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Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

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Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Old 09-19-2008, 06:23 AM
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Default Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

(BN) 09:22 *U.S. TREASURY TO MAKE EXTRA SPOT IN PLAYOFFS FOR NEW YORK YANKEES
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Old 09-19-2008, 07:27 AM
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Default RE: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

That should be next.

Good take on legislating a bottom. We can either pay now or pay later. Let's see, there is an election soon, so let's pay later.

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Old 09-19-2008, 07:53 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Paying later is a better option if the alternative is for the herd market psychology to overshoot the reality of what this will really cost. A runaway accelerating train will do more damage than one that has been diverted to go around a few curves. The short selling curbs have been long overdue.

Also, if we stem the equity meltdown, the number of borrowers that are knocked out by a violent contraction will be lower, and the inflation that we will introduce will tend to bolster real estate prices, pushing them out of the red.

It's the right call. This is not the time to play ideological caveman - "bail-out bad, free market capitalism good...." The issue was caused by an excessive hands off philosophy - we need to balance out the scorecard.
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:09 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Government bail outs....so easy a caveman can do it?

uugggh, socialism bad, capitalism good. ugggg
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:52 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

I am with you GWcpa
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:43 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Main street pays so that Wall Street can keep playing
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Old 09-19-2008, 10:36 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

This isn't the 1930s. The impact of a financial meltdown will be felt by all of main street through 401ks, small business contraction, unemployment. All we are doing is spreading the payments out over time and avoiding a runaway panic which would cause more pain than the bailout would on balance, due to the effect of a panic, and the time value of money. The only ones who don't benefit are those who have no savings or home ownership, and they don't pay taxes anyway, so it doesn't cost them anything.

The "benefit" to corporate CEOs is a tiny fraction compared to the impact to the average family.

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Old 09-19-2008, 11:27 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

I think the bailout is asinine. What will we have learned other than if you phukk up, big Daddy is there for you? The only way I agree with it is IF and only IF significant reform and regulation to avoid this situation is implemented. Of course, that's a dual edged sword because we're talking about gubmint...

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Old 09-19-2008, 12:08 PM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

The government is paying cash for trash.
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Old 09-19-2008, 06:58 PM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Jimm - 9/19/2008 3:08 PM

The government is paying cash for trash.
on paper............the way it sits now. Potentially, they stand to make the biggest market investment in the history of mankind, with a possible payout that can more than offset the costs involved.
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Old 09-19-2008, 07:09 PM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

The difference is that they can legally float the underwater mortgages and not have to worry about marking to market all the way to insolvency like a public company would. What that means is that the deadweight loss from foreclosures and walk-aways will be much less than it would if they didn't step in
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:46 PM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

joenew61 - 9/19/2008 10:09 PM The difference is that they can legally float the underwater mortgages and not have to worry about marking to market all the way to insolvency like a public company would. What that means is that the deadweight loss from foreclosures and walk-aways will be much less than it would if they didn't step in
And that the US taxpayer ends up footing the bill.

And guys like the CEO of AIG work for 8 months and get a check to leave for $8 million.

How does one go about getting a job where all he does is run the company in the ground and get a multi 6 figure check to quit doing it?? That's so simple...even a CEO could do it.
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Old 09-20-2008, 06:18 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Joe - 9/19/2008 11:46 PM



joenew61 - 9/19/2008 10:09 PM The difference is that they can legally float the underwater mortgages and not have to worry about marking to market all the way to insolvency like a public company would. What that means is that the deadweight loss from foreclosures and walk-aways will be much less than it would if they didn't step in
And that the US taxpayer ends up footing the bill.

And guys like the CEO of AIG work for 8 months and get a check to leave for $8 million.

How does one go about getting a job where all he does is run the company in the ground and get a multi 6 figure check to quit doing it?? That's so simple...even a CEO could do it.
What you are proposing is classic cutting off your nose to spite your face. It sux that those guys are walking away with anything, but it is a small price to pay to avoid a 25% market correction and all the damage that would do to the real economy.

It would be great if we threw those guys in jail and took that payout to help defray the costs, but again it would be a pittance compared to what we lose if we allow the economy to free fall.

Given the stakes, now is not a time to be a idealogue, we have to be practical.
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Old 09-20-2008, 07:33 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

I have to agree with joenew61. These jerks have put us between a rock and a hard place, the best we can do is find the least painful way out.

We can't go back in time to fix the screw ups but we can fix them going forward. I think it's time for some actual regulation in multiple industries; Banking, Wall Street, and Oil to name a few. I think greed has outstripped ethics in this country. Business has to look past the next quarter's results to get us back on a good footing. Long term lends itself to good ethics.

Why is it okay to lend money to someone with bad credit when you know the loan is going to go bad? Why is it alright to let short sellers drive the price of a stock into the ground? Why do we allow oil companies to drive up the price of crude thru speculation? Why do we allow the Enrons, Bear Stearns, and AIGs to put us in the position we now find ourselves?

I think lots of people saw this train wreck coming. It's just that the people in a position to do something about it turned a blind eye while they fattened their personal accounts, whether those accounts were monetary, political, or otherwise.
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Old 09-20-2008, 07:41 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

joenew61 - 9/20/2008 9:18 AM

Joe - 9/19/2008 11:46 PM



joenew61 - 9/19/2008 10:09 PM The difference is that they can legally float the underwater mortgages and not have to worry about marking to market all the way to insolvency like a public company would. What that means is that the deadweight loss from foreclosures and walk-aways will be much less than it would if they didn't step in
And that the US taxpayer ends up footing the bill.

And guys like the CEO of AIG work for 8 months and get a check to leave for $8 million.

How does one go about getting a job where all he does is run the company in the ground and get a multi 6 figure check to quit doing it?? That's so simple...even a CEO could do it.
What you are proposing is classic cutting off your nose to spite your face. It sux that those guys are walking away with anything, but it is a small price to pay to avoid a 25% market correction and all the damage that would do to the real economy.

It would be great if we threw those guys in jail and took that payout to help defray the costs, but again it would be a pittance compared to what we lose if we allow the economy to free fall.

Given the stakes, now is not a time to be a idealogue, we have to be practical.
I still don't see a reason why the CEO's shouldn't loose the payout money and be put in jail. What's wrong with exacting justice and showing others that there are consequences for screwing millions of people?

These guys are MONEY MANAGERS. How could they not know what was going on? Yet all they did was fiddle while Rome was burning and they kept making millions pretending it was all OK. Sorry, time to go to jail and stay there for a long time.
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Old 09-20-2008, 07:57 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Lumping the oil market with the finacials does not make sense. Congress had been told on many occasions that allowing Freddie and Franny take on all comers was nonsense. They made loans on blank applications, they made loans to low income persons were the payment was equal to there income. Loans were made with teaser rates then reset at 4 times the original rate. Once the loans were made then the paper was sliced and diced and was being sold over and over until the homeowner quit paying or walked away. Pleanty of greed to go around, regulation and oversite was not allowed as Congress had mandated that everyone needed to be a homeowner.
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Old 09-20-2008, 08:10 AM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Hydro - 9/20/2008 10:41 AM
joenew61 - 9/20/2008 9:18 AM
Joe - 9/19/2008 11:46 PM

joenew61 - 9/19/2008 10:09 PM The difference is that they can legally float the underwater mortgages and not have to worry about marking to market all the way to insolvency like a public company would. What that means is that the deadweight loss from foreclosures and walk-aways will be much less than it would if they didn't step in
And that the US taxpayer ends up footing the bill.

And guys like the CEO of AIG work for 8 months and get a check to leave for $8 million.

How does one go about getting a job where all he does is run the company in the ground and get a multi 6 figure check to quit doing it?? That's so simple...even a CEO could do it.
What you are proposing is classic cutting off your nose to spite your face. It sux that those guys are walking away with anything, but it is a small price to pay to avoid a 25% market correction and all the damage that would do to the real economy. It would be great if we threw those guys in jail and took that payout to help defray the costs, but again it would be a pittance compared to what we lose if we allow the economy to free fall. Given the stakes, now is not a time to be a idealogue, we have to be practical.
I still don't see a reason why the CEO's shouldn't loose the payout money and be put in jail. What's wrong with exacting justice and showing others that there are consequences for screwing millions of people? These guys are MONEY MANAGERS. How could they not know what was going on? Yet all they did was fiddle while Rome was burning and they kept making millions pretending it was all OK. Sorry, time to go to jail and stay there for a long time.
Exactly. Even it's $5..if it exacts some amount of retribution for what these folks knowingly did, then they need to pay up. The $8million the CEO of AIG walks with is obviously a pittance in the grand scheme of the $1/2 TRILLION bailout plan.

But if it doesn't matter, then why should he get it?
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Old 09-20-2008, 07:19 PM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

I wonder how many of you are willing to give back everything that you have made or gained on the value of your homes and other real estate in the past 10 years, that is above the average yearly gain for the previous 30 years?
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Old 09-20-2008, 07:30 PM
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Default Re: Wow Government legislates a bottom. but have you seen this headline??????

Joe - 9/20/2008 11:10 AM

Hydro - 9/20/2008 10:41 AM
joenew61 - 9/20/2008 9:18 AM
Joe - 9/19/2008 11:46 PM

joenew61 - 9/19/2008 10:09 PM The difference is that they can legally float the underwater mortgages and not have to worry about marking to market all the way to insolvency like a public company would. What that means is that the deadweight loss from foreclosures and walk-aways will be much less than it would if they didn't step in
And that the US taxpayer ends up footing the bill.

And guys like the CEO of AIG work for 8 months and get a check to leave for $8 million.

How does one go about getting a job where all he does is run the company in the ground and get a multi 6 figure check to quit doing it?? That's so simple...even a CEO could do it.
What you are proposing is classic cutting off your nose to spite your face. It sux that those guys are walking away with anything, but it is a small price to pay to avoid a 25% market correction and all the damage that would do to the real economy. It would be great if we threw those guys in jail and took that payout to help defray the costs, but again it would be a pittance compared to what we lose if we allow the economy to free fall. Given the stakes, now is not a time to be a idealogue, we have to be practical.
I still don't see a reason why the CEO's shouldn't loose the payout money and be put in jail. What's wrong with exacting justice and showing others that there are consequences for screwing millions of people? These guys are MONEY MANAGERS. How could they not know what was going on? Yet all they did was fiddle while Rome was burning and they kept making millions pretending it was all OK. Sorry, time to go to jail and stay there for a long time.
Exactly. Even it's $5..if it exacts some amount of retribution for what these folks knowingly did, then they need to pay up. The $8million the CEO of AIG walks with is obviously a pittance in the grand scheme of the $1/2 TRILLION bailout plan.

But if it doesn't matter, then why should he get it?
I am all for turning them into those two old guys from the Eddie Murphy movie Trading Places - I just don't think it is going to happen, and whether we do or don;t make them pay a penalty doesn't change the decision on what to do with the bailout.
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