Go Back  The Hull Truth - Boating and Fishing Forum > BOATING FORUMS > Dockside Chat
Reload this Page >

You have to laugh so you donít cry. Are people really that stupid???

Notices
Like Tree146Likes

You have to laugh so you donít cry. Are people really that stupid???

Old 02-13-2019, 11:35 AM
  #121  
Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 50
Default

Originally Posted by OldPete View Post
Was just reading an article... people are very upset that their income tax return is going to be much smaller this year!

You see, if their total withholding was $5000 and they would get a $2000 refund. They were happy.

Apparently, now their total withholding was $3000 and they are only getting a $1000 refund and they are angry that they are getting $1k less.

I was floored.

This is why I am against withholdings period. If each person had to write a check at the end of the year/month for the full amount of their taxes they would damn sure start to care a lot more about where and how that money was being spent. The way it is now most folks never see the withheld amount in their checking accounts and don't feel like they ever earned it or had to pay it.
Seacat FL and OldPete like this.
cohea is offline  
Old 02-13-2019, 11:42 AM
  #122  
Senior MemberCaptains Club MemberPLEDGER
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Lancaster , RIC VA
Posts: 8,303
Default

Originally Posted by OldPete View Post
I find it comical that I can be bashed for pointing out how stupid it is to be upset that your taxes went down.

THT never ceases to amaze me.

I almost wonder how many stupids could not do the basic math to figure out the issue.

Whatís next?? Someone upset that gas isnít $20 gal.?


obama said he thought it should be in the ď$5.00 per gallon range over time ď I believe.

We cant just drill our way out of this !

This $2.00 gas sucks.
GWcpa is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 05:37 AM
  #123  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Tarpon Springs, FL
Posts: 7,259
Default

Originally Posted by MattGoose View Post
Might be worth taking a more critical look at your study. Here's a decent summary of the issues with that study: https://www.azcentral.com/story/news...omy/691997002/

Three most prominent issues:
1. Overstates the number of illegal aliens in the country by 1-2 million, compared to other estimates (including the CBO).
2. Includes the cost of 4.2 million US citizens in calculating the cost. They are children of illegal aliens, but under the laws of the US they are citizens. Don't like it, change the law.
3. It does not include any of the GDP contributions, or take into account what would happen if 10 - 12 million people were deported.

Jesus. The more I read of this, the more crappy it clearly is.
1. Includes $3.4B on the assumption that illegal aliens are improperly using Medicaid services. But it makes no argument that they actually are. None whatsoever. Literally, it just says they assume. (page 12)
2. It includes $4.2B for Medicaid payments for US citizens. (page 12)
3. It includes the entire $6B for customs and operating budget. That cost exists irrelevant of whether or not there are illegal aliens in this country. Hell, if they did a better job, we might have fewer illegal aliens.
4. $1.7B for Temporary Assitance for Needy Families. Which is only available to US citizens.
5. $1.9B for SNAP. Ditto to the above.

It's wroth skimming through the thing: https://fairus.org/sites/default/fil...ation-2017.pdf

It is not, in any way shape or form an honest attempt to accurately capture and portray the costs of illegal immigration.
Wow, lot of research from equally unverifiable sources as my original random C&P.

No clue which of the numbers are correct nor what the intent of the "research". I have gotten to the point where I don't take anything at face value anymore. My big concern is how can this be the 21st century and we don't know how many illegals are in our country nor what the real economic effect is. The "facts" are all over the place, the reality is we really don't know.

We need near 100% control of our borders and then deal with figuring out who's in our country. While we're solving the real problems you can deal with the minutia.
mikefloyd is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 06:33 AM
  #124  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,286
Default

Originally Posted by mikefloyd View Post
Wow, lot of research from equally unverifiable sources as my original random C&P.

No clue which of the numbers are correct nor what the intent of the "research". I have gotten to the point where I don't take anything at face value anymore. My big concern is how can this be the 21st century and we don't know how many illegals are in our country nor what the real economic effect is. The "facts" are all over the place, the reality is we really don't know.

We need near 100% control of our borders and then deal with figuring out who's in our country. While we're solving the real problems you can deal with the minutia.
If you don't know the details or extent of the problem - which you just stated is the case - how on earth do you know what the solution is?

Might be prudent to spend some more time understanding what the problem is first.
MattGoose is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 07:02 AM
  #125  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 537
Default

Originally Posted by limey940 View Post


Im not sure that jumbo mortgages and mcmansions are synonymous. Taking a jumbo mortgage is actually one of the few ways to reduce your tax burden if you are a relatively well paid employee. I guess I could get a boat with a head/kitchen and write that interest of. Are you against taxpayers subsidizing that as well?
you could argue that any legitimate deduction is asking taxpayers to subsidize that element. Are you anti all deductions?
taking advantage of all available and legal deductions is not a bad thing.
Also your assumption is incorrect, are S&l taxes are SC that is where we live.
I am against federal taxpayers subsidizing a lot of things. What locality in SC has local income taxes, if I may ask?
Im also aware that it is really hard for $20k loss in deductions equates to $22k increase in federal taxes. Hard to believe something else not in play. But, if that really is your case then maybe you should consult a tax accountant.
olyveoil is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 09:45 AM
  #126  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 223
Default

Originally Posted by olyveoil View Post
I am against federal taxpayers subsidizing a lot of things. What locality in SC has local income taxes, if I may ask?
Im also aware that it is really hard for $20k loss in deductions equates to $22k increase in federal taxes. Hard to believe something else not in play. But, if that really is your case then maybe you should consult a tax accountant.
all of SC has state income taxes, maybe you are thinking of FL that does not have state taxes?
And yes, absolutely loss off deduction means that I loose the ability to reduce my taxable income by that amount. Iím perplexed as well and actually said to my wife that we need to go back to the tax guy we used before we started doing our own with turbo tax.
Cheers
limey940 is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 10:42 AM
  #127  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 537
Default

Originally Posted by limey940 View Post


all of SC has state income taxes, maybe you are thinking of FL that does not have state taxes?
And yes, absolutely loss off deduction means that I loose the ability to reduce my taxable income by that amount. Iím perplexed as well and actually said to my wife that we need to go back to the tax guy we used before we started doing our own with turbo tax.
Cheers
Incorrect of what I am thinking of. 50 year resident of SC. S&L implies state and LOCAL income taxes. My question was: what localities impose taxes in SC?
SC income taxes are pretty much 7% for everyone. IE 20% extra in SC taxes you cannot deduct equates to $285,000+ in extra income. With that kind of income, I would hope you have a tax accountant.

Normally, less deductions equate to more taxable income. But, by no means is it a dollar for dollar or 1.00 for 1.20 increase in taxes paid as you claim.

Good luck.
olyveoil is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 02:35 PM
  #128  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Tarpon Springs, FL
Posts: 7,259
Default

Originally Posted by MattGoose View Post
If you don't know the details or extent of the problem - which you just stated is the case - how on earth do you know what the solution is?

Might be prudent to spend some more time understanding what the problem is first.
How do you not know what the solution to uncontrolled border crossing is. Come on; let's keep this real.
mikefloyd is offline  
Old 02-14-2019, 03:22 PM
  #129  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 223
Default

Originally Posted by olyveoil View Post
Incorrect of what I am thinking of. 50 year resident of SC. S&L implies state and LOCAL income taxes. My question was: what localities impose taxes in SC?
SC income taxes are pretty much 7% for everyone. IE 20% extra in SC taxes you cannot deduct equates to $285,000+ in extra income. With that kind of income, I would hope you have a tax accountant.

Normally, less deductions equate to more taxable income. But, by no means is it a dollar for dollar or 1.00 for 1.20 increase in taxes paid as you claim.

Good luck.
SALT equals state and local taxes. I simply shortened it, and if you have lived in sC 59 years Iím sure you are well aware there is no local income tax

i also did not claim there is a 1 to 1 corralation. Not sure what your agenda is but Iím done

anyway thanks, hood luck as well.
limey940 is offline  
Old 02-15-2019, 07:14 AM
  #130  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,286
Default

Originally Posted by mikefloyd View Post
Wow, lot of research from equally unverifiable sources as my original random C&P.

No clue which of the numbers are correct nor what the intent of the "research". I have gotten to the point where I don't take anything at face value anymore. My big concern is how can this be the 21st century and we don't know how many illegals are in our country nor what the real economic effect is. The "facts" are all over the place, the reality is we really don't know.

We need near 100% control of our borders and then deal with figuring out who's in our country. While we're solving the real problems you can deal with the minutia.
Originally Posted by mikefloyd View Post
How do you not know what the solution to uncontrolled border crossing is. Come on; let's keep this real.
Pick one. Either we don't know what the facts are or we know we have uncontrolled border crossings.

Tell me some facts about illegal immigrants entering from our southern border. Build a case to spend $33 billion dollars on the wall.
MattGoose is offline  
Old 02-15-2019, 11:20 AM
  #131  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: South Texas
Posts: 711
Default

Originally Posted by MattGoose View Post
Tell me some facts about illegal immigrants entering from our southern border. Build a case to spend $33 billion dollars on the wall.
They generally shit up wherever they live and go to the emergency room to have babies then skate on the bill. Have seen both first hand my entire GD life.
Sharpest is online now  
Old 02-15-2019, 11:27 AM
  #132  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 537
Default

Originally Posted by limey940 View Post


SALT equals state and local taxes. I simply shortened it, and if you have lived in sC 59 years Iím sure you are well aware there is no local income tax

i also did not claim there is a 1 to 1 corralation. Not sure what your agenda is but Iím done

anyway thanks, hood luck as well.
Um.
Yes you did.
Maybe a typo? Greater than 20K maybe? Still at a 7% rate, that is a biiiig number to get to additional $22k in taxes.
"so we essentially lost >20k in deductions. Think we are looking at an additional $22k in taxes on $45k less income."
olyveoil is offline  
Old 02-15-2019, 11:40 AM
  #133  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 537
Default

Originally Posted by MattGoose View Post
Pick one. Either we don't know what the facts are or we know we have uncontrolled border crossings.

Tell me some facts about illegal immigrants entering from our southern border. Build a case to spend $33 billion dollars on the wall.
Are you trying to make the case that a porous Southern border and/or unlimited ILLEGAL immigration is OK?
Ever hear of that right-wing rag (The Washington Post)?
Read it yourself.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.a4115fb407d1

Do you think 1,000+ / day of ILLEGAL immigrants is free to US taxpayers? Why don't you make a case that unlimited illegal immigration is OK?

Reasonable people agree that unlimited immigration (Which is essentially what we have on our Southern border) is not a good policy
olyveoil is offline  
Old 02-18-2019, 07:17 AM
  #134  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 537
Default

Originally Posted by olyveoil View Post
Are you trying to make the case that a porous Southern border and/or unlimited ILLEGAL immigration is OK?
Ever hear of that right-wing rag (The Washington Post)?
Read it yourself.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.a4115fb407d1

Do you think 1,000+ / day of ILLEGAL immigrants is free to US taxpayers? Why don't you make a case that unlimited illegal immigration is OK?

Reasonable people agree that unlimited immigration (Which is essentially what we have on our Southern border) is not a good policy
Crickets from the goose boy
olyveoil is offline  
Old 02-18-2019, 10:25 AM
  #135  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Tarpon Springs, FL
Posts: 7,259
Default

Originally Posted by MattGoose View Post
Pick one. Either we don't know what the facts are or we know we have uncontrolled border crossings.

Tell me some facts about illegal immigrants entering from our southern border. Build a case to spend $33 billion dollars on the wall.
Sorry if I assumed you understood the point. We know there's a bad problem, we just don't know if it's very bad or extremely bad. I would expect most people would have the good sense to stop it before it grows even worse. Maybe I expect too much.
mikefloyd is offline  
Old 02-19-2019, 06:29 AM
  #136  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,406
Default

Originally Posted by dev View Post
We pay enough in taxes I don't like giving the IRS an interest-free loan. Most years we owe a few thousand, and that works well. Low enough that there are no penalties or having to worry about doing estimated payments for the next year. A tax refund is just your overpayments coming back to you without any interest, stupid to "want" that.
Well call me stupid then. I regularly get anywhere from a 7-10K return back and prefer it that way. I look at it as my way of setting that money aside for what I want to use it for. If it stayed in my pay check it would go to all kinds of useless stuff and be nipped away at through the course of the year. If I tried to set some aside on my own, I'd find a way to blow it on something for myself, wife or kids....most likely kids before setting it aside. This way I get it back, set it all aside and have things in mind to assign it to as son as it comes in.....a good portion is usually boat stuff, kids camp for summer, house stuff, etc.. My IRA and 529's are funded just fine throughout the year, I use the return to knock out other stuff. It's my government savings account, and as mentioned by Russ, if I had set it aside myself the interest would basically be the same anyway.

Originally Posted by SOSC View Post
Would rather have a refund than a bill. Sorry, but a thousand dollars may not mean much to the folks on THT, but it does to most others. I dont care if my "loan" to the gubmint is interest free, taxes are inevitable and I'd rather get a refund than a bill.
Yup!

Originally Posted by RussH View Post
I sure in hell like to get a refund more than I like paying MORE taxes. I will gladly pay a little more than it looks like I should to ensure I don't have to pay more in April. A few years ago we got a refund of about $3K so we changed our exemptions to pay less and the next year we ended up having to pay almost $3K. We have extra taken out so we know we won't have to pay. Actually what's the big deal any way, if you had the money put into a savings account your interest growth would be practically nothing so I have a slightly different viewpoint on tax refunds.
Exactly!
Southbay is offline  
Old 02-19-2019, 07:46 AM
  #137  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,286
Default

Originally Posted by mikefloyd View Post
Sorry if I assumed you understood the point. We know there's a bad problem, we just don't know if it's very bad or extremely bad. I would expect most people would have the good sense to stop it before it grows even worse. Maybe I expect too much.
MIke. You're still doing it.

You know there's a bad problem... How? How are you quantifying bad problem? What metrics are you using?

Illegal immigration, based on apprehensions and deportations, is DECREASING year over year, especially on the southern border. Drugs come in through existing ports of entry and over the seas. The number of Mexicans entering the US is down year over year over year. The majority of people coming up from South America are fleeing conflict and seeking asylum.

Either you have some sort of facts to counter that, or quantify the problem you're screaming about.... Or you're just spouting off Fox News.

How do you know there a problem. Convince me. Make me care, I dare you.
MattGoose is offline  
Old 02-19-2019, 07:49 AM
  #138  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,286
Default

Originally Posted by olyveoil View Post
Crickets from the goose boy
You're spending your weekend here?

I've got other things to do.
MattGoose is offline  
Old 02-19-2019, 07:52 AM
  #139  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,286
Default

Originally Posted by olyveoil View Post
Are you trying to make the case that a porous Southern border and/or unlimited ILLEGAL immigration is OK?
Ever hear of that right-wing rag (The Washington Post)?
Read it yourself.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.a4115fb407d1

Do you think 1,000+ / day of ILLEGAL immigrants is free to US taxpayers? Why don't you make a case that unlimited illegal immigration is OK?

Reasonable people agree that unlimited immigration (Which is essentially what we have on our Southern border) is not a good policy
You've got to be kidding me. I'm seriously questioning your ability to read and understand. From YOUR article:

Family groups consisting of at least one parent and one child now account for the majority of those taken into custody by U.S. authorities along the border, a trend driven by large groups of Guatemalan migrants who have been showing up at remote border crossings to seek out the nearest U.S. agents. After surrendering to authorities, the families are driven to Border Patrol stations, where they typically state a fear of deportation and a desire to seek asylum in the United States. In most cases, the families are *released after a few days and assigned a court date, often with a monitoring band fitted to parentsí ankles.

Yes, we have a bunch of people fleeing shitty, shitty conditions coming here to declare that they are seeking asylum and entry to the US.

All of which is spelled out and described in US immigration law.

Please tell me that you understand this is an example of perfectly legal immigration?!

MattGoose is offline  
Old 02-19-2019, 08:27 AM
  #140  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,406
Default

Originally Posted by MattGoose View Post
You've got to be kidding me. I'm seriously questioning your ability to read and understand. From YOUR article:

Family groups consisting of at least one parent and one child now account for the majority of those taken into custody by U.S. authorities along the border, a trend driven by large groups of Guatemalan migrants who have been showing up at remote border crossings to seek out the nearest U.S. agents. After surrendering to authorities, the families are driven to Border Patrol stations, where they typically state a fear of deportation and a desire to seek asylum in the United States. In most cases, the families are *released after a few days and assigned a court date, often with a monitoring band fitted to parents’ ankles.

Yes, we have a bunch of people fleeing shitty, shitty conditions coming here to declare that they are seeking asylum and entry to the US.

All of which is spelled out and described in US immigration law.

Please tell me that you understand this is an example of perfectly legal immigration?!

Seems you do not. That is not LEGAL immigration. You can't seek asylum just because your country is a piece of shit and you want to bring your kids here for a better life, none of that is in US immigration or any law. That is what LEGAL immigration is for. Your country is a piece of shit, you want a better life, you want a better life for your kids....fine, great, awesome....that is the entire reason this country exists, it is the entire reason Ellis Island exists and what made this country great.

None of that is asylum. Asylum has nothing at all to do with running up to a wall, hopping it with your 7yr old and running straight to a border patrol agent and saying I want a better life.

Asylum is strictly for refugees, people who meet the international law definition of a "refugee". See below:

​​​​​​The United Nations 1951 Convention and 1967 Protocol define a refugee as a person who is unable or unwilling to return to his or her home country, and cannot obtain protection in that country, due to past persecution or a well-founded fear of being persecuted in the future “on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.” Congress incorporated this definition into U.S. immigration law in the Refugee Act of 1980.

Hopping over the border because Guatemala sucks and you want to come here for a better life does not qualify you as a refugee or for asylum. It is a valid reason to want to come here and to be admitted....LEGALLY, through the LEGAL process. You cannot perform an illegal act of jumping a border fence and refer to it as LEGAL immigration. The second they hop that fence or cross at un-fenced area, they have committed their first crime against US law, so now they are in this country illegally and have already broken our laws. That is on top of the fact that they ARE NOT refugees and DO NOT qualify for asylum.
Southbay is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread