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McNabb vs. Brady

Old 02-07-2005, 01:17 PM
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Default McNabb vs. Brady

Let me start by saying I know...I know...Mr. Brady has three rings and has proven he can win the big one. Congrats to him, he's very good. For the McNabb bashers that I'm hearing, he had a horrible game and hasn't shown up at crunch time, but here are the numbers for this season..

Completion % McNabb; 64%......Brady; 60.8%

Yards McNabb; 3875 .......Brady; 3692

TDs McNabb; 31.........Brady; 28

Ints. McNabb; 8 ........Brady; 14

RATING McNabb 104.7.......Brady; 92.6

I give intangibles to Brady for things like handling pressure etc, but do you still think McNabb is that bad?
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Old 02-07-2005, 01:38 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

Weak,,,Lots of numbers there:::::

Theres only one that counts::::

Brady: 3 SuperBowl rings

McNabb: 0000000000000000

Good luck next year......

Joe
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Old 02-07-2005, 01:40 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

I hear ya cap!!
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Old 02-07-2005, 01:45 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

QB's #'s can be skewed one way or another by offensive schemes, performance of offensive line, and a bevy of other variables.....

Both QB's lead their teams exceptionally this year......both are class players in my opinion...on and off the field
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Old 02-07-2005, 01:48 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

I would like him more if he wasn't "constantly" bringing up the black q-back thing

Seriously, as someone who actually sees McNabb frequently and has a clue about him as a player and a person, my thoughts are:

Very good quarterback who can sometimes get too amped for a game which ultimately affects his accuracy and sometimes his decision-making. He also was up against an extremely well-coached D without the offensive run/pass balance a team needs against this level of defense. Having said that, he keeps getting better and this was a breakout season for him. As a Philly fan I feel very lucky to have him running the show here and as Ray Didinger of NFL Films said last night, Donovan will be back to the big game and he will win at least one Super Bowl in his career (I'm thinking next year in Detroit!)

As for Tom Brady, that man has made a believer out of me. He calmly checks off in the face of Philly's killer blitz packages and hits the right man almost every time. He is deadeye accurate and a very poised leader who stands tall and firm in the pocket. I can't say enough about him as a player and he seems like a real good person off the field to boot. Best in the league? I say yes without question.

I would put Donovan below Brady's lofty level at this point but he is one of the top 2 or 3 in the league. Understand that like Brady, McNabb is also a real good guy off the field and whether you favor one or the other in terms of their play, they are equal of character.

'Nough said
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Old 02-07-2005, 01:48 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

crackerasscracker - 2/7/2005 1:45 PM

QB's #'s can be skewed one way or another by offensive schemes, performance of offensive line, and a bevy of other variables.....

Both QB's lead their teams exceptionally this year......both are class players in my opinion...on and off the field
I totally agree on your entire post. BTW, CAC you have the best handle on the forum.
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Old 02-07-2005, 05:28 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

yes mcnabb has better #s but he played again'st weaker teams in the nfc. the nfc had teams that were 8and8 make it to the play offs. where as the afc had the colts as a wild card pick at 12and4.
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Old 02-07-2005, 06:16 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

Here's a number 3
3 trips to the superbowl
3 superbowl rings
3 other "better than brady" QB's shot down in Flames.
Ask yourself this people.. how long would Bill Belichek think about trading brady for any of them?
3 tenths of a second would be my guess..
By the way, how many points did the pats win by?
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Old 02-07-2005, 06:18 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

Fluke Hunter - 2/7/2005 1:48 PM

I would like him more if he wasn't "constantly" bringing up the black q-back thing

Seriously, as someone who actually sees McNabb frequently and has a clue about him as a player and a person, my thoughts are:

Very good quarterback who can sometimes get too amped for a game which ultimately affects his accuracy and sometimes his decision-making. He also was up against an extremely well-coached D without the offensive run/pass balance a team needs against this level of defense. Having said that, he keeps getting better and this was a breakout season for him. As a Philly fan I feel very lucky to have him running the show here and as Ray Didinger of NFL Films said last night, Donovan will be back to the big game and he will win at least one Super Bowl in his career (I'm thinking next year in Detroit!)

As for Tom Brady, that man has made a believer out of me. He calmly checks off in the face of Philly's killer blitz packages and hits the right man almost every time. He is deadeye accurate and a very poised leader who stands tall and firm in the pocket. I can't say enough about him as a player and he seems like a real good person off the field to boot. Best in the league? I say yes without question.

I would put Donovan below Brady's lofty level at this point but he is one of the top 2 or 3 in the league. Understand that like Brady, McNabb is also a real good guy off the field and whether you favor one or the other in terms of their play, they are equal of character.

'Nough said
Well said Fluke!! Great character guys. Thanks for gettin' my back
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Old 02-07-2005, 08:08 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

Remember, it took Elway three tries and a great running back to win the big game. Pats rushing scheme had eagles confused all game and they forced #5 to make some throws he'd like to have back. Eagles need to add a power running back to keep defenses more honest next year.
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Old 02-07-2005, 08:29 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

Ahhhhh........the old QB vs QB question!

I'd take a QB that knows how to manage the "O" rather than one who just puts up the numbers any day. Brady is a game manager plain and simple while McNabb is more of a "Let's see what happens" type of QB.

Brady knows about 80% of the outcome of any given play BEFORE the ball is snapped. He sees what the "D" is giving him and adjusts.

The Eagles receivers make McNabb a better QB in "numbers" but on the other hand Brady makes the Patriots "O" produce on the scoreboard.

OK....Are you ready to compare Brady to Manning?
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Old 02-07-2005, 09:39 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

Here's how I rank them for the record.

1. Brady

2. Manning

3. McNabb

4. Rothlesburger

5. Michael Vick

6. Favre

Just MHO from an honest Eagles fan. I guess my point is that #5 got the Eagles to 4 NFC championships 3 without TO and the worse recievers in the league, and 1 super bowl in 6 years. That's not bad either. Is it????? The previous 3 years the NFC was much better than it is now.
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Old 02-07-2005, 10:15 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

I think Michael Vick is the most over-rated player in the league.

If he does not learn how to become a passer he will get himself seriously injured in the next few years. What kind of player will he be when he can no longer out run everyone on the field? An unemployed one.

Regards,
Doug L.
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Old 02-08-2005, 01:28 AM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

WEAKFISH - 2/7/2005 2:17 PM

Let me start by saying I know...I know...Mr. Brady has three rings and has proven he can win the big one. Congrats to him, he's very good. For the McNabb bashers that I'm hearing, he had a horrible game and hasn't shown up at crunch time, but here are the numbers for this season..

Completion % McNabb; 64%......Brady; 60.8%

Yards McNabb; 3875 .......Brady; 3692

TDs McNabb; 31.........Brady; 28

Ints. McNabb; 8 ........Brady; 14

RATING McNabb 104.7.......Brady; 92.6

I give intangibles to Brady for things like handling pressure etc, but do you still think McNabb is that bad?
The one serious stat that is missing in that list is Rushing yards.
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Old 02-08-2005, 02:26 AM
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John, from what I saw, McNabb did not lose the game. He should not take the heat for this loss. Your boys need a true running back, or need to develope Westbrook into one. I think it would've been worse with a lesser QB. Until it is consistently proven otherwise, I will subscribe to the notion that a quarterback's role is to:
read
manage
pass
hand-off to a running back
In a team sport with numerous specialists, asking a quarterback to also do a running backs job hasn't proved to be a Super Bowl winning proposition. Throwing on the run adds to inaccuracy and gives defenders a chance to read the qbs intention as they will tend to look in a receiver more.

McNabb is a good example. In his past years, he has run more and thrown less accurately. This year he has worked in the pocket, had a career year, won the nfc, and had a good chance of winning the big one. Steve Young may have been an exception, but I think of him more as a scrambler from a broken play or collapsed pocket than a by-design running-quarter back.

Brady arguably had his best Super Bowl, but because he didn't have to orchestrate a game winning drive, does not get a 3rd MVP. Deon Branch does and deservedly so. He was also a contender for it last year.

I would put Culpepper and maybe Brees up there and question whether Favre has lost his decision-making ability - he still has a gun, but threw a lot of ill advised passes over the past two years. I also think Roethlisberger had an incredible rookie year but wilted in playoffs and remains to be seen.
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Old 02-08-2005, 08:30 AM
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Bill...that is an analysis!! I concur!!

I can't believe I forgot Culpepper. I put him ahead of Vick and Favre. I really put Favre there for respect. Rothlesburger showed alot of poise for his years, but was really a product of his line and running attack. I haven't seen much of Brees, but I trust your judgment.

Did you recover yet?

Going to the liquor store today to buy some Makers Mark. Then off to mailbox etc.
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Old 02-08-2005, 06:12 PM
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Brett Farve is the best quarterback that ever played the game.The ONLY reason he hasn't gone to the big one every year is 90% of the time the man drops back to pass he has 3 or 4 giant men an arms length away in his face.If he had the time some of the other quarterbacks have they would never lose a game.
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Old 02-10-2005, 12:00 PM
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Doxy:
I disagree with most of your points. Here's why.
The loss was 100% #5's fault. Turnovers lose playoff/SB games. That game was lost in the 1st Quarter by the second turnover. That took at least 10 points off of the board. The Eagles D dominated the first half, the turnovers gave the game away.
QB's
-McNabb's best throws this year have been from outside of the pocket. That is where he is most dangerous, because the D has no idea what he will do and they have bigger problems reading him.(His stats are acually better out of the pocket)
-Elway & Young are two great examples of QB's that play like #5. They are both mobile and have won the big game using that mobility. Young has the SB record for 6 Td's thrown, he also ran for 50+ yards in that game. (Garner was his running back, a mirror of Westbrook.)
McNair holds the record for rushing in a SB, that game was lost by only one yard.
Young was the highest career rated passer & he ran all the time.

As for Westbrook & the running game-
They are not a power offence & never will be, it's not a part of the West Coast style. They had a power back last year in #22, they won more games this year without him.
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Old 02-10-2005, 08:37 PM
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HEDJUG:
Doxy: I disagree with most of your points. Here's why.
Good deal, HEDJUG. All opinions & football banter welcome. First, the usual disclaimer: I think all of these QBs are phenomenal & some a little more than others.

The loss was 100% #5's fault. Turnovers lose playoff/SB games. That game was lost in the 1st Quarter by the second turnover.
It's hard for me to imagine a coach or player believing that when their team is ahead by 7 points near the end of the second quarter, that they have already lost the game. I can assure you that none of the Eagles fans or players at Alltel Stadium believed it last Sunday. You can’t argue self-determination for one quarter and fate for the remainder of the game. Choose one.

That took at least 10 points off of the board.
No points were on the board that were taken off. Two Eagles drives ended in a turnover. One Patriots drive ended in a turnover. It's part of the game. After the first INT was negated by a Patriots penalty, I said, "Don't worry, there are more to be had." It was not smart by any stretch, it was stating the obvious.... There were 8 and 9 DB’s covering half as many receivers . If the Eagles had a running game, do you think the Patriots would have used this scheme?

The Eagles D dominated the first half, the turnovers gave the game away.
The Eagles were ahead by 7 points late in the second quarter after the two turnovers. A 1-turnover difference in the first half does not give the game away, especially when the score is 7-zip, Eagles. Each snap resets opportunity - for a stop, turnover, conversion, score, etc., etc.
halftime:
BIRDS OFFENSE: 7 posessions, 192 yds., 2 turnovers, 3 punts, half ends.
PATS OFFENSE: 6 posessions, 138 yds., 1 turnover, 4 punts.
Time of Possession 15:21, PATS
HALFTIME SCORE: 7 - 7
This is Eagles Defensive Domination?

QB's -McNabb's best throws this year have been from outside of the pocket. That is where he is most dangerous, because the D has no idea what he will do and they have bigger problems reading him.(His stats are acually better out of the pocket)
I would very much like to see these stats. He has made a quantum leap in his passing game all around, while running far less than normal. He has done more, had more sucess, and gone farther this year while relying far less on running. What more can be said?

-Elway & Young are two great examples of QB's that play like #5. They are both mobile and have won the big game using that mobility. Young has the SB record for 6 Td's thrown, he also ran for 50+ yards in that game. (Garner was his running back, a mirror of Westbrook.)
As stated, I think Young is the exception. So we agree. Elway is not a good comparison - he averaged far less rushing yards than Young and McNabb. Also, his Superbowl winning seasons were when his rushing was lower than average (200 and 100 yd seasons). In 98 he ran 94 yds on the season and his pass completion% was 3 pts. above his career ave and he had highest yards per attempt of his career.

McNair holds the record for rushing in a SB, that game was lost by only one yard.
McNair lost to Superbowl MVP Kurt Warner. Warner threw for over 400 yards that game and ran an offense that scored over 500 points in 3 consecutive years. McNair had to play from behind all game. The Titans laid an egg to about the 4th quarter. McNair did not run the ball to the 1-foot line at the end of the game. McNair hasn't been back. Respectfully, I don’t know why you would choose that game to illustrate your point.

Young was the highest career rated passer & he ran all the time.
Again, Young is an exception. But when is an exception “consistently proving otherwise”? Look at the last fifteen Super Bowl winning QBs (to include Young to be fair).

As for Westbrook & the running game-
They are not a power offence & never will be, it's not a part of the West Coast style. They had a power back last year in #22, they won more games this year without him.
NEVER? If the Eagles had a Dillon in their backfield, would the Pats show them a 2 down front? I am just guessing here that Reid would not agree with you. If he had the option of including a running back that would pull in the defense, he would take it in a New York Minute. If he had it Sunday, he would have won.

Maybe we should start thinking about fishing again.
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Old 02-12-2005, 08:13 PM
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Default RE: McNabb vs. Brady

WEAKFISH - 2/7/2005 2:17 PM

Let me start by saying I know...I know...Mr. Brady has three rings and has proven he can win the big one. Congrats to him, he's very good. For the McNabb bashers that I'm hearing, he had a horrible game and hasn't shown up at crunch time, but here are the numbers for this season..

Completion % McNabb; 64%......Brady; 60.8%

Yards McNabb; 3875 .......Brady; 3692

TDs McNabb; 31.........Brady; 28

Ints. McNabb; 8 ........Brady; 14

RATING McNabb 104.7.......Brady; 92.6

I give intangibles to Brady for things like handling pressure etc, but do you still think McNabb is that bad?
McNabb played in the NFC, a much weaker conference. The NFC was miserable this year, an embarrasment to the NFL.

Period, end of story...
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