the bracket in which they can work.

I think a lot of cases where you see guys complain about not being able to read in shallow water comes from this problem. Personally I avoid it by decreasing the first range scale bo less than the factory setting and then makeing the second one wider than normal, running right up to the next parameter break, usually around 30 feet or so.

At any rate you can determine where all of this stuff happens with your machine in simulator mode. Just keep bumping up the ranges until the machine slows down, that will show you the break points.

Am I making any sense at all out of this. Its a little hard to describe.

Thom
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Old 11-28-2003, 07:38 AM
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Thanks Thom, for some advise, I have not adjusted the factory presets on depth, I lose sight of the bottom mostly on a planc, my boat cruises about 40 mph, but sometimes when moving slow, not very often. I fish mostly in the Gulf of Mexico, which the deepest is about 200', but at times I do fish off the other coast of Florida whne the water depth drops to over 5oo ft. I will try these things mentioned tomorrow when we go out for awhile and play with it. I will keep it in the auto mode, but would like to get to use it in the manual mode when it is all said and done. Thnaks Thom and Nimrood!
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Old 11-28-2003, 10:36 AM
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Well,

On a much more practicle level here's what I think you should do. Put it into 200 kHz and then get the boat doing what you do with it (cruise or troll or drift or whatever) with the finder in the automatic mode. That is only to find the bottom and let it pick a range scale for you. Then flip it over to manual mode and turn the gain all the way up. What you'll probably see is a distinguishable bottom and then a lot of 'snow' and then the top. Start turning down the gain slowly and what you will see beginning to happen is that the 'snow' will begin to go away. Once about 90% of the snow has been removed by reducing gain you are right about where you want to be for general use.

If you bottom fish you need to start playing with the bottom lock and maybe range shifting to focus on the bottom but on a more basic level you will use more gain than had you been moving.

Think about turning the gain up and down as being the same thing as turning the volume on a hearing aid up or down. The gain doesn't have any effect on how my power the machine is putting out, what it does is really the opposite of that. What its actually doing is turning up its hearing sensitivity so that it can hear more faint sounds.

So in short use the automatic feature to get you to a comfortable range scale and then begin your experimentation with the machine by using gain adjustments. Once that feels good and comfortable for you then start considering using some of the more advance features like the zoom cabibilites. Finally there are some other feature that you might want to make use of. One of them that is often used by the freshwater guys is chaning the display colors for certain strengths of response. This allows the user to light up a hard bottom that has some sort of cover of softer material and can go a long way towards finding fish in dense structure.

There is another matter worth mentioning as well. That is the loss of bottom when under way. You wouldn't have to search long or hard on the internet to find someone who had posted that their XYZ Fishfinder, model 12345, is a piece of crap because it won't read bottom at any speed greater than 2 mph or something very similar. Two or three other guys repsond to his post by saying that their piece of crap does exactly the same thing and as far as they are concernced anyone who buys anything by XYZ is an utter moron and those who buy the 12345 Model deserve castration. No kidding, you see these threads all the time. The problem with them is that loss of bottom at speed is almost never the fault of the fish finder. Even the lowest of the low in fish finders will hold bottom at reasonable speeds if the right style of transducer is used for the situation and its been well mounted. Loss of bottom under way is almost always the result of the transducer placement. By the way, a very well mounted transducer installation, professionally done, all neat and proper, stands the same chance of working as does one that some drunk hung on the back of the boat with a hammer and nails. Really, its more a matter of luck in the placement than it is skill in the mounting. That's a hard pill for some folks to swallow.

Thom
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Old 12-01-2003, 12:21 PM
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Thanks for the explanation, Thom.... believe I've got a grasp of it. Let's see, where's that dern manual.

Sorry it took so long to get back, been away gaining a few pounds.
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