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Old 02-05-2009, 09:33 AM
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Following is a picture from Singapore. These are ships either empty or full of empty containers with no place to go and anchored. I have never seen the water that full of container liners at anchor.

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Old 02-05-2009, 09:49 AM
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If you're up to it, drive through Newark, NJ and you will see thousands of empty containers with nowhere to go. I remember a news story recently about some guy that had an idea to make office buildings out of them.

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Old 02-05-2009, 09:59 AM
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Shipping line stocks have gone in the toilet and a year ago most were pushing $100. Recession my arse!
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Old 02-05-2009, 10:18 AM
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It aint looking pretty, but at least freight rates have come down.
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Old 02-05-2009, 10:18 AM
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If you are not moving raw goods, you can't make product. If you aren't making product, you can't ship finished goods.

Baltic Dry Index, an accurate barometer (without political bias) of economic health. It tracks the cost of moving raw materials across the oceans. It is estimated 95% of what you buy crossed at least one ocean, either as raw material, as components, or as finished goods.

A year ago, the cost of the largest ocean freighter was around $230,000 per day. Now, you can get one for around $3000 a day. That is because of supply and demand, a surplus of available ships, no demand to move raw materials across the oceans.

Raw materials are not moving across the oceans. That means product is not being manufactured. And...finished goods are not shipping.

Fwiw, I was across form the Port of Oakland last weekend. It is the 3rd largest/busiest port in the US. I have never seen the Port so not-busy before.

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Old 02-05-2009, 10:47 AM
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We export raw material and are starting to move product again. Containers are much easier to come by now as opposed to a year ago.
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Old 02-05-2009, 11:05 AM
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Raw goods are tracked separately from finished goods. Raw goods do not ship in containers, finished goods do. I think your pic is container ships, moves finished goods.

The BDI only tracks the cost to ship raw goods (ore, steel, coal, grain, bulk stuff like that). There has been a very slight bump in the cost of shipping raw goods, but nothing to get excited about. Nothing as big as a one-day swinging in the S&P-500.

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Old 02-05-2009, 11:11 AM
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Eyeball - 2/5/2009 2:05 PM

Raw goods are tracked separately from finished goods. Raw goods do not ship in containers, finished goods do. I think your pic is container ships, moves finished goods.

The BDI only tracks the cost to ship raw goods (ore, steel, coal, grain, bulk stuff like that). There has been a very slight bump in the cost of shipping raw goods, but nothing to get excited about. Nothing as big as a one-day swinging in the S&P-500.
Some raw goods ship in containers. Ours do. Some soybean meal does. DDGs do. I think malt does as well. It is just more expensive.

Or maybe they track feed ingredients as finished goods but they are considered a raw commodity to me.
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Old 02-05-2009, 11:17 AM
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Ocean freighter for $3000 per day - that is a heck of a deal. Overnight, 24 hours charters run almost that much!
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Old 02-05-2009, 11:20 AM
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When I saw the DBI had dropped 98%, to less than $3k a day to rent a giant ocean going freighter, I was thinking we could all go in together and rent one for a hell of a fishing party weekend. We could pitch tents on the deck, BBQ a cow, have a disco party ... Forget the tents; we'll park RV's on the deck.

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Old 02-05-2009, 11:49 AM
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Sounds like a heck of a business venture - gambling, whores, restaurant, trap and skeet, booze, ice, boat fuel, lodging - park that thing about thirty miles off shore - you could even make week long forays over to the Bahamas, etc. Who's in?
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Old 02-05-2009, 12:01 PM
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NJFISH - 2/5/2009 12:49 PM I remember a news story recently about some guy that had an idea to make office buildings out of them.
Funny you say that. About a year and a half ago, I was making 40' containers into mobile offices, complete with breaker panel, HVAC unit,lighting and recepts. We did 44 of them. These things could easily be "inserted" into a multi story concrete structure, similar to some motel chains, and be fitted out.



[img]../photos/get-photo.asp?photoid=38289[/img]

[img]../photos/get-photo.asp?photoid=38290[/img]

[img]../photos/get-photo.asp?photoid=38291[/img]
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Old 02-05-2009, 12:19 PM
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That is is what we lived in Iraq, minus the bars
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Old 02-05-2009, 01:18 PM
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Its great to have shipping rates this low. I ship lumber all overr the place, and getting booking dates has become so much less of a hassle, and have gone down 70%+! Its especially helpful for my polisilicon venture...
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Old 03-26-2009, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Eyeball View Post
Raw goods do not ship in containers, finished goods do. I think your pic is container ships, moves finished goods.
Here are some "raw goods" being loaded in a container to be shipped to Asia. I was snapping this pick to be used for a presentation and just remembered this thread.....

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Old 03-26-2009, 07:52 AM
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I am going to take a wild guess that the $3,000 rental of a freightor does not include the price of fuel.
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Old 03-26-2009, 09:46 AM
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I asked a friend of mine that is a big wig with one of the major shippers why they don't collapse the containers and ship them out. He said the guy that invents the way to do it cost effective will be a millionaire in the first month.
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by cudacat View Post
Sounds like a heck of a business venture - gambling, whores, restaurant, trap and skeet, booze, ice, boat fuel, lodging - park that thing about thirty miles off shore - you could even make week long forays over to the Bahamas, etc. Who's in?

That is what happened back in prohibition, it is now one of the hot dive/snorkel spots in Bimini
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Old 03-26-2009, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Just1more View Post
Funny you say that. About a year and a half ago, I was making 40' containers into mobile offices, complete with breaker panel, HVAC unit,lighting and recepts. We did 44 of them. These things could easily be "inserted" into a multi story concrete structure, similar to some motel chains, and be fitted out.

Speaking of which:

http://green.yahoo.com/blog/daily_gr...er-houses.html
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Old 03-26-2009, 03:21 PM
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A few years ago -- ok, a lot of years ago -- I tried to buy a caboose. Thought I'd set a couple rails in the back, park the caboose on it and have myself a nice little hang out, listen to some rock n roll, drink a little single malt, get into a little trouble.

Not to be -- there is/was a hell of a market for discarded cabooses. I don't know when it happened but I guess trains went to a taillight on the back of the last car instead of paying someone to watch the scenery go by from a caboose.
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