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DeSantis calls for SouthFL water managers to resign

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DeSantis calls for SouthFL water managers to resign

Old 01-11-2019, 09:10 AM
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Default DeSantis calls for SouthFL water managers to resign

I didn't see commentary on this yesterday. This seems like a good development.


After a whirlwind day visiting both coasts to announce sweeping measures to address the state’s environmental woes, Florida’s new governor demanded water managers overseeing efforts to fix the Everglades step down on Thursday.

At an afternoon meeting in Stuart, Gov. Ron DeSantis said he wanted the nine-member board at the South Florida Water Management District to resign because he believed they failed to understand the toll endured by communities by repeated algae blooms triggered by dirty lake water released into coastal rivers.

“I just want good people who are willing to do the right thing,” he said.

Board members infuriated the new governor in November when they voted to extend a lease to sugar farmers two days after the election. News of the pending vote was posted the night before a district field meeting in Miami, with less than 12 hours notice. U.S. Rep. Brian Mast, R-Palm City, who headed up DeSantis’ environmental transition team, raced down to the meeting and urged board members to put off the vote to give the new governor time to review the matter. But they refused.
Article: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/loc...224239310.html
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:23 AM
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Everyone around here is not holding their breath for this to happen. Demanding they resign, isn't the same as removing them. We shall see how this plays out. Being this is his first act after taking office, he better follow through. Folks will think this is just another political stunt, and nothing with any teeth to it if he gets nothing done to help clean up the water.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:49 AM
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Water managers are not the main problem. Army corps of engineers are the REAL bad guys.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Water managers are not the main problem. Army corps of engineers are the REAL bad guys.
Can the CoE just come in and manage the water in your state, or do they do it by invitation??
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by km1125 View Post
Can the CoE just come in and manage the water in your state, or do they do it by invitation??
Seems they created all the problems in the first place. They built the dyke around Lake O. They control the opening and closings of the locks. They control the flow of water south from Orlando. They have the ultimate authority over MAJOR issues, and the water managers work around what the corps does. I wish it was invitation, but they have ultimate authority and arrogantly do what they want.

The ACOE is also mostly responsible for screwing up our beaches, but that's another issue.

NO! single entity has done as much damage to the Florida environment as the ACOE.
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:21 AM
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I think it's a great 1st step. We've been fed dis-information on this for years. The Kissimmee Basin is no longer Everglades but suburbs and golf courses. UCF is the largest school in the country. Everyone keeps visiting Disney / Kissimmee and our environment cannot handle it.
The lake water is the result of what happens NORTH of the lake. The discussions about releasing the excess rain run off South or East or West does NOT address the problem. We need to stop all fertilization of what was once, the Kissimmee basin area.
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Special K III View Post
I think it's a great 1st step. We've been fed dis-information on this for years. The Kissimmee Basin is no longer Everglades but suburbs and golf courses. UCF is the largest school in the country. Everyone keeps visiting Disney / Kissimmee and our environment cannot handle it.
The lake water is the result of what happens NORTH of the lake. The discussions about releasing the excess rain run off South or East or West does NOT address the problem. We need to stop all fertilization of what was once, the Kissimmee basin area.
Bingo. Unfortunately, DeSantis needs to go to the federal level. SFWMD really means "Sugar Funded Water Management District".
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Seems they created all the problems in the first place. They built the dyke around Lake O. They control the opening and closings of the locks. They control the flow of water south from Orlando. They have the ultimate authority over MAJOR issues, and the water managers work around what the corps does. I wish it was invitation, but they have ultimate authority and arrogantly do what they want.

The ACOE is also mostly responsible for screwing up our beaches, but that's another issue.

NO! single entity has done as much damage to the Florida environment as the ACOE.
I don't doubt that what they did there caused issues. I'm just wondering if they were invited in by the state and told to fix some problem. Then the fix for that problem caused a bunch of other issues.

We had dikes put in around here a couple decades ago by the CoE, but they were requested by the state and local officials to come in and do SOMETHING, as folks were getting flooded out. A few years later, everyone was complaining about the 'ruined view' of the lake because of those "ugly dikes", so they tore them all down.
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by km1125 View Post
I don't doubt that what they did there caused issues. I'm just wondering if they were invited in by the state and told to fix some problem. Then the fix for that problem caused a bunch of other issues.

We had dikes put in around here a couple decades ago by the CoE, but they were requested by the state and local officials to come in and do SOMETHING, as folks were getting flooded out. A few years later, everyone was complaining about the 'ruined view' of the lake because of those "ugly dikes", so they tore them all down.
The ACOE came in the late 1920's, staked their claim, and never left. They were NOT invited to come, but they are invited to leave. "Flood control" was a federal issue. The Everglades, being a national park, is a federal issue, out of state level control. Navigable waterways are pretty much a Federal issue. It's amazing that the ACOE can screw something up in a few short years, but it takes them decades to fix their screw-ups, if they ever do fix them.
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Old 01-11-2019, 01:13 PM
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Hmmm... so there's some so-so info in this thread.

1) DeSantis absolutely did a great thing by saying bye-bye to those people. Excellent first step.
2) The Army Core came in because we wanted to do certain things that we sort of didn't want to pay for -- so we got the feds to do it. (I dumb'ed it down)...
3) We can't say by to the Army Core because of all sorts of crazy rules (National Park, Indians, etc.) -- so now we're stuck.

What we *can* do is use the voice of the people to direct our leaders to force the issue of what we want. The only people that care about the environment in Florida (really care, not the crazy tree-hugger types) are the taxpaying people that understand that it is our mainstay to avoid State taxes and other crappy taxes. Make this clear: without our water-based tourism, we'd be a shit-hole. Clear and simple. If tomorrow our oceans and waterways turned into Newark, NJ we'd be ruined. Not everyone cares... and the ones that don't care are the ones that make money by doing so.

DeSantis gets this... and I sincerely believes he'll navigate it.
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Old 01-11-2019, 03:38 PM
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Fired Beruff( a sarasota land developer) from FWC plus 80 more appointments Scott made at end of his term. Off to good start
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Old 01-11-2019, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Goalmon View Post
Fired Beruff( a sarasota land developer) from FWC plus 80 more appointments Scott made at end of his term. Off to good start
Great news Beruff isn’t in the mix anymore. Scott was a shady MFer
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Water managers are not the main problem. Army corps of engineers are the REAL bad guys.
The Army Corp may be bad the the Water Board's blatant move outlined in this article shows they are as bad as they come. Water Managers Renew Sugar Company's Lease On Land Slated For Everglades Reservoir Project | WLRN

Florida taxpayers deserve much better from local officials.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Water managers are not the main problem. Army corps of engineers are the REAL bad guys.
Originally Posted by km1125 View Post
Can the CoE just come in and manage the water in your state, or do they do it by invitation??

The COE is charged with enforcing The Clean Water Act, which gives them jurisdiction over "the waters of the United States". What does that include, you may ask? Well up here in coal country where I live, they have tried to stretch the definition to the max. Waters of the US is any place where two drops of water join, then move. So, to answer your question, they don't need an invitation.

And it was the implementation of the Clean Water Act that halted virtually all waterfront development in the state of Florida and elsewhere during the 1980s. In order to dredge and fill (think canals, channels) you have to get a COE dredge permit. Look at an arial photo/map of the Keys and you will see many half-finished developments grown over. Its what stopped the Mackle Brothers from finishing their plans on Marco Island.
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Last edited by Cat-a-holic; 01-12-2019 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:08 PM
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DeSantis, about whom I was very skeptical, is off to a FANTASTIC start. The environmental damage that Scott and his cronies did to our waterways over the past 8 years is beyond criminal and amoral. And DeSantis is right to try to flush Scott's sewage out and put in some people who might actually do something to begin to repair Scott's carnage. Hopefully, he'll be able to resist the sweet temptation of Big Sugar's bribery machine. At least he's talking the right talk and taking the right first steps. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I have never seen a more corrupt and disengenuous group than the South Florida Water Management District Board so off with their heads.
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Old 01-12-2019, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Cat-a-holic View Post
The COE is charged with enforcing The Clean Water Act, which gives them jurisdiction over "the waters of the United States". What does that include, you may ask? Well up here in coal country where I live, they have tried to stretch the definition to the max. Waters of the US is any place where two drops of water join, then move. So, to answer your question, they don't need an invitation.

And it was the implementation of the Clean Water Act that halted virtually all waterfront development in the state of Florida and elsewhere during the 1980s. In order to dredge and fill (think canals, channels) you have to get a COE dredge permit. Look at an arial photo/map of the Keys and you will see many half-finished developments grown over. Its what stopped the Mackle Brothers from finishing their plans on Marco Island.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Why are our east coast Florida beaches eroding at an accelerated rate? No, NOT "rising sea level". It's stabilized inlets. There's only ONE "natural" inlet left on the east coast..Matanzas. Use it as a benchmark to compare the drastic erosion at the other inlets. BTW, the ACOE designed and supervised this boondoggle.
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Old 01-13-2019, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Why are our east coast Florida beaches eroding at an accelerated rate? No, NOT "rising sea level". It's stabilized inlets. There's only ONE "natural" inlet left on the east coast..Matanzas. Use it as a benchmark to compare the drastic erosion at the other inlets. BTW, the ACOE designed and supervised this boondoggle.


What is the connection between stabilized inlets and beach erosion? Not doubting you, just never heard of that. And by stablized inlet, do you mean jettys and the like? Just curious.

Humans have altered the landscape since they became part of the planet, even going back thousands of years here in the Americas to an extent that most today would find surprising. Much of the hysteria we hear today about damage to the environment is over-wrought. If we'd had the same attitudes and regs 50-75 years ago, about 80% of the infrastructure and development we all now enjoy would not exist. As George Carlin told us, "The planet is fine...."


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Old 01-13-2019, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Cat-a-holic View Post
What is the connection between stabilized inlets and beach erosion? Not doubting you, just never heard of that. And by stablized inlet, do you mean jettys and the like? Just curious.

Humans have altered the landscape since they became part of the planet, even going back thousands of years here in the Americas to an extent that most today would find surprising. Much of the hysteria we hear today about damage to the environment is over-wrought. If we'd had the same attitudes and regs 50-75 years ago, about 80% of the infrastructure and development we all now enjoy would not exist. As George Carlin told us, "The planet is fine...."


https://youtu.be/7W33HRc1A6c
No problem, Cat.

Beach erosion (beach mechanics). Florida east coast. Sand from ground up mountains washes down the rivers from north Carolina south, and is deposited on the beaches. This sand slowly marches south, due to wave action and a weak but prevalent southerly longshore current. This true beach material also moves in and out along the beach in the high energy surf zone. A stabilized (jettys and channeled) inlet blocks this sand on the north side, where it builds up and eventually washes around the outer end, where the high velocity currents either carry the sand in, or out, where it is lost forever from the system. Beaches on the south of the jetties erode, and those beach sands continue their travel south. Eventually so much sand is trapped and lost that all the beaches erode. It's a little more complicated than that, but that's the basics. ALL these stabilized inlets are designed and controlled by the ACOE.

"Beach sand" is NOT found offshore, as the ACOE likes to think... nothing out there but ground up shells and fish poop. Dirt! Surprisingly, the ACOE only has a couple decades experience in "beach renourishment". They think this stuff is what beaches are made of. Our once pristine beaches here are downright nasty...dark, coarse sand, steep beaches, no or few beach critters.

Questions?

Bill
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Old 01-13-2019, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
No problem, Cat.

Beach erosion (beach mechanics). Florida east coast. Sand from ground up mountains washes down the rivers from north Carolina south, and is deposited on the beaches. This sand slowly marches south, due to wave action and a weak but prevalent southerly longshore current. This true beach material also moves in and out along the beach in the high energy surf zone. A stabilized (jettys and channeled) inlet blocks this sand on the north side, where it builds up and eventually washes around the outer end, where the high velocity currents either carry the sand in, or out, where it is lost forever from the system. Beaches on the south of the jetties erode, and those beach sands continue their travel south. Eventually so much sand is trapped and lost that all the beaches erode. It's a little more complicated than that, but that's the basics. ALL these stabilized inlets are designed and controlled by the ACOE.

"Beach sand" is NOT found offshore, as the ACOE likes to think... nothing out there but ground up shells and fish poop. Dirt! Surprisingly, the ACOE only has a couple decades experience in "beach renourishment". They think this stuff is what beaches are made of. Our once pristine beaches here are downright nasty...dark, coarse sand, steep beaches, no or few beach critters.
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"Questions?" Yes.

So what's the solution? Get rid of stabilized inlets and lose all those harbors to civilization?
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Old 01-13-2019, 03:39 PM
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Anyone taking bets on if he outs Runcie too? He won't get hit with the race card since he removed a white Sheriff and put in an African American one... so -- he can easily say bye to Runcie.

The guy is very smart. I am hopeful that he does right by the great State!
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