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First AR-15 (budget)

Old 08-10-2020, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by JCM 1420 View Post
I have the Smith and Wesson, I think itís a decent quality gun, but Iím not an AR enthusiast, fine shotguns are a different story.

Im also taking notes from this thread, may order the parts and try to build a little higher end gun in the near future.

Not to hikack, but anyone got a good lead on bull 5.56 brass rounds?

Also, to hijack further, whoís gone through setting up a trust for a sbr and suppressor?
DM me. Iíve gone through the NFA process many times.
Old 08-10-2020, 06:16 PM
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The S&W MP15 is a solid rifle that is basic military style. No frilly extras to break or cause problems with later upgrades. Trust me on this one, make sure whatever you get, it has a removable carry handle. Thank me later. Also check out the Springfield Saint lineup. Solid AR's and if you catch them right, they can come in under your budget.
Old 08-10-2020, 08:14 PM
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There's a channel on YouTube, they do AR melt downs. Basically put a full auto lower on whatever production upper and do mag dumps til the upper finally fails. They had a recent with the S&W, they were rather impressed by how long it lasted. The handguards were melting but it kept going
Old 08-11-2020, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by JCM 1420 View Post
I have the Smith and Wesson, I think itís a decent quality gun, but Iím not an AR enthusiast, fine shotguns are a different story.

Im also taking notes from this thread, may order the parts and try to build a little higher end gun in the near future.

Not to hikack, but anyone got a good lead on bull 5.56 brass rounds?

Also, to hijack further, whoís gone through setting up a trust for a sbr and suppressor?
I would never go through the SBR process unless I absolutely had to....the 9 months wait then all the rules. Getting permission to cross state lines and many others.

Just build a pistol and non of that stuff applies. I have 3 AR pistols, they my favorites at the range and you can shoulder them...
Old 08-11-2020, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Cracker View Post
I would never go through the SBR process unless I absolutely had to....the 9 months wait then all the rules. Getting permission to cross state lines and many others.

Just build a pistol and non of that stuff applies. I have 3 AR pistols, they my favorites at the range and you can shoulder them...
Not entirely true. You can eFile Form 1 online and your approval process can take less than a month. The 9 month wait is for a Form 4 which is a transfer of an NFA item. Form 1 is for the manufacturing. I did an eFile Form 1 for a AR lower and it got approved in 12 days.

But other than the cool factor, I agree with you 100%. With the technology of modern braces, there's really no reason to SBR anything other than for the cool factor.
Old 08-11-2020, 06:41 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by Cracker View Post
I would never go through the SBR process unless I absolutely had to....the 9 months wait then all the rules. Getting permission to cross state lines and many others.

Just build a pistol and non of that stuff applies. I have 3 AR pistols, they my favorites at the range and you can shoulder them...
But there are the weird rules. Unless I'm wrong, a vertical fore-grip added to a pistol makes it an SBR not a pistol anymore and thus you need the stamp. Things like that.
Old 08-11-2020, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by TorFed View Post
But there are the weird rules. Unless I'm wrong, a vertical fore-grip added to a pistol makes it an SBR not a pistol anymore and thus you need the stamp. Things like that.
technically it's not a pistol anymore but an AOW (Any Other Weapon). You can put a vertical grip if you meet certain overall length requirements (greater than 26") and as long as you don't conceal it.

The NFA rules are ridiculously stupid and they need to go bye bye. No reason any of this shit should be regulated the way it is. And also these rules change all of the time when some idiot writes a letter to the ATF for clarification and every time they change their minds on the rules. So just be careful with whatever you do.
Old 08-11-2020, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by kernmw10 View Post
technically it's not a pistol anymore but an AOW (Any Other Weapon). You can put a vertical grip if you meet certain overall length requirements (greater than 26") and as long as you don't conceal it.

The NFA rules are ridiculously stupid and they need to go bye bye. No reason any of this shit should be regulated the way it is.
To clarify, isn't the 26" fully collapsed? I am just likely putting one together and navigating the nonsensical rules is a PIA. Does an angled fore grip also make it an AOW?
Old 08-11-2020, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by TorFed View Post
To clarify, isn't the 26" fully collapsed? I am just likely putting one together and navigating the nonsensical rules is a PIA. Does an angled fore grip also make it an AOW?
The new way they are measuring is without the brace on; so from the standard size buffer tube to the muzzle (without muzzle device if it's not pin and welded). They also mentioned a 90 degree to the bore being vertical, so technically anything slightly angled and you're good to go. However, my self proclaimed knowledge may not hold up to an ATF agent; even though I think I know more than them. I don't want to be hit with an AOW charge so I pretty much run hand stops on all of my AR pistols and if I really want a vertical grip then I SBR it.

* I'm not an attorney. But I pay very close attention to the rules and I think I have a better understanding than most.
Old 08-11-2020, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Cracker View Post
I would never go through the SBR process unless I absolutely had to....the 9 months wait then all the rules. Getting permission to cross state lines and many others.

Just build a pistol and non of that stuff applies. I have 3 AR pistols, they my favorites at the range and you can shoulder them...
If you put anything on the buffer tube that hakes it able to be shouldered, then you have made an SBR and it is an illegal NFA firearm. They do make some pistol grips that have the same effect but it is dancing on a very gray area.
With NFA, you must be very careful with how you tread. If you run across the wrong FED, you will be defending yourself in court and I know several people who have went that route. It usually ends up in a federal prison.
Just like with an SKS rifle. Anytime that the ATF tech branch gets an SKS to test, the owner will become a felon. They know how to make them fire more than one round with the pull of a trigger.
Old 08-11-2020, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by kernmw10 View Post
And also these rules change all of the time when some idiot writes a letter to the ATF for clarification and every time they change their minds on the rules.
DO NOT EVER DO THIS..... i.e. write a letter to the ATF.
Old 08-11-2020, 08:03 AM
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Originally Posted by bakerjw View Post
If you put anything on the buffer tube that hakes it able to be shouldered, then you have made an SBR and it is an illegal NFA firearm. They do make some pistol grips that have the same effect but it is dancing on a very gray area.
With NFA, you must be very careful with how you tread. If you run across the wrong FED, you will be defending yourself in court and I know several people who have went that route. It usually ends up in a federal prison.
Just like with an SKS rifle. Anytime that the ATF tech branch gets an SKS to test, the owner will become a felon. They know how to make them fire more than one round with the pull of a trigger.
thatís not true. If you put a stock on it then yes. But A pistol stabilizing brace can be shouldered. You did not change the original design of the brace so it doesnít change the definition if itís shouldered. Itís not okay to say ďif you put anything on the buffer tubeĒ because you can put a stabilizing brace which was engineered and designed to be fired with one hand but if the user decides to shoulder it then is doesnt mechanically change the purpose or function of the brace itself - so itís okay to shoulder a brace.
Old 08-11-2020, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by bakerjw View Post
If you put anything on the buffer tube that hakes it able to be shouldered, then you have made an SBR and it is an illegal NFA firearm. They do make some pistol grips that have the same effect but it is dancing on a very gray area.
With NFA, you must be very careful with how you tread. If you run across the wrong FED, you will be defending yourself in court and I know several people who have went that route. It usually ends up in a federal prison.
Just like with an SKS rifle. Anytime that the ATF tech branch gets an SKS to test, the owner will become a felon. They know how to make them fire more than one round with the pull of a trigger.
Not true, if you put a stock on a pistol buffer tube OR modify a pistol brace then it is technically illegal...I would not attach anything or even change the velcro or remove velcro from the pistol brace. Keep the brace 100 percent original and you should be good and as I stated you can shoulder or cheek the brace..
Old 08-11-2020, 09:51 AM
  #54  
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Rock River Arms builds a good gun. Iíve had mine for years. Round count is between 8k to 10k. I replaced all the springs once just for good measure.

Iíve used it for 3 gun matches practice/training and hunting. Iíve killed more south Texas deer hogs and vermin with 556/223 than any other cartridge. I do use black hills 62 grain Barnes hollow points while hunting.
Old 08-11-2020, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by reelin in the keys View Post
I have had great luck with DPMS for a well priced entry level AR platform and then made it how I wanted from there .
I have both AR-10 and AR-15 from them - love them both.
Old 08-11-2020, 10:45 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by clt_capt View Post
I have both AR-10 and AR-15 from them - love them both.
Yep, it is too bad DPMS went out of business. They built some good reliable stuff..loved mine too..

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