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Defund the Police - Serious Question

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Defund the Police - Serious Question

Old 06-15-2020, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by dave8311 View Post
What did Breonna Taylor in Louisville do? Is sitting quietly at your home illegal?
Old 06-15-2020, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by simonj31 View Post
What did Breonna Taylor in Louisville do? Is sitting quietly at your home illegal?
What does that situation have anything to do with the topic of this thread?


Old 06-15-2020, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by dave8311 View Post
What does that situation have anything to do with the topic of this thread?
Im not sure if you're serious or not. But it is extremely relevant to the image you posted. Meaning, she was not doing anything illegal but was still contacted (murdered) by the police.
Old 06-15-2020, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by simonj31 View Post
Im not sure if you're serious or not. But it is extremely relevant to the image you posted. Meaning, she was not doing anything illegal but was still contacted (murdered) by the police.
And how would defunding have helped in that situation?




Old 06-15-2020, 12:32 PM
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I was simply refuting your off topic post. I will apologize to the mods since apparently you are the only one who can post off topic images.

Last edited by simonj31; 06-15-2020 at 12:37 PM. Reason: typo
Old 06-15-2020, 12:38 PM
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I am sure you can find an MRAP pretty cheap, at least based on the melt price of the steel but like buying an old airplane, the maintenance and price of parts would kill you. That is what the PDs are finding out. The machine guns are more problematic since ATF will not allow them into the civilian registry.
I do think they have a point, demonstrated in Atlanta that the no knock warrant should be evaluated more closely if not eliminated entirely. People should go to jail over the death of that woman ... by a mistake that was criminal in it's outcome.
If you break into my house at night I am shooting at you too, with something that will penetrate most body armor.
I support the police and I am going to do what they say on the street but in my home, at 5AM I may not be as accommodating. I would expect a home invader to say they were the police and they might be dressed like ninjas too.
Old 06-15-2020, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by RusticHills View Post
I am done..I plan to do the least amount possible and avoid any situations that put me in a position where I have to use violence to defend the public..

That's what the dems and libs want and I'm in self-preservation mode at this point.

I'm sorry it's come to this, but many officers are of the same mind and our communities are going to be a lot less safe in the near future..
I'm not a LEO but if I were I agree, faced with the choice of just letting them leave I would probably not use force to stop them unless someone's life was imminently in danger.
Old 06-15-2020, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Garett View Post
Only a white person could say something so dumb as that.
That sure sounds racist to me.
Old 06-15-2020, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mikefloyd View Post
I'm not a LEO but if I were I agree, faced with the choice of just letting them leave I would probably not use force to stop them unless someone's life was imminently in danger.
Not even sure that "someone's life was imminently in danger" even matters any more...
Old 06-15-2020, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by badcrazy View Post
Not even sure that "someone's life was imminently in danger" even matters any more...
The only thing that matters is the perp/victim's skin color and the officer's skin color..
Old 06-15-2020, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by simonj31 View Post
What did Breonna Taylor in Louisville do? Is sitting quietly at your home illegal?
She had a prior relationship with a drug dealer.

Last edited by ronp364; 06-15-2020 at 01:33 PM. Reason: clarity
Old 06-15-2020, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by km1125 View Post
I have a feeling a LOT of other folks in the profession are thinking the same way, and our society will be worse off for it. It will take over a decade to recover from this. The first half as we spiral down the abyss and see increasing violent crimes and more folks relying on self-preservation methods. Eventually, we"ll get some serious leadership that says "enough is enough" and starts rebuilding society into one based on laws and appropriate enforcement to maintain order. Not sure how many will perish in that decade, but it won't be insignificant numbers.
I spoke with my 50 year old nephew the other evening. In 11 months he has 25 years in and is throwing in the towel. I don't blame him in the least and I suspect that he is not an isolated incident.
Old 06-15-2020, 01:47 PM
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What about that Texas police woman that walked into the wrong apartment and killed the guy just chilling in his apartment?

No way would I be a cop. That job is too riddled with unknowns.
Old 06-15-2020, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by gfretwell View Post
The machine guns are more problematic since ATF will not allow them into the civilian registry.
All full automatic firearms are in the NFA registry. It is a matter of if they were entered before May of 86. Those in the registry prior to May of 86 are transferable to those living in areas where possession is allowed. i.e. NFA friendly.
Old 06-15-2020, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Garett View Post
Only a white person could say something so dumb as that.
Your reply is also pretty ignorant, she was killed as the cops busted in and the shooting started, the man in the house opened fire, shoot at the cops and they will probably shoot back....the no knock warrent set the events in motion, the cops were serving a legal warrent, signed by a judge, she was in the wrong place at the wrong time, very sad and senseless, blame the judge and administration, not the street cops, what does this have to do with race btw? She was shot because she was black?
Old 06-15-2020, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by simonj31 View Post
Im not sure if you're serious or not. But it is extremely relevant to the image you posted. Meaning, she was not doing anything illegal but was still contacted (murdered) by the police.
Do you have any clue what the definition of murder is?
Old 06-15-2020, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by beber View Post
I'd just like to point out that Police are civilians too, somewhere that line has been blurred.

I'd like to point out the difference in training between the two. If you want to hold them to a higher standard, give them the tools to do it. Don't cuff them and then send them into a fight on someone else behalf which is kind of their job description. They are policing on behalf of the citizens and running down trouble that they don't want so we can live in a civilized community which is loosely defined at best depending on who you are talking too.

You want to dismantle/defund/demilitarize the PD in ILM, I'd like to see your plan to put it back together.
Old 06-15-2020, 02:32 PM
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It is all coming around alright.... I do agree the no knock warrants are probably not needed for dope, so they flush it big deal..
Old 06-15-2020, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by badcrazy View Post
Not even sure that "someone's life was imminently in danger" even matters any more...
It would matter to me; I could not stand there and let someone die just to save my job.
Old 06-15-2020, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by ytmorris View Post
I see one of the largest problems facing the Police is that they have no clear objective in this day and time. Some want them to be social workers, some want guardians, and some want spec op soldiers. There is an even larger group that wants them to do all of it. They wear more hats than they should have to and anyone in any other profession would demand an absurd amount of money to perform that many jobs.

Oversight is fine. They should all have body cams and I am even fine with a review board made up of private citizens of various backgrounds, officials, and police BUT anyone involved with that review process should have a basic BLET course and mandatory continuing ed in the form of ride alongs, current tactics, and a clear understanding of law. If a member of that board doesn't meet thier obligation, they are removed. Knee jerk reactions from politicians will be the death of good proactive policing in America.

The idea of demilitarizing the police is an interesting one. Locally, the chief insisted on a traditional polyester uniform over a much more comfortable and cooler uniform consisting of BDUs, highviz uniform shirt, and an external vest/carrier because the lower income neighborhoods said it was too intimidating. Many officers already had both uniforms. My opinion was to keep the officers as comfortable as possible. I want our ERT or SWAT to have the best equipment possible to combat any potential problem. Heavy training, an armored vehicle, AR-15, m-4, etc... is a benefit to the community and the officer as we ask them to potentially put themselves in harms way in order to handle an issue quickly. I have also found that people throw "military grade" around like they know what that is. It ain't always a good thing.

We live in a world where the gold standard police chiefs have long been retired and dead. The ones that would call it correctly by standing against political pressure if their officers were right, but would condemn, terminate, or charge an officer in the wrong. The current chain of command is more worried about their pensions and not making waves with city councils, city managers, or mayors. A lot of them will throw an officer away to keep that money coming. Politicians are in control of policing in America as politics reign supreme in most departments across the nation.

Officer retention is hard for any department especially as the thought of working in more hostile conditions, with less training/equipment, with less qualified officers, less qualified superiors, and for potentially less money comes into play. There will be a huge personnel gap in the coming years that will be tough to fill. The money taken from the departments will end up leading to more unnecessary officer and civilian deaths. Decreasing one's readiness and effectiveness plays on one's confidence. Officers need to be confident and in control 100% the time in 100% of encounters for safety reasons. At the same time, civilians need to know that they are safe with any given officer. They need to be open to conversation and interaction.

Dismantling and defunding a system that is 99.5% positive doesn't make any since to me.
Seems as though we have criminalized almost all aspects of our lives to varying degrees. Not the doing of the police but the politicians ask them to enforce it all and the police comply. Maybe it is time to re-evaluate that and decriminalize a lot of things. For a 'free' country we have a significant number of our citizens in prison.

Not every poor decision or vice in life is or should be "Illegal".

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