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Pool filter question

Old 04-28-2011, 02:32 PM
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Default Pool filter question

I have an above ground pool that is 15' x 30' x 54" deep. I went with the largest sand filter they make, mainly because I have had them before and liked them, plus maintaining them is pretty easy (just backwash). I know a paper cartridge filter removes smaller particles, but they are a bit more work to clean and filters have to be replaced occasionally. Anyhow, I asked my pool store if it would be alright to place a paper filter after my sand filter. They basically said no and acted like I was crazy to even suggest doing such a thing. Does anyone understand why this would be so bad? I figure that the paper cartridge would not have to do as much work and would last longer between cleaning. I imagine it could put a bit more back pressure on the pump, but would it be that much? Anyone ever try anything like this?
Old 04-28-2011, 03:03 PM
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It has been a long time since I was the pool boy - but when I was doing in HS, in terms best to worst filtering it was always Diatomaceous Earth, Sand, Paper. Paper would be the worst. I think you are creating more work for yourself. If you need to bump up the efficiency of your sand filter put a scoop of D.E. in the skimmer.

Are you having problems with the pool - are looking for an over engineering project?
Old 04-28-2011, 03:29 PM
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I don't know what sand system you went with but dealing with pools here and there most of the sand systems are HUGE compaired to cartridge filters. I don't know how you would go about installing a cartridge filter.
Don't back flush very often because the more crap that gets in there the better sand filters work... The sand clumps up and filters better the more debris that runs through. I backflush every 4-5 months depending on flo/PSI
Old 04-28-2011, 03:44 PM
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Floc it, really it helps the smaller particles filter....
Old 04-28-2011, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Boat Hound View Post
It has been a long time since I was the pool boy - but when I was doing in HS, in terms best to worst filtering it was always Diatomaceous Earth, Sand, Paper. Paper would be the worst. I think you are creating more work for yourself. If you need to bump up the efficiency of your sand filter put a scoop of D.E. in the skimmer.
Ditto. I maintain a commercial pool and have coated the sand filters with DE in the past. Be aware that the DE will filter the finer particulates which means you may need to backwash more often, your water clarity and gauges will tell you when you need to.
Old 04-29-2011, 03:29 AM
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I added a cartridge filter after a sand filter once. Did exactly what I thought it would and cleared up a cloudy pool. This was done maybe 20yrs ago. I dont recall any issues but the homeowner did request that I remove it. Maybe its because instead of 1 filter to maintain they ended up with 2.
P.S. I think it was a 50sq ft cartridge filter that I used.
Old 04-29-2011, 06:03 AM
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I run a pool service.. Drop about 2 cups of d.e. Filter powder in the skimmer. It will pick up the smaller particles. Most likely you have phosphates in the pool,that have built up through the winter. They are algae food and it sounds like you are on the edge of a bloom. Get some SEAKLEAR phosphate remover and pour some in. It will cloud the pool for a couple of days. Then all the algae food will drop to the bottom. Then vac an flush filter. It will help you thru summer with yellow algae and chlorine usage..
Old 04-29-2011, 07:03 AM
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I second Flock or drop down.. That will make everything sit on the bottom.. If its a lot then you will need to vaccume bottom to waste
Old 04-29-2011, 08:15 AM
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The problem with adding a cartridge filter to a pool filter system is the size of the filter. To flow an 1 1/2" or 2" line at 20psi will require a BIG filter with a lot of surface area to flow that much water. Sand is adequate, is easy backflush and lasts virtually forever.
Old 04-29-2011, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by aln View Post
The problem with adding a cartridge filter to a pool filter system is the size of the filter. To flow an 1 1/2" or 2" line at 20psi will require a BIG filter with a lot of surface area to flow that much water. Sand is adequate, is easy backflush and lasts virtually forever.
I used to have to deal with DE filters when I was a kid, and now use a cartridge filter on my pool - it seems to me that the cartridge is much less hassle, every few weeks I just take the cartridge out, hose it off, stick it back in. Most of the sand filters I have seen are at least 3x as big as cartridge filters?
Old 04-29-2011, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by GT FISH View Post
I run a pool service.. Drop about 2 cups of d.e. Filter powder in the skimmer. It will pick up the smaller particles.
This sounds great! Thanks... So basically this turns it into a DE filter?
Old 04-29-2011, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Flot View Post
I used to have to deal with DE filters when I was a kid, and now use a cartridge filter on my pool - it seems to me that the cartridge is much less hassle, every few weeks I just take the cartridge out, hose it off, stick it back in. Most of the sand filters I have seen are at least 3x as big as cartridge filters?
And the reason for that is the amount of flow they have to accomodate without restricting the pump from doing its job. It depends on how fine a particle you are going after. A hot tub size cartridge filter is sized for that amount of flow that a hot tub needs. Macaroni stop, spaghetti go down. Not very much.

Scale that same filtration and rate up to the size of a 20,000 gal pool that needs a complete turnover every hour and the filter is going to get pretty big to do the same job.
Old 04-29-2011, 03:35 PM
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Cartridge filters are smaller then sand filters but have more surface area to clean the water. Sand filters cleaning surface area is determined by the very top area of sand. Usually something like 3.14 sq ft of filtering area. The more efficient a filter is the more surface area the filter needs so it doesn't clog to quickly. If you dont want to play games with multiple filters then just purchase a QUALITY D.E. filter. D.E. filters that backwash with a multiport valve or slide valve are better than the Hayward Perflex filter that has a bump handle. Adding a properly sized cartridge filter like the size I mention would probably work fine in your situation considering it probably has at least 40sq ft more area for cleaning then your sand filter. You can add D.E. to your filter to make it more efficient but you need to watch the pressure very closely. If you have a lot of rain during the summer you will learn to hate that sand filter.
Old 04-29-2011, 04:07 PM
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Just add the blue clarifying agent to the water when you do the weekly backwash/ vacuum/ shock/ algecide treatment. Pool your size, take about 1-2oz. 32oz bottle cost about $20. Briefly, the blue stuff is a polymer that causes the "dirt" suspended in the water to stick together, making bigger "dirt" so it is more easily removed by your filter. I think the stuff is called Crystal Blue, Blue Crystal, Jet Blue, something like that, I have seen it almost everywhere pool supply chemicals are sold.

From your description of conditions I don't think you need to got to the expense of doing a "drop out" (floc). Floc-ing is pretty much the samething only it uses an anionic polymer verses the blue stuff which I believe is a cationic polymer. Or maybe the other way around, but one is anionic and the other is cationic.

Cartridge filter, I don't think you need it.
Old 04-30-2011, 06:46 AM
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Lot's of info THANKS!

What is floc?

I think based on what some are saying I might be backwashing too often. I will try to resist!

I am going to spend some time on cleaning it today and take a water sample over to get tested. Maybe get some clarifying stuff too.
Old 04-30-2011, 08:37 AM
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remove the sand and replace it with Zeo sand you use half of what the filter calls for with sand and filters down to 2 microns the equivalent of a DE filter I did it 5 years ago it was the best thing i did

http://www.zeoinc.com/zeosand.html
Old 05-01-2011, 05:28 AM
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Backwash once a week. Run filter for as many hours as you can per day. Add 1-2 gallons of bleach a week. Float slow dissolving tabs all week.
Old 05-01-2011, 06:12 AM
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Floc settles debris to the pool bottom ( cloro mor super floc out ) 11.00 bucks
And then (super blue ) clarifier , it improves your filter efficiency 14.50 at my local pool supply

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