Notices

Failed emissions test in NJ

Old 02-02-2005, 04:21 PM
  #1  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Edgewater, NJ
Posts: 4,706
Default Failed emissions test in NJ

I went to get my car inspected at a NJ state run facility today and they failed me because of my gascap. I asked the guy working there and he couldn't give me a reason why a gascap would not pass the test and he shrugged his shoulder. I know my gas cap makes tight seal because I can hear the air rushing into the tank when I fill up(yes...Jersey boys know how to fill a gas tank. ). Anyone know why a gascap would not pass emission test?

They want me to get new gas cap and go back.

Also can these guys working at these places be any more rude? Is rudeness a requirement to work at one of these facilities? The 2 guys I dealt with...I won't vent here...sorry.
DarthBaiter is offline  
Old 02-02-2005, 04:53 PM
  #2  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Port Charlotte ,FL -
Posts: 504
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

if I'm not mistaken you need to have a non-vented gascap in the new vehicles in NJ....so the fumes are passed thru a filter in the fuel system......did you have a aftermarket cap?..if it is the cap that came with the vehicle the dealer should give you a new one due to your vehicle has a seperate emissions warranty...hope that helped you.......


Work is for people too lazy to fish!!!!
chalkguy is offline  
Old 02-02-2005, 05:03 PM
  #3  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Edgewater, NJ
Posts: 4,706
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

chalkguy - 2/2/2005 4:53 PM if I'm not mistaken you need to have a non-vented gascap in the new vehicles in NJ....so the fumes are passed thru a filter in the fuel system......did you have a aftermarket cap?..if it is the cap that came with the vehicle the dealer should give you a new one due to your vehicle has a seperate emissions warranty...hope that helped you....... Work is for people too lazy to fish!!!!
I believe my cap is stock. I'll stop by the dealer I guess...

Thanks
DarthBaiter is offline  
Old 02-03-2005, 06:06 PM
  #4  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Port Charlotte ,FL -
Posts: 504
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

Darth...was curious how you made out at the dealer?????
chalkguy is offline  
Old 02-04-2005, 08:29 PM
  #5  
Senior MemberCaptains Club MemberPLEDGER
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Moorestown, New Jersey
Posts: 4,899
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

DarthBaiter - 2/2/2005 4:21 PM

Also can these guys working at these places be any more rude? Is rudeness a requirement to work at one of these facilities? The 2 guys I dealt with...I won't vent here...sorry.
I hear that. It's like these people are Pi$$ed at the world.
WEAKFISH is offline  
Old 02-04-2005, 09:14 PM
  #6  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Port Charlotte ,FL -
Posts: 504
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

not to hijack the thread...but that is one of the reasons I moved from NJ...the Dept of motor vehicles acted like they were god almighty!!!!....when I came to Fl it was quite the opposite..the DMV people were friendly and tried to work past any problems that you encountered..
chalkguy is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 02:33 AM
  #7  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Garett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 24,119
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

Again not to derail the thread, but we've had emission testing up here for about 5 yrs now,,,,,now they are talking about removing it????????

But the gas cap issue has something to do with making the fuel system pressurize.....there has to be a minimum amount of pressure in the system. How they know it's the gas cap is beyond me? I've only had to do one on my old truck (passed with flying colors) and one when I bought the Misses last car.
Garett is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 08:00 AM
  #8  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Groveland, MA
Posts: 1,043
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

The reason they are testing the cap is to try to check the integrity of the Evaporative Emmissions System. The Evap System is basically an activated charcoal canister that traps fuel vapors and then routes these vapors into the intake manifold where they are burned as you drive. If the cap is leaking, vapors that should be contained by the system would be venting to atmosphere. In most 1996 or newer vehicles, or what are called OBDII for On Board Diagnostics II, the cars computer checks the system by routinely applying a small pressure or vacuum to the system and then checking to see if the vacuum or pressure hold. If not, the "Check Engine" light or equivalent will eventually be lit. That's why if you leave your gas cap loose after filling, or having it filled in Jersey , the light will come on after a couple of what are called drive cycles. The whole idea is to prevent vapors from leaking which are a huge source of pollution.
rparkssos is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 09:30 AM
  #9  
Senior Member

 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Quebec, Canada and Pirates Cove, OBX, NC
Posts: 20,170
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

rparkssos - 2/5/2005 9:00 AM . . . That's why if you leave your gas cap loose after filling, or having it filled in Jersey , the light will come on after a couple of what are called drive cycles. The whole idea is to prevent vapors from leaking which are a huge source of pollution.
Thanks for the info
auguste is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 12:26 PM
  #10  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Edgewater, NJ
Posts: 4,706
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

rparkssos - 2/5/2005 8:00 AMThe reason they are testing the cap is to try to check the integrity of the Evaporative Emmissions System. The Evap System is basically an activated charcoal canister that traps fuel vapors and then routes these vapors into the intake manifold where they are burned as you drive. If the cap is leaking, vapors that should be contained by the system would be venting to atmosphere. In most 1996 or newer vehicles, or what are called OBDII for On Board Diagnostics II, the cars computer checks the system by routinely applying a small pressure or vacuum to the system and then checking to see if the vacuum or pressure hold. If not, the "Check Engine" light or equivalent will eventually be lit. That's why if you leave your gas cap loose after filling, or having it filled in Jersey , the light will come on after a couple of what are called drive cycles. The whole idea is to prevent vapors from leaking which are a huge source of pollution.
LOL Jersey boys know how to fill a tank contrary to what the state believs.

Here is the whole story.
I go to get an ispection and the guy gets on my case about my Ins card cuz it's ratty. I had it in my pocket when I was cleaning some snow and it got wet. I say "sorry, but all the info is legiable, can you please use the info?" He frowns(why I don't know) and truns away. Tells me to step out and go wait in the waiting area. He goes off makes a cup of coffe and comes back. He motions for me to come to he car. I go and he points to an empty propane tank I have in my back seat. I tell em it's empty and he says it has to be removed from the facility. I tell em I didn't know that and I would put it outside till the inspection is over. I remove the tank as I walk out he say to himself in a whisper, "I guess you aint passing today." . I turn around and ask "what?" and he walks off with out saying anything. And lo and behold I fail the test for agascap. And all I can say to myself is, "it;s a good thing he ain't a cop." Talk about power corrupting...

I havn't gone to my dealer yet. Maybe monday.
DarthBaiter is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 01:51 PM
  #11  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: CT
Posts: 18,350
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

Unfortunately, the gas cap test is the least automated part of the modern emissions test. There is lots of room for error in the test procedures themselves. The testor may choose the wrong "adaptor" or he may not tighten it all the way on the test rig. Add to that the fact that the testing equipment suppliers have sometimes made errors in making caps that weren't appropriate for certain vehicles as advertised. Furthermore, as the newer models are introduced with new designs and technologies, the "old" manuals (computerized or hardcopy) are sometimes not updated. This is one reason why CT does not check the newest model year vehicles.

That said - I have seen caps direct from the manufacturers on new cars properly fail. Without doing an investigation its hard to diagnose what happened in your case.

I think that very recently, the EPA has allowed the states to use only the OBD (computer - check engine light) test for the fuel evaporative system. Previously they only approved the mechanical test (take it off the car and put it on a test rig that pressurizes it to test the seal) since the OBD test only identified egregious failures. THAT said - a common cause of MIL (Malfunction Indicator Light) light illumination is not tightening the cap until it clicks. Just tighten the cap and after som many restarts the system should reset and light go out.

NJ probably also has an appeal or challenge system where you can get state people to do a re-check, if you think the garage is cheating or incompetent, or you have reason to believe there is nothing wrong with your car. There is probbaly a program web-site for details.

Not knowing anything else - get a Stant cap at a part store, the emissions station (if they do repairs) for your vehicle or an original equipment Part from the dealer.

I know much more about this subject than I really want too.... I could write a book about emissions testing..... actually - this is one of the reasons I retired early
LI Sound Grunt is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 03:46 PM
  #12  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Edgewater, NJ
Posts: 4,706
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

I wouldn't have thought twice about it and just got a new one, if it wasn't for that snide remark the guy made.
I just have to go and get anew one and show em the reciept for it. Again not a big deal.
DarthBaiter is offline  
Old 02-05-2005, 03:47 PM
  #13  
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Groveland, MA
Posts: 1,043
Default RE: Failed emissions test in NJ

[QUOTE]LI Sound Grunt - 2/5/2005 2:51 PM

Light) light illumination is not tightening the cap until it clicks. Just tighten the cap and after som many restarts the system should reset and light go out. QUOTE]

Just one comment about tightening the cap and having the MIL reset itself after so many restarts. The light will not reset based on restarts but only on drive cycles that pass the test. A drive cycle consists of a number of factors such as engine temp, road speed and even how much fuel is in the tank. For instance, the system won't even test itself if the fuel level is less than 15% or more than 85%. For Evap, the vehicle must pass two consecutive drive cycles before the light would reset itself. I just didn't want to see somebody replace their cap then continually restart the car hoping the light went out. The only thing you'll be doing at that point is shopping for a starter.
rparkssos is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread