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Senior Care and $

Old 05-27-2018, 06:15 AM
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I usually do not get involved in my wife's family business. Her gmom is 80 and on ventilator. Her mom and gpop went to social worker to get Medicare or medicade I'm not sure of which. He told them about their savings account which has a substantial amount of money in it. They were told they have to work over the money. Is this true? I suggested that they get a lawyer. His health is failing to. Knowing the great state of New Jersey I would imagine that they will try to take everything.
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Old 05-27-2018, 06:35 AM
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a. Long Term Health Care policy??? perhaps they purchased one.

b. If they have substantial assets, no medicaid, medicaid is essentially for the destitute.

c. Find a Assisted living facility within their means.
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Old 05-27-2018, 06:45 AM
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In order to qualify for Medicaid, you cannot have more than $2,000 in assets. That's probably what the social worker was talking about.

That $2,000 limit does not include the home you own, one car, pre-paid funeral plans, life insurance policies or rental properties.

in some (all?) states, if the state spends money through Medicaid to house someone in a nursing home, the state can come after that person's estate after they die to recover the state's Medicaid spending.
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Old 05-27-2018, 06:54 AM
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everyone remember- you may face this, and we give millions / billions to foreign countries.
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Old 05-27-2018, 07:12 AM
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My sister works for a lawyer who handles estate planning. I am trying to get my in laws to call them. Maybe they will not get screwed as bad.

It's really sad, they were in denial about her health. She was never going to be able to return home. But they kept thinking each week maybe she would have a miracle and be able to return home. Meanwhile still smoking with a ventilator.
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Old 05-27-2018, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by THT MOD 14 View Post
a

c. Find a Assisted living facility within their means.
The facility my parents went to required that applicants/new residents must walk into the place un-assisted. Is this true of all or just some of them? Would being on a ventilator keep somebody out?
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Old 05-27-2018, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by bamaboy473 View Post
The facility my parents went to required that applicants/new residents must walk into the place un-assisted. Is this true of all or just some of them? Would being on a ventilator keep somebody out?
In assisted living they either have to be able to walk or self-propel a wheelchair a reasonable distance. They also need to transfer themselves to a toilet, wheelchair or whatever.
No assisted living facility and most nursing home will accept someone on a ventilator. Keep in mind a ventilator and just being on oxygen are two very different things.
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Old 05-27-2018, 08:56 AM
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I gave up trying to help people with this sort of thing. They don't listen and they don't want to admit that they are going to die one day.
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Old 05-27-2018, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by angermanagement View Post
Her gmom is 80 and on ventilator.
Ventilator as in - can not breathe without mechanical assistance keeping her alive? Or just on oxygen? If she is being kept artificially alive via ventilator at 80 some real hard questions need to be addressed here.
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Old 05-27-2018, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by angermanagement View Post
My sister works for a lawyer who handles estate planning. I am trying to get my in laws to call them. Maybe they will not get screwed as bad.

It's really sad, they were in denial about her health. She was never going to be able to return home. But they kept thinking each week maybe she would have a miracle and be able to return home. Meanwhile still smoking with a ventilator.

Why do you say they are getting screwed?
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Old 05-27-2018, 09:22 AM
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Cannot live without the assistance of the machine. At Easter I asked them if they want to practice unplugging my keureg ? Joke did not go over well. Go figure.
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Old 05-27-2018, 06:04 PM
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On top of the small amount of assets allowed there is also a 5 or 7 year “look back” period. That is to keep people from hiding money or giving it away 3 weeks before they need assisted living or total care.

Went through this this with my mother last year. It is frightening what the monthly cost of memory or similar care is per month.



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Old 05-27-2018, 06:30 PM
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The Medicaid system is overwhelmed with people needing nursing care (which is what your situation sounds like) with zero assets. The indigent, basically. Hence, the requirement to spend down your assets before they will pay for your care.

I assume your grandparents do not have long term care (LTC) insurance policies. Only about 6% of the population does. Mostly wealthier folks who are planning to protect their assets from the spend down requirement by purchasing insurance to pay in lieu of Medicaid.

Medicare will only pay so much toward long term care, and it appears that's already been maxed out in your Gmom's case. So now it's one of three alternatives
1. private pay
2. LTC insurance
3. Medicaid

In your case, you may want to chat with an elder care attorney, but don't expect any miracles. All the trust fund loopholes and asset transfer strategies have been plugged by recent legislation. So be prepared to spend down their estate to get to Medicaid. A local Social Worker (often provided by the hospital) will give you advice on how to navigate the system.

Get power of attorney set up, a DNR and living will for both Gparents through the elder care attorney. Be prepared to "become the parent" for your grandparents. Role reversal at this stage in their lives is pretty typical. Usually it's the children that take over, not the grandchildren that have to deal with this stuff. Good luck,
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:39 AM
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Thanks guys for the information. I can't do much but suggest stuff. They are in denial about her condition. I would have pulled the plug long ago. I may sound cold but she's suffering.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:54 AM
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You might check into hospice. My Mom had COPD and was pretty much on constant oxygen. She lived with my sister and had hospice home care for the last two years of her life. Only cost incurred was during her last two weeks when we had to get someone to sit with her through the night.
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Old 05-28-2018, 07:38 AM
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Why should they expect the government to pay for their care if they have money.
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by wdemo View Post
You might check into hospice. My Mom had COPD and was pretty much on constant oxygen. She lived with my sister and had hospice home care for the last two years of her life. Only cost incurred was during her last two weeks when we had to get someone to sit with her through the night.
Hospice is paid by Medicare and is for the last 90 days of life. She likely did not have hospice for two years, though I suppose she might have surprised them and lived longer than they expected? Hospice is daily or several times/week visit by a nurse to administer palliative care to the terminally ill. Usually, morphine. If you want someone to stay overnight, then yeah, it's on your nickel.
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mikefloyd View Post
Why should they expect the government to pay for their care if they have money.
Trying to save the inheritance?
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Buoy Scout View Post
Hospice is paid by Medicare and is for the last 90 days of life. She likely did not have hospice for two years, though I suppose she might have surprised them and lived longer than they expected? Hospice is daily or several times/week visit by a nurse to administer palliative care to the terminally ill. Usually, morphine. If you want someone to stay overnight, then yeah, it's on your nickel.
She was under hospice care for two years. She was evaluated every 6 months to see if she still met the criteria.
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Buoy Scout View Post
Hospice is paid by Medicare and is for the last 90 days of life. She likely did not have hospice for two years, though I suppose she might have surprised them and lived longer than they expected? Hospice is daily or several times/week visit by a nurse to administer palliative care to the terminally ill. Usually, morphine. If you want someone to stay overnight, then yeah, it's on your nickel.
90 days is not true. My mother was on Hospice for 7 months and when she went into the program, no one said she only has 3 months so we will take her. They took her knowing she could be around for a while, a lot longer than 90 days.
A good friend's aunt was in the Alzheimers unit at a nursing home. She was on Hospice for over 2 years. Again, no one said her time was near so she qualifies.
For actual details, I highly suggest talking to Hospice. They were a Godsend for my mom. We can't say enough good things about the nurse and aide that took care of her.

I'm pretty sure there was a 90 day period that Bouy Scout mentioned, but that was done away with years ago.

Last edited by chuck34; 05-28-2018 at 05:54 PM.
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