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Eastward Boats Hull #4 "Salty Sway"

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Eastward Boats Hull #4 "Salty Sway"

Old 06-24-2019, 04:56 PM
  #201  
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Originally Posted by crackerasscracker View Post


He did fine and he didn’t dive under someone’s boat that was on anchor so...
divers under the boat? Time to dump about 10-15 gal of shark chum.
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Old 06-25-2019, 05:09 PM
  #202  
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Originally Posted by Diverboy264 View Post



So, do you have any real world numbers on fuel burn and speed now that you have loaded your dive gear, ice and fuel?
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Old 06-25-2019, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by cold beers View Post
So, do you have any real world numbers on fuel burn and speed now that you have loaded your dive gear, ice and fuel?
I only filled up both fuel tanks half way, 4 people, 2 divers, 6 tanks, and 60lbs of ice. It’s really a lite load compared to our normal trips. We averaged 32 mph @ 1.6mpg. I will continue to post updates as I get it better dialed in. I still plan to run a few other props, just not sure when.
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Old 06-25-2019, 07:16 PM
  #204  
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I still don't understand how 20% more 4 stroke power gets the same performance as was reported on the demo with G2's.
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Old 06-25-2019, 07:41 PM
  #205  
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Originally Posted by Bullshipper View Post
I still don't understand how 20% more 4 stroke power gets the same performance as was reported on the demo with G2's.
Wasn’t the demo a stripped boat? A hard top and full enclosure can have a big effect.
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Old 06-25-2019, 08:09 PM
  #206  
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Originally Posted by billablehours View Post


Wasn’t the demo a stripped boat? A hard top and full enclosure can have a big effect.
​Full disclosure. I have no idea what I'm talking about. Lol

I agree. There were additions on this boat that weren't on the demo (hard top with enclosure, coffin box, infloor boxes, tackle center, livewells, extended platform, speakers). So basically alot of variables in weight and aerodynamics.

We will have another data point when my boat is finished. And possibly even more important the CC right behind mine is configured like the demo but will have 300hp evinrude g2s.

So it could be that's all she will do. Or maybe like Mark wrote about his friend with the Twinvee and 7 prop changes later, they figured out what the suzuki liked.

Personally, I feel like there is more there. How much more is the question and if it is worth the time. Lost time spearing fish. Maybe something to work on in the winter?

As long as mine does 40 at 1.5 I'm happy #goals
Lol j/k





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Old 06-25-2019, 09:00 PM
  #207  
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Originally Posted by billablehours View Post


Wasn’t the demo a stripped boat? A hard top and full enclosure can have a big effect.
The first hull with a pair of 250 G2's, full tanks, T-top, 6 or 8 people at the Miami boat show still did 51.

I'm with UCF. Keep playing with props and maybe raise engines one more hole. There's more there but I don't think and of the 4S can match the G2 speeds or economy.

I'm on the fence only about whether I want the 300's or stick with 250's for the economy.
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Old 06-25-2019, 09:00 PM
  #208  
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Originally Posted by UCF View Post
​Full disclosure. I have no idea what I'm talking about. Lol

Kinda
This is THT, that applies to 99.999999999% of posts lol
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Old 06-25-2019, 09:39 PM
  #209  
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Dave ran out of time and props to properly do a full test. Granted the demo and #4 had different weights the Suzuki's should have had better numbers. Also, the Simrad GPS engine data would only go to a certain RPM (6k rpm?) range and only hit 5700 max. I spoke with Dave on this and being that the motors are new (break in period), he didn't want to hit the max RPM for fear of mechanical issues even though the motor had rev limiters and warranty. Also, the delivery date promissed, no time to test multiple props, and fear of lack of break in period hindered a proper performance bulletin. 100HP more and the same results? The motor height/props need to be solved for best results. It'll come in time. In my opinion, including myself, so many folks were demanding 300 numbers and when you rush, you get spotty results. Proper time and testing will prevail. I'm sure UCF will get it figured out and tested. Maybe in another week we get to see another wet boat. MD.
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Old 06-26-2019, 02:53 AM
  #210  
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Here's a link to our performance report on my demo, powered with Evinrude G2 250s. The picture on the top is how the boat was set up when we ran the first set of numbers (no T-Top). The SINGLE ENGINE performance numbers on the bottom of the report is how we have the boat set up now with the T-Top.
Performance Report
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Old 06-26-2019, 03:17 AM
  #211  
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When we ran the numbers on #4 Salty Sway, I too thought we should have gotten better MPG and speed. I contacted PowerTech and gave them the numbers so they could suggest a different prop. I was guessing an OFX 4-blade 20 pitch? PowerTech told me that we were presently at 92% efficiency which is only a 8% slip - don't touch it.

I then called a local Suzuki dealer that has been around a long time and asked his opinion. He too said we were there. He directed me to the Suzuki website performance reports, 31' TV powered with the same 300s and the same 3-blade 20" props. All of the low end, mid-range and cruise numbers are basically the same as what we got with our setup. They did have a higher top end speed, but had to run a higher trim to get more rpm to get it.

When I ran Salty Sway, I stopped trimming before the needle went into the redline. I know Suzuki says you can go past 6K but I also have fought with Suzuki many times in the past over warranty issues and wasn't about to run a customers engines past the gauges redline.



This is an actual picture of the Simrad MFD on Salty Sway while we were running the numbers.

With all this talk about the numbers, don't lose sight of how Salty Sway performed otherwise. She ran great. No cavitation. Incredibly smooth. We ran out the inlet and on the way back in (average 5' inlet slop) you can let go of the wheel in a 3/4 following sea and she tracked like it was on a set or rails. That to me is a better bench mark to gauge the boats overall performance.
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Old 06-26-2019, 06:32 AM
  #212  
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Originally Posted by BassnBays View Post
When we ran the numbers on #4 Salty Sway, I too thought we should have gotten better MPG and speed. I contacted PowerTech and gave them the numbers so they could suggest a different prop. I was guessing an OFX 4-blade 20 pitch? PowerTech told me that we were presently at 92% efficiency which is only a 8% slip - don't touch it.

I then called a local Suzuki dealer that has been around a long time and asked his opinion. He too said we were there. He directed me to the Suzuki website performance reports, 31' TV powered with the same 300s and the same 3-blade 20" props. All of the low end, mid-range and cruise numbers are basically the same as what we got with our setup. They did have a higher top end speed, but had to run a higher trim to get more rpm to get it.

When I ran Salty Sway, I stopped trimming before the needle went into the redline. I know Suzuki says you can go past 6K but I also have fought with Suzuki many times in the past over warranty issues and wasn't about to run a customers engines past the gauges redline.



This is an actual picture of the Simrad MFD on Salty Sway while we were running the numbers.

With all this talk about the numbers, don't lose sight of how Salty Sway performed otherwise. She ran great. No cavitation. Incredibly smooth. We ran out the inlet and on the way back in (average 5' inlet slop) you can let go of the wheel in a 3/4 following sea and she tracked like it was on a set or rails. That to me is a better bench mark to gauge the boats overall performance.
Really appreciate your thoughts on this Dave, and I agree that handling is a lot more important than wot.

Not sure I remember this right, but when you first tested the demo at the show with a bunch of guys on board with the G2's your cruise millage was around 2 mpg, not 1.6, and frankly this difference also surprised me as I thought the larger displacement Suzies would coast at the same cruise speed.

I am well aware that cats are very sensitive to weight, but I had this cockeyed theory that on larger hulls, adding basically the same load of junk you take on every trip, would have less effect on fuel economy on a 30' cat than it would when you added the same load to lets say a 23-26. Oh well, so much for theories.

And now I wonder if the same thing happened on the new WC28 when it was originally advertised for max hp of T300's and later revised to T200's. Could it be that both your hull and the WC like a certain sweet spot and after that adding more ponies is pointless? And of course I now wonder how a pair of 30" shaft G2 175-200's would push your hull, carrying 40% less fuel load ( 800 lb delta) plus the difference in lower motor weights?

Looking at this from a positive angle, it now appears that your customers could save some dough in the future if they stick with the 30" shaft 200- 250 G2's as weight seems to be a bigger factor again than hp. But I also agree that testing different props is certainly called for before anyone changes their mind about which motors to buy.

Time will tell, but like I said before, these hulls are really looking good, and I am sure the ride is great with all that dead rise and length.

Last edited by Bullshipper; 06-26-2019 at 06:44 AM.
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Old 06-26-2019, 07:34 AM
  #213  
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These boats would be just fine with a pair of 150's. The need for speed over 35 isnt realistic IMO. Yea we can do it but leaving 30 minutes earlier works too. And saves a lot of fuel.
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Old 06-26-2019, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Bullshipper View Post
Really appreciate your thoughts on this Dave, and I agree that handling is a lot more important than wot.

Not sure I remember this right, but when you first tested the demo at the show with a bunch of guys on board with the G2's your cruise millage was around 2 mpg, not 1.6, and frankly this difference also surprised me as I thought the larger displacement Suzies would coast at the same cruise speed.

I am well aware that cats are very sensitive to weight, but I had this cockeyed theory that on larger hulls, adding basically the same load of junk you take on every trip, would have less effect on fuel economy on a 30' cat than it would when you added the same load to lets say a 23-26. Oh well, so much for theories.

And now I wonder if the same thing happened on the new WC28 when it was originally advertised for max hp of T300's and later revised to T200's. Could it be that both your hull and the WC like a certain sweet spot and after that adding more ponies is pointless? And of course I now wonder how a pair of 30" shaft G2 175-200's would push your hull, carrying 40% less fuel load ( 800 lb delta) plus the difference in lower motor weights?

Looking at this from a positive angle, it now appears that your customers could save some dough in the future if they stick with the 30" shaft 200- 250 G2's as weight seems to be a bigger factor again than hp. But I also agree that testing different props is certainly called for before anyone changes their mind about which motors to buy.

Time will tell, but like I said before, these hulls are really looking good, and I am sure the ride is great with all that dead rise and length.
During the Miami Boat Show, rarely did we leave the dock with less than 6 people aboard, most of the time it was 8 or 9. BRP kept the tanks at least 3/4 full (thank you). Our cruise was in the low 30's at 2mpg or better. We could also still plane off on ONE ENGINE and run 30 at around 1.6mpg.

Your theory is correct about larger cats (30' +), they do handle heaver loads, when compared to smaller ones (23' to 26')

I tested the 28WC, I would think the HP rating was dropped down more for handling characteristics then speed.

Although the Horizon would run fine with a pair of 200's (she runs a single 250) having to have 30" motors sets the minimum power at 250's. No one I'm aware of makes a 30" 200.
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Old 06-26-2019, 08:56 AM
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Horse power is horse power, does not matter the stroke of the motor. No way 600hp should be slower top end then 500hp on the same hull.
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Old 06-26-2019, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeepman View Post
Horse power is horse power, does not matter the stroke of the motor. No way 600hp should be slower top end then 500hp on the same hull.
If you look at both boats (apples to apples) lets consider a few things:

1) Rated horsepower and horsepower at the shaft are two different things. Ratings can be + or - by as much as 10%.
2) The pair of Suzukis weigh 158lbs more.
3) My demo boat has an aluminum t-top with canvas.
4) Salty Sway has a fiberglass hard top, fiberglass tackle center, in-deck boxes and a fiberglass coffin box.
5) And there's the 2-stroke vs 4-stroke thing. (no I don't want to start that whole debate)

Next time I run my demo boat, I'll run the numbers again and put them through the same program. We'll be launching UCF very soon which is configured the same as Salty Sway, it is powered with 300 G2s. The boat behind that is configured the same as my demo boat and it's powered with 300 G2s.

I'll post all three sets of numbers. Stay tuned......
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Old 06-26-2019, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeepman View Post
Horse power is horse power, does not matter the stroke of the motor. No way 600hp should be slower top end then 500hp on the same hull.
One more way to demonstrate horsepower ratings are not equal. Watch this video I did for BoatTest.com last year.

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Old 06-26-2019, 11:43 AM
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HP doesnT tell the story. It's torque that moves the boat. The G2's win that catagory hands down.

I wonder how low a number prop would be need on either engine in the video to hot max RPM. The G2's were almost there.

Maybe with a 15x15 the Yamaha may have planed. Then when running twins it would only be saved by the rev limiter.

Regardless that test was fair as can be. Torque wins.
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Old 06-26-2019, 11:54 AM
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Good video. Exactly on point for what's going on here. I never saw any of Dave's videos until long after I'd put down a deposit. The more I know and see in person, the more I like and respect.

Most youtube videos are so terrible I can't watch the whole thing even when I really need to know something. Bunch of wannabes who don't know the material. Just a waste of time. I find Dav3's so clear and easy to understand he should give classes on how to do them. Or maybe it's just because he really knows his stuff and enjoys passing on that knowledge.

Then he comes here and posts everything about these builds. When trolled it rolls off him like water off a duck. Truly a class act. Keep 'em coming.
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Old 06-26-2019, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by BassnBays View Post
We'll be launching UCF very soon
Sure you will lol
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