Go Back  The Hull Truth - Boating and Fishing Forum > BOATING FORUMS > Dockside Chat
Reload this Page >

Y NOT MAKE BOATS & MOTORS IN CHINA,instead of usa.?

Notices

Y NOT MAKE BOATS & MOTORS IN CHINA,instead of usa.?

Old 07-06-2013, 01:36 AM
  #1  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,590
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 3 Posts
Default Y NOT MAKE BOATS & MOTORS IN CHINA,instead of usa.?

i wonder why american boat./motor makers, do like many companies in america n start making boats/motors over some were in asia,like china, where labor is dirt cheap?.that would help lower the boats sale price,they would sell more boats n make a bigger profit..they can use the same quality products they use here ,but use the cheap trained laborers over there...what u all think
Old 07-06-2013, 03:47 AM
  #2  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: South Florida
Posts: 4,589
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

??
Old 07-06-2013, 03:50 AM
  #3  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,746
Likes: 0
Received 176 Likes on 97 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by miamiboater2000 View Post
i wonder why american boat./motor makers, do like many companies in america n start making boats/motors over some were in asia,like china, where labor is dirt cheap?.that would help lower the boats sale price,they would sell more boats n make a bigger profit..they can use the same quality products they use here ,but use the cheap trained laborers over there...what u all think
Have you lost your mind? That's one of the good things about boats, an American worker is making a living off building it.
Old 07-06-2013, 03:52 AM
  #4  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Copiague long island
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 0
Received 25 Likes on 22 Posts
Default

Holy crapppppp;? What an awesome idea....NOTTTTT
Old 07-06-2013, 03:55 AM
  #5  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location:
Posts: 518
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Oh yea ! Just what we need is more JUNK from China ! People like you are why this country is in so much trouble .

Now I am off to go Fluke fishing in an AMERiCAN made boat !
Old 07-06-2013, 03:57 AM
  #6  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: South Florida
Posts: 4,589
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

y not lern 2 right werds tha rite waaa
Old 07-06-2013, 04:22 AM
  #7  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,169
Received 169 Likes on 126 Posts
Default

Your crazy
Old 07-06-2013, 04:41 AM
  #8  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Edgewater, Florida
Posts: 835
Received 26 Likes on 13 Posts
Default

Wow! What a great idea. I live in Edgewater, Florida. It's a small town just south of New Smyrna Beach. I love living here. We also have 3 major boat builders here in Edgewater. Boston Whaler, Everglades, and Edgewater Boats. I wonder how this town would be affected if they packed up and moved?

Please, just watch your sports and shop at Wal-Mart. Just write your ideas down on a piece of paper and leave it at that. Also sounds like you should stay out of the voting booth.
Old 07-06-2013, 04:49 AM
  #9  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Not getting enough attention in your life at 3:36AM? Geeezzz, that's a bad idea.

Last edited by irish33; 07-06-2013 at 04:51 AM. Reason: error
Old 07-06-2013, 05:00 AM
  #10  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 10,979
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 5 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by miamiboater2000 View Post
i wonder why american boat./motor makers, do like many companies in america n start making boats/motors over some were in asia,like china, where labor is dirt cheap?.that would help lower the boats sale price,they would sell more boats n make a bigger profit..they can use the same quality products they use here ,but use the cheap trained laborers over there...what u all think
It's not new news.
China has been very active toward this end for quite some time now.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:13 AM
  #11  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: PLYMOUTH, MA.
Posts: 1,632
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

It is already happening.

My Co-Worker is having a 1.3 million dollar 50' Horizon Catamaran built from the ground up in China.

He has made 3 trips to Taiwan to follow the progress thus far.

All American marine engineering and architects involved while simply prostituting out the labor.

Lets see how this thing holds up. Sad state of affairs, but you must continually evolve with the world.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:21 AM
  #12  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Navatech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Miami Gardens FL
Posts: 5,933
Likes: 0
Received 20 Likes on 19 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by miamiboater2000 View Post
i wonder why american boat./motor makers, do like many companies in america n start making boats/motors over some were in asia,like china, where labor is dirt cheap?.that would help lower the boats sale price,they would sell more boats n make a bigger profit..they can use the same quality products they use here ,but use the cheap trained laborers over there...what u all think
Quite simple really, read a book called "
Poorly Made in China: An Insider's Account of the China Production Game Poorly Made in China: An Insider's Account of the China Production Game
" by Paul Midler.

I manufacture in China and yes, you can get cheap pricing but getting good quality control is really hard... Much of what Paul writes about I have personally seen/experienced!

Last edited by Navatech; 07-06-2013 at 05:58 AM.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:28 AM
  #13  
Admirals Club Admiral's Club Member
 
Navatech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Miami Gardens FL
Posts: 5,933
Likes: 0
Received 20 Likes on 19 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Prolineguy View Post
It is already happening.
Indeed.

Originally Posted by Prolineguy View Post
My Co-Worker is having a 1.3 million dollar 50' Horizon Catamaran built from the ground up in China..
And it is indeed the bigger (50' +) boats right now.

Originally Posted by Prolineguy View Post
He has made 3 trips to Taiwan to follow the progress thus far.
Taiwan and mainland China are not the same thing. Labor in Taiwan is better quality and more expensive too.

Originally Posted by Prolineguy View Post
All American marine engineering and architects involved while simply prostituting out the labor.
They also make US cars (GM etc) in China. The final quality is nothing like you get here in the US... Furthermore, it's quite easy to f up the hull so the whole thing will revolve around proper quality control during the whole production process. I hope your friend has an on site representative who actually knows about boat building...
Old 07-06-2013, 05:29 AM
  #14  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Beaufort NC San Juan del Sur Nica
Posts: 6,708
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Probably a simple numbers game - things produced in China are produced in mass quantities. But as Mike C pointed out, they are making inroads...Like Cheoy Lee - building in Hong Kong and Lauderdale I think: http://cheoyleena.com/section/Contact_Us/2671/
Old 07-06-2013, 05:30 AM
  #15  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Grand Cayman
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

The first specific issue is boats are large and have unusual shapes. Shipping product back to the states from Asia is a significant cost for any company that outsources. The larger and more unusual the shape, the more it costs to ship. If you can cram thousands of units into a shipping container, the costs may be manageable. With items like boats, most if not all of the costs saved on labor would be eaten up by shipping costs.

The larger issue with outsourcing is overtime it destroys profitability and company value. If you are the first to outsource, you may have an advantage, but outsourcing isn't something you can patent, etc. If you do it and drive costs down, shortly your competitors will also be forced to outsource to meet your pricing. This will continue to drive prices down until while you were originally saving costs and having higher profits, now you just have lower costs, but profits are destroyed as others copy you.

Next is the issue of creating competitors. You send your molds to China and teach them how to make your boats. No matter how many NDAs, non-compete clauses, etc you have in place at some point a separate company will pop-up making pretty much the same product as you and is now competing against you with your own product. You can really completely destroy your company by just giving away all of your intellectual property like this. End of the day instead of a boat company, you are simply a marketing firm for the boat company (or whatever you make) you created overseas.

Lastly, many of your customers could be related to the boat industry in one form or another. As you destroy the local boat industry by outsourcing everything you'll shortly find many of your previous customers can no longer afford your product as you shipped their jobs overseas.

The 80-90s were the beginning of the fall of many companies (and could be argued the USA) as a generation of MBAs and management consultants were just driven by this simple minded goal of cutting costs no matter what. Looking back now, you see how those cost cutting measures were completely gutting the company to the point they become just a shell doing a little marketing but providing no real value.

Some recent Forbes articles (home to a lot of those MBA/management consultants) have covered this topic. A common example is Dell computers. At one point they were a great technology company creating a good product at a great price and had an amazing supply chain management program. Then they outsource the manufacture, then the support, then the supply chain management, etc, etc. Then HP copied them. So there was no price advantage. Then not surprisingly a lot of the people in companies they outsource do began opening their own companies doing the same thing. Now Dell is just some average marketing company in reality having their products built and designed by others and those they taught how to do it all are killing them with new companies they built which now compete with them.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:31 AM
  #16  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 10,979
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 5 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Prolineguy View Post
It is already happening.

My Co-Worker is having a 1.3 million dollar 50' Horizon Catamaran built from the ground up in China.

He has made 3 trips to Taiwan to follow the progress thus far.

All American marine engineering and architects involved while simply prostituting out the labor.

Lets see how this thing holds up. Sad state of affairs, but you must continually evolve with the world.
Trawlers and the like have been going on for years.
That's old news.
Once the hurdles have been overcome, shipping, freight costs, not being the smallest problem, we'll see more of it with small fiberglass product I'm afraid.
China has been very proactive re fiberglass small boat production for years now.
Anyone thinking that they're not proceeding with this thinking is very sadly mistaken.
And you know what?
When they succeed and build a price sensitive product the U.S.Of A consumer will buy it in quantity no matter what is thought or said or wished.

Sad but true.
Deny it if you so wish.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:34 AM
  #17  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Clearwater fla
Posts: 1,643
Likes: 0
Received 117 Likes on 73 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by miamiboater2000 View Post
i wonder why american boat./motor makers, do like many companies in america n start making boats/motors over some were in asia,like china, where labor is dirt cheap?.that would help lower the boats sale price,they would sell more boats n make a bigger profit..they can use the same quality products they use here ,but use the cheap trained laborers over there...what u all think
I'm not a fan of this train of thought in any industry.You know why.Because I want my fellow americans to make a decent wage.Be able to buy a car and home.Raise a family and be able to a vacation here.Also pay taxs here.A rising tide raises all boats kid.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:46 AM
  #18  
Senior Member Admiral's Club Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lighthouse Point, Fl.
Posts: 2,400
Received 667 Likes on 324 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by miamiboater2000 View Post
i wonder why american boat./motor makers, do like many companies in america n start making boats/motors over some were in asia,like china, where labor is dirt cheap?.that would help lower the boats sale price,they would sell more boats n make a bigger profit..they can use the same quality products they use here ,but use the cheap trained laborers over there...what u all think
I think American's should start reading labels and where ever possible stop buying made in china products.
Old 07-06-2013, 05:51 AM
  #19  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 292
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Troll
Old 07-06-2013, 05:58 AM
  #20  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 10,979
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 5 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by ccarpediem View Post
The first specific issue is boats are large and have unusual shapes. Shipping product back to the states from Asia is a significant cost for any company that outsources. The larger and more unusual the shape, the more it costs to ship. If you can cram thousands of units into a shipping container, the costs may be manageable. With items like boats, most if not all of the costs saved on labor would be eaten up by shipping costs.

The larger issue with outsourcing is overtime it destroys profitability and company value. If you are the first to outsource, you may have an advantage, but outsourcing isn't something you can patent, etc. If you do it and drive costs down, shortly your competitors will also be forced to outsource to meet your pricing. This will continue to drive prices down until while you were originally saving costs and having higher profits, now you just have lower costs, but profits are destroyed as others copy you.

Next is the issue of creating competitors. You send your molds to China and teach them how to make your boats. No matter how many NDAs, non-compete clauses, etc you have in place at some point a separate company will pop-up making pretty much the same product as you and is now competing against you with your own product. You can really completely destroy your company by just giving away all of your intellectual property like this. End of the day instead of a boat company, you are simply a marketing firm for the boat company (or whatever you make) you created overseas.

Lastly, many of your customers could be related to the boat industry in one form or another. As you destroy the local boat industry by outsourcing everything you'll shortly find many of your previous customers can no longer afford your product as you shipped their jobs overseas.

The 80-90s were the beginning of the fall of many companies (and could be argued the USA) as a generation of MBAs and management consultants were just driven by this simple minded goal of cutting costs no matter what. Looking back now, you see how those cost cutting measures were completely gutting the company to the point they become just a shell doing a little marketing but providing no real value.

Some recent Forbes articles (home to a lot of those MBA/management consultants) have covered this topic. A common example is Dell computers. At one point they were a great technology company creating a good product at a great price and had an amazing supply chain management program. Then they outsource the manufacture, then the support, then the supply chain management, etc, etc. Then HP copied them. So there was no price advantage. Then not surprisingly a lot of the people in companies they outsource do began opening their own companies doing the same thing. Now Dell is just some average marketing company in reality having their products built and designed by others and those they taught how to do it all are killing them with new companies they built which now compete with them.

China has been very active as to molds, production and all related to small fiberglass boat production.
They've been very active in trying to import the people and knowledge.
That's been going on for quite some time.

I don't see where manufacturing has been the problem.
Cheap labor and plenty of trainable cheap labor is abundant.
No EPA to worry about.
Employee benefits?
Payroll taxes?
OSHA?
All the stuff our government enforces to help out?
Shipping the finished product is the major problem.
I think the sole problem.
Until the volume allows for the shipping costs I don't think we'll see any real problems as to the industry within the U.S. being threatened.
Once that problem is overcome, that's a whole new ballgame, regrettably.

Don't think for a moment that they're not working on it.
It would appear that it's a problem with no answer thus far.
Until the volume reaches a point that a devoted carrier (ship) makes sense much like a carrier totally devoted solely to shipping Toyota's, there's no answer thus far as to freight but when that answer is found, you betcha, our industry in the U.S. is threatened big time.

And there will be zero, none, nada, no shortage of buyers, investors or dealers for the product when that time arrives.

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.