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2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

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2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

Old 11-22-2008, 05:35 AM
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Default 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

Well after spending $500 2 years ago to get this engine light fixed without success I bit the bullet and took it back to the same dealer that didn't fix it the first time. I explained everything to the man, including how they were not successful 2 years ago. He said we will fix it this time. I dropped it off and went home. He called and said it was ready, so I went to pick it up. Here is what they said they replaced this time.
1-replaced spark plugs and pvc valve. cleared codes
2-free courtesy diagnostic inspection
3-fuel flush-fuel induction service recommended based on condition of throttle body
4-removed deposits from throttle body plenum, air intake, valves, port and combustion chamber
5-replace fuel filter
6-nc emission inspection
7-disposal fees/shop supplies

total labor= $325.26
total parts= $161.44
total sulet= 0.00
Total gog=0.00
total misc charges=16.26
total misc disc=0.00
total tax=11.99

I paid up and drove off the lot. I got to the first stoplight and the engine light popped on. I turned around and went straight back to the dealership. I walked in and and told the guy the engine light was back on. The mech came out and hooked something up and said my O2 sensors were bad. Guy said we'll pull it around in the shop. I said no way you guys have no clue as to how to fix this problem. Another guy came out and I chewed on him a little bit too. They got the general manager out He said what can I do for you. I said your guys are clueless. He said ok we'll give you a full refund. I said good. I got the refund and left. Meanwhile I have until Jan 1st to get this engine light fixed or Raleigh is going to fine me. Long post but I am frustrated at this point.


Old 11-22-2008, 05:40 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

What did the diagnostic printout say - The OBD system should give you some direction. How many miles? Is the gas cap tight ? Anyway, You need to go to a dealer, or at least a parts store with free diagnostics and see what the problem is - these guys you went to are parts changers - Keep us posted...

Old 11-22-2008, 05:41 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

We've had a few discussions on here about check engine lights. Go to an auto parts store and get them to plug in a code scanner and read the code for you. Take that code and either post it here, or better - find a tahoe forum and post it there.

As for the "work" they did - I'm very impressed you got a full refund. Did they REALLY replace the spark plugs and PCV valve?
Old 11-22-2008, 05:50 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

1-PO102-MAF Low Volume. Throttle bottle carboned. spark plugs worn and pvc blocked. I didn't see the printout. 92,000 miles. gas cap is tight. I went to an Advance Auto . They hooked it up and said O2 sensor. Who knows if they replaced anything. The car doesn't run any different. Also everytime I crank it up each morning the odometer reads in a different language.
Old 11-22-2008, 05:57 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

The tahoe failed inspection. MIL Commanded-On The vehicles computer has detected a malfunction in one or more of your vehicles emission control components. A MIL Commanded ON signal indicates your computer has stored Diagnostic Trouble codes (DTC). These codes will assist your repair technician in identifying the cause of your vehicles failure.

code number description of the DTC
P0101 mass or volume circuit range/performance problem
P0135 O2 sensor heater circuit malfunction (blank 1 sensor 1)
Old 11-22-2008, 06:05 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

Does the truck have power? What is the performance problem that you see? Low manifold air flow could be caused by almost anyhting including an intake manifold gasket leak - and any leak in the intake system - this in turn may set off the O2 sensor out of range (but - look it still could all be caused by the bad O2 sensor - but I don't think the bad O2 sensor could then cause the Map or MAF sensor to set a code - I am not sure about that though) - Are you losing any coolant - mine (Intake gaskets I assume - such a slow leak that i cannot see it anywhere) started leaking at about 90,000 (4 years ago) but has not yet effected performance or set the engine light - I now have about 115,000. Intake manifold gaskets are problematic on the 5.7 gas engine - but they are not cheap to replace. I would also have the MAF or MAP sensor checked - they are relatively cheap I think and could be the whole problem - especially if the thing runs good and no coolant loss. Hopefully it is a sensor and not a mechanical problem. I will ask a friend at work about the specific PO102 Code.....

Throttle body carbon is possible and pvc worn and plugs worn are possible but very rare in my experience and obviously not the problem . There is also a chance they did not reset the light - you can do that by disconnecting the battery - at least on the older ones. It may take several restarts for the code to reappear though..

A Chevy dealer should be able to diagnose it for $75 bucks or so and then you could decide if you want to have the work done there or not...?

Old 11-22-2008, 06:15 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

Ok I just your above post...Call the dealer and ask what it would cost to repair those codes and if they have seen that combination before and what does that combination tell them (maybe it points to the manifold gasket but don't suggest that - then they could do another test to confirm ). Also a good repair shop with an ASE certified technician should be able to do this. I prefer to deal with dealers whenever a code is set - sometimes there are silent recalls or service bulletins and such ).

EPA requires by the way that the state inspection stations give you repair facility information such as which shops have the most successful repair rates and which ones if any are certified or approved by the program. unfortunately many states simply do not do this for political reasons. Dealing with these place will give you more recourse with the State. Then again I have been out of this buisnes for 5 years so maybe everything has changed

In CT we have a staff of master repair technicians to answer stuff like this - and like I said I can contact one of them Monday. Maybe the NC program has similiar support - check theri web-site.
Old 11-22-2008, 06:29 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

At 90k miles there is nothing wrong with being a parts replacer if parts are cheap. (I'd start with the MAF) First have a good look at the whole air intake side of the engine make sure nothing is disconnected or poorly fitted. You should also check the wiring and connector (get some electrical contact cleaner) going to the MAF to make sure it looks good.

I'd price out the o2 sensor(s) and the MAF sensor. The MAF on most cars is a 15 minute driveway swap out and the o2 sensor can be done by any semi-competant independant shop.

LI has great tips. After you've screwed with it you may be able to disconnect the battery for 15 mins to clear the code, or you may need to drive it a few times before the ecu clears it itself.

Also this link may have some ideas for you, but start simple. http://www.automotivehelper.com/topic224323.htm
Old 11-22-2008, 06:39 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

I had a Tahoe with the same problem....only it was brand-new. The dealership would clear the codes....said I wasn't putting the gas cap on tight enough. I told them I could only put it on so tight. After taking it back in on 2 other occasions eventually they said it was a bad vent control valve(whatever the hell that is)and replaced it. The light never came back on in the short time I owned it. That was one of the many problems I had with the POS in the 3 months I drove it. Same year as yours......
Old 11-22-2008, 07:23 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

Flot - 11/22/2008 9:29 AM

At 90k miles there is nothing wrong with being a parts replacer if parts are cheap.
Very good point!
I use that approach very often. The dealer is gonna be $100 to drive it in the door.

Also - just remembered we have a truck forum and maybe this would get some more tips there? Hope its one of these sensors and not the manifold gasket. The more I think about it all the manifold gasket failures I have seen had coolant loss also - I am not sure air leaks are common.
Old 11-22-2008, 07:32 PM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

This type of problem is almost never the O2 sensor, but rather something else causing the fuel mixture to be incorrect, triggering the O2 sensor code. Why did they ignore the MAF sensor? The problem could be as simple as cleaning it. It is not difficult, but you must use special MAF cleaner to do it. Take it to a shop that knows how to read the codes and then follow the service manual diagnostic procedure for the code. The shop you went to just did a bunch of bogus routine services and apparently did not follow the manual. You always have the option of appealing the issue to the Zone service representative. Just ask for his contact information at any dealer.
Old 11-22-2008, 08:14 PM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

check out alldata for recalls

bad o2 sensor would thow those codes
o2 sensors set the a/f ratio that it is why it is all carboned up

I will ask my buddy at GM, he is a master tech and has been since he was 18 years old
I sent him a text
Old 11-23-2008, 05:55 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

itwonder - 11/22/2008 10:32 PM

This type of problem is almost never the O2 sensor, but rather something else causing the fuel mixture to be incorrect, triggering the O2 sensor code. Why did they ignore the MAF sensor? The problem could be as simple as cleaning it. It is not difficult, but you must use special MAF cleaner to do it. Take it to a shop that knows how to read the codes and then follow the service manual diagnostic procedure for the code. The shop you went to just did a bunch of bogus routine services and apparently did not follow the manual. You always have the option of appealing the issue to the Zone service representative. Just ask for his contact information at any dealer.
Wow, I just reread your original post didn't realize you went to a Chevy dealer. ITWONDER is right - they will get it fixed if you stay with it....MAF sure is a problem that could send the out of range O2 to the O2 sensor - but they must have checked it out. There may very well be something (lots of possibilities here) causing the low or high air flow - I am surprised they didn't do other checks to find the cause - hopefully it was the sensor itself - that would be cheapest. Also would think if you has low manifold flow the computer would adjust the fuel to keep the O2 within range and you would be losing power.... ;? Good luck -
Old 11-23-2008, 06:58 AM
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LI Sound Grunt - 11/23/2008 8:55 AM
Wow, I just reread your original post didn't realize you went to a Chevy dealer. ITWONDER is right - they will get it fixed if you stay with it....
The last time I took an out of warranty vehicle to the dealer, (I like to do my own work but sometimes my schedule doesn't permit) they kept my truck for a day and gave me an estimate of $750+ to fix my problem. I told them they were out of their minds.

Do you know what the problem turned out to be? Bad ignition coil wire. $5. When I confronted them with this, they would not even refund me their $50 diagnostic fee and insisted I was lying. I learned my lesson. Poetic justice is that the dealer folded a few months later.

PS: I *have* had o2 sensors fail, it does happen...
Old 11-23-2008, 07:29 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

I will NOT take my car back to that dealer. A friend of mine is a mechanic 1 hour away. I called him. He said he could turn the light off long enough to get it inspected. He also said to take the diagnostic readout to a shop and get them to fix it. The tahoe runs fine. I just need the light to go off so I can get it inspected. To edit. How many O2 sensors are there on a 2003 Tahoe? 4 or 6?
Old 11-23-2008, 07:31 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

My experience with most American car dealers is that they usually replace parts until they find the problem. Over the years I've had many problems be of "multiple cause", according to the dealer.

I have very little faith in my dealers. They are supposed to be experts, but they never seem very good at anything but routine stuff.
Old 11-23-2008, 07:58 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

I have the same issue with a POS 03 Ford Explorer.


'I am 600 into them and it is not fixed.

they claim that it is not throwing and "hard" codes so all they can do is throw parts at it. At 90/hr plus parts, I am running it the way it is until something finally goes.

You go to the dealer b/c they have the exp and the correct diagnostics, but they don't have a clue how to fix it.

I am sticking with Nissan's from now on, my 02 pathfinder just needs brakes, tires gas and oil. No stains on the garage floor
Old 11-23-2008, 08:09 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

02 sensor. DIY, 3/4 inch wrench and 5 minutes.
Old 11-23-2008, 08:35 AM
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Default Re: 2003 tahoe engine light still on part 2

Redfish44 - 11/23/2008 10:29 AM
I will NOT take my car back to that dealer. A friend of mine is a mechanic 1 hour away. I called him. He said he could turn the light off long enough to get it inspected. I just need the light to go off so I can get it inspected.
MAYBE... but not neceessarily. You can clear the code, either with a code scanner or (sometimes) by disconnecting the battery. However the ECU will reset, and it will know how many successful starts/runs it has had without throwing a code. If it is a "real" problem the code will return quickly. (just like when you left the dealership)

As far as I know the inspection stations have heard of this before. To the best of my knowledge they will not accept a scan from a computer that has not had the minimum number of run cycles but I could be wrong.

I don't know how emissions works up there - can't you do it the old fashioned way? IE go to a shop in an sketchy neighborhood and bring a $50 bill with you.

Just a heads up. Maybe your buddy has something else up his sleeve though.
Old 11-23-2008, 08:37 AM
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Wow- I have had just the oppposite experience - I guess like politics - its all local!!!!

I have ONE independant that I trust. Another that is also good - ASE certified mechanics and all but real $$$$. If you find a good independent - you are lucky - stick with them!! In 30 years of American cars I had 2 big repairs (intake manifold gaskets as I said above) after talking to the area rep - they paid both. I know lots of crooks in this business. And those places with tire and tune-up in the name - stay away from them. Once I had a Buick with a bad rear end at almost 100,000 miles - they bought that too.

John - do you guys from Madison actually drive American cars? Jackson Chevrolet in Middletown is a very honest and I have found the costs to be the same as everyone else. I would go there anytime the engine service light illuminates. At least they have to have trained technicians. As I have found most independents to be parts changers, and either stupid or crooked. And often not very good at that. Hey its free enterprise here folks - wherever you go they are going to try to sell you repairs - I know of dealer and chain shop service managers that will get fired if the average repair bill goes under 1200.

At least with the dealers you have recourse - the area manager as said above. [ BEGIN OFF TOPIC RANT - As far as American cars go - I could care less what their image is, and wether or not the foreign jobs may have higher "quality". In 30 years I have seemed to be able to get around Ok with probably less repair costs than most others I know of. I don't care if I don't look cool or rich. And, I don't criticize anyone for buying a rice burner - some of my best friends have them - but I will NEVER buy one. I think it says it all about us that we give free government welfare to paper pushers on Wall street that push paper - with no strings attached then refuse to bail out the US manufacturers who actually PRODUCE something- and then say well maybe - if you bring back a plan.... What about Wall street - they didnt need any plan to use the $$ to buy other banks, pay for bonuses, give themselves raises, and just plain hoard it. I mean the Europenas subsidize their companies with free research and development - free health insurance and free loans whenever needed - and in the end they end with a favorable balance of payments - and at the expense of the value of our dollar. So maybe these vehicles are not quite the bargain we think they are ;? we are becomming a country that values $$$$ above all else and produces nothing. There was a post on the bailouts wher eone of our members admitted he went to college so he didn't have to work. Well, there it is - couldn't have said it better myself. Maybe its time for JC to come back down and clear the money cahngers off the Temple steps again. ]

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