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Giving out tickets by camera yet?

Old 06-09-2011, 05:46 PM
  #181  
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Seacat, you scare me. God forbid you're in a position to affect the lives of others.
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Old 06-09-2011, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Seacat, you scare me. God forbid you're in a position to affect the lives of others.
Nothing to be scared of unless you run red lights

I am actually a libertarian by philosophy. You just have to have rules when you live in an urban area. Red light laws are one of them and they are important. People die everyday from it. I get sick of seeing assholes blasting through red lights nearly everyday. Its a pet peeve of mine.
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Old 06-09-2011, 06:02 PM
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It's OK to use technology to take tolls via sunpass, but not use technology to catch light runners?.....very rare to see a LEO watching an intersection....light runners endanger all of us, collisions are typically, pretty serious, if a camera will improve safety, I'm for it...
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Old 06-09-2011, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by slickster View Post
if a camera will improve safety, I'm for it...
It is a big if. The companies that sell the cameras for a cut of the tickets say it does. Lots of other studies say it makes it worse.
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Old 06-09-2011, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Seacat FL View Post
Nothing to be scared of unless you run red lights

I am actually a libertarian by philosophy. You just have to have rules when you live in an urban area. Red light laws are one of them and they are important. People die everyday from it. I get sick of seeing assholes blasting through red lights nearly everyday. Its a pet peeve of mine.
I don't believe anybody here is saying that red light laws are not needed. THEY ARE! Red light laws are great, their should be enforcement and stiff penalties for disobeying traffic systems.

The argument is not whether the law is correct but rather the means of enforcement.

There are several things that would make it easier to catch criminals, but we don't do it because it infringes the rights of both the guilty and innocent.

We have a war on drugs, well if every citizen in areas that have drug problems was subjected to a weekly home inspection by the authorities, that would most likely cut down on drug use and distribution, could save the lives of thousands... Guess what, doing so would not be constitutional and would be a drastic trampling of our rights which we are blessed to have by living in this great country.

The laws are not the problems (in this case) however the method of enforcement is. The end does not always justify the means.
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Old 06-09-2011, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by JCM 1420 View Post
I don't believe anybody here is saying that red light laws are not needed. THEY ARE! Red light laws are great, their should be enforcement and stiff penalties for disobeying traffic systems.

The argument is not whether the law is correct but rather the means of enforcement.

There are several things that would make it easier to catch criminals, but we don't do it because it infringes the rights of both the guilty and innocent.

We have a war on drugs, well if every citizen in areas that have drug problems was subjected to a weekly home inspection by the authorities, that would most likely cut down on drug use and distribution, could save the lives of thousands... Guess what, doing so would not be constitutional and would be a drastic trampling of our rights which we are blessed to have by living in this great country.

The laws are not the problems (in this case) however the method of enforcement is. The end does not always justify the means.

There is no infringement of any rights with red light cameras.

Camera takes a pic of you breaking the law. Records your cars data. You get ticketed. You pay or request a hearing.

Nothing wrong or unfair at all about it.
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Old 06-10-2011, 06:07 AM
  #187  
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Originally Posted by Seacat FL View Post
I get sick of seeing assholes blasting through red lights nearly everyday. Its a pet peeve of mine.
so..............lets make the fines for running red lights cheaper (nearly half), lets get rid of the points against the DL, and on top of that make unconstitutional any red light tickets written by a LEO because it violates equal protection, and finally lets tie up even more LEOs in court defending worthless camera tickets .................yeah i feel safer already.
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Old 06-10-2011, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by TSA View Post
so..............lets make the fines for running red lights cheaper (nearly half), lets get rid of the points against the DL, and on top of that make unconstitutional any red light tickets written by a LEO because it violates equal protection, and finally lets tie up even more LEOs in court defending worthless camera tickets .................yeah i feel safer already.
That about sums it up. Except--we all are paying out the nose for this charade.
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Old 06-10-2011, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by slickster View Post
It's OK to use technology to take tolls via sunpass, but not use technology to catch light runners?.....very rare to see a LEO watching an intersection....light runners endanger all of us, collisions are typically, pretty serious, if a camera will improve safety, I'm for it...
That's just it, running a red light is not a toll. I guess it is becoming one but that is what I am arguing against. Blurring the lines between moving violations and tolls is a very slippery slope. At some point a $50 fine becomes more tolerable than being late for a meeting and then people die from toll violations instead of a more severe moving violation. How does that apply in court for punishment and restitution? Raise the penalty, pay for more LEOs, get people to stop trying to skirt the law and let's get back to being less of a self-serving country. I would be fine with traffic cameras if a LEO watched and real time notified you of the infraction somehow. Getting the equivalent of a toll violation 2 weeks later in the mail from a corporation in another state is the problem I have.

Guilty until proven innocent is not how we want to live our lives, how long until corporate America decides to start enforcing and collecting for laws? What if I want to put a speeding camera in my front yard? The city will profit from it and people should not be speeding anyway so it makes sense. Oh yeah, I'll make money off of it and I get to decide who gets a ticket without ever taking an oath to protect and to serve, what can be wrong with that? Ticket is in the mail.
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:03 AM
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http://blog.motorists.org/everybody-...icket-cameras/
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Old 06-10-2011, 08:10 AM
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Yep--and then the taxpayers have to carry that burden as well. It is a never ending screw. Can I have salt with mine?
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:13 PM
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[QUOTE=Seacat FL;3809941)

I am actually a libertarian by philosophy. Its a pet peeve of mine.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, Seacat, you just THINK you're a Libertarian. True Libertarians understand the ramifications of this abuse by the authorities and gubment.

Y'know, you have reminded me of an incident when I wuz in colige. I stopped for a short yellow light on US1 in titusville..friggin' semi punted me dam near to Ti-Co airport. I was simply stopping quicker than he could.

You know what the cure is? BE OBSERVANT! Do you enter an intersection without looking both ways to make sure it's clear? I thought not. Well, you, and everyone, should.

Pet peeve? Why are you, as a self professed "Libertarian", trying to impose a whim of yours on the rest of society. Just like that jerk Irv slossberg. Sure, all these things "save lives". You wanna REALLY reduce traffic accidents? QUIT driving! Everything has some inherent risk..we, and our gubment, simply cannot protect a fool from himself.
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
We, and our gubment, simply cannot protect a fool from himself.
But that ain't gonna stop them from trying to legislate everything they possibly can!! Then allow the fool to sue somebody else for $$$$$$$$ settlements.

Don't you realize that there's ALWAYS somebody to blame for your own ineptness? You'll never hear the words "Yeah it's my fault." in this society again. Too many lawyers there to tell you that you're a "victim" and whose fault it is and how much they should be expected to pay, despite the fact that you are an idiot and won't admit it.

Makes me want to barf.

On edit: And then I see this thread, which just proves the point even further.
http://www.thehulltruth.com/dockside...5-million.html
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:39 PM
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Dulcecita, no argument here.

Ever drive in Yurrip, especially the Alps? Well, if you go into a hairpin turn, and you see a bunch of mini-shrines, you know someone bought the farm and you better be on your toes. Here, the gubment would straighten the road, put up ARMCO, and write tickets for speeding.

Driving in Europe is a privilege..you actually have to be able to DRIVE your car. In America, you have to be able to PARK your car...........
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Old 06-10-2011, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Dulcecita, no argument here.

Ever drive in Yurrip, especially the Alps?
No, but I drive in a 3rd world country all the time -- Mexico. Can't go but a few miles without seeing a roadside shrine. First time I drove into Mexico (Phoenix to Mazatlan), I didn't understand the whole shrine concept and kept thinking to myself "These are either incredibly religious people or incredibly bad drivers!"

Take a trip down Mex1 in Baja sometime. Talk about an eye-opener. Peer over the side of 1000 ft. plus drop-offs and count the rusted hulks of buses and semis!
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Old 06-10-2011, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by billinstuart View Post
Sorry, Seacat, you just THINK you're a Libertarian. True Libertarians understand the ramifications of this abuse by the authorities and gubment.

Y'know, you have reminded me of an incident when I wuz in colige. I stopped for a short yellow light on US1 in titusville..friggin' semi punted me dam near to Ti-Co airport. I was simply stopping quicker than he could.

You know what the cure is? BE OBSERVANT! Do you enter an intersection without looking both ways to make sure it's clear? I thought not. Well, you, and everyone, should.

Pet peeve? Why are you, as a self professed "Libertarian", trying to impose a whim of yours on the rest of society. Just like that jerk Irv slossberg. Sure, all these things "save lives". You wanna REALLY reduce traffic accidents? QUIT driving! Everything has some inherent risk..we, and our gubment, simply cannot protect a fool from himself.
I am quite sure I know at lweast as much about Libertarian philosopy as you.

How is advocating enforcement of an existing law anti-libertarian. Freeing up sworn officers for more serious offenses while maintaining enforcement of a vital law is quite libertarian. What right have you lost?

Don't like Slossberg and his seat belt law either. I don't agree with mandatory seat belt or helmet laws either. Although only a moron would ride a motorcycle without a helmet or without using the seat belts in his car. That stupidity only affects that person directly. Running red lights affects innocent people.

Actually I do check intersections before entering them. You really have no idea about my driving experience or ability so its silly to make ridiculous assertions about it.
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Old 06-10-2011, 04:36 PM
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[QUOTE=Seacat FL;3811916]
Don't like Slossberg and his seat belt law either. I don't agree with mandatory seat belt or helmet laws either. Although only a moron would ride a motorcycle without a helmet or without using the seat belts in his car. That stupidity only affects that person directly. Running red lights affects innocent people.


Seacat, I'm impressed. You can walk and chew gum at the same time. Perhaps it's simply time to agree that we vigorously disagree with each other on the camera issue?

However, I know I can outdrive you...............
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Old 06-10-2011, 04:42 PM
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[quote=billinstuart;3811932]
Originally Posted by Seacat FL View Post
Don't like Slossberg and his seat belt law either. I don't agree with mandatory seat belt or helmet laws either. Although only a moron would ride a motorcycle without a helmet or without using the seat belts in his car. That stupidity only affects that person directly. Running red lights affects innocent people.


Seacat, I'm impressed. You can walk and chew gum at the same time. Perhaps it's simply time to agree that we vigorously disagree with each other on the camera issue?

However, I know I can outdrive you...............
Maybe....maybe not
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Old 06-10-2011, 05:38 PM
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...........and, Delcecita Lures catches bigger fish than both of ya..........just ask him.

Last edited by TSA; 06-10-2011 at 06:30 PM.
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Old 06-11-2011, 05:28 AM
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If y'all get rulers out I'm leaving!
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