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E-tec mystery unveiled June 13

Old 05-12-2014, 06:34 AM
  #41  
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Doubt it....they would eating the words that they have been preaching........2 > 4.

Originally Posted by Blue Chip View Post
Please let it be a 4cyl 250hp.
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Old 05-12-2014, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by drkptt View Post
What 4-stroke DI engines is BRP making? I couldn't find anything.
Dammit, I can't find it now either. Was I dreaming?

Back to the BRP's website. Not the easiest site to navigate but they do have some interesting stuff.
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Old 05-12-2014, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by HighSpeedPursuit View Post
Doubt it....they would eating the words that they have been preaching........2 > 4.
I don't see that they've been preaching 2 > 4, more that the torque, servicing requirements, low speed economy is better than the competition - if they can now achieve it with a 4 stroke, I'd be open minded to that, just as I would be if the new 'great thing' is still a two stroke - or even a diesel for that matter.

Things change with new developments, so I would never see a problem with something that was previously abandoned/ignored, being resurrected in a new improved form.
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Old 05-12-2014, 06:52 AM
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Three cylinders, 1500cc and 260 HP is pretty impressive.

http://www.brp-powertrain.com/en/des.../378_read-363/
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Old 05-12-2014, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by talkinghead4 View Post
Four or five years ago, an Evinrude rep was at the Houston Boat Show and I picked his brain about the future of BRP and outboards in general. He mentioned something about BRP looking into W block engines. Never heard of a W block. VW is using the W block in their Bentley autos. Maybe a 2 stroke W block.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slQ9E1s1FuQ

Mark
Nice video but, I had a hard time watching over the mechanics with their shirt "UN-TUCKED"!!!!

The humanity!!!!
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Old 05-12-2014, 06:58 AM
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Evinrude 4-Tec
Originally Posted by jethro1 View Post
Three cylinders, 1500cc and 260 HP is pretty impressive.

http://www.brp-powertrain.com/en/des.../378_read-363/
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by HighSpeedPursuit View Post
Doubt it....they would eating the words that they have been preaching........2 > 4.
Marketeers are like lawyers, they will spin a story to fit an objective.

Look at the BRP engine line up for all of their products. Might be more four strokes offered than two strokes.

If the marketplace is demanding four strokes, by let's guess a 9 to 1 margin, and BRP wants to grow their marketshare, why would they not want to know offer a four stroke outboard? The BRP spinsters can now say they and only they have developed a four stroke that rivals their two stroke in performance. Like Burger King, BRP will let a customer have an outboard motor "his way". Four or two, have it your way.

Maybe some of this chilish two stroke versus four stroke will go away. I doubt it.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:08 AM
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Originally Posted by talkinghead4 View Post
Four or five years ago, an Evinrude rep was at the Houston Boat Show and I picked his brain about the future of BRP and outboards in general. He mentioned something about BRP looking into W block engines. Never heard of a W block. VW is using the W block in their Bentley autos. Maybe a 2 stroke W block.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slQ9E1s1FuQ

Mark
The W12 is just two VW VR6's put together. VW has a W8 as well. That would definitely be interesting if they looked into something like that.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:15 AM
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The new outboard will be totally no maintenance. You simply provide gas and oil everything else is completely sealed then after the motor hits its lifetime operation of 1000 hours you just take it back for a brand new one. This is based on the fact that the majority of boat owners use their boats 50-75 hours a year so with an expected life of well over 10 years it will be a game changer for the industry.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:23 AM
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If evinrude were smart, they would advertise thier engines as 4 stroke lite, or something like that. 80% of buyers (not counting us technophobes on THT) would never know the difference and would be much more willing to buy the engine.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by jethro1 View Post
Marketeers are like lawyers, they will spin a story to fit an objective.

Look at the BRP engine line up for all of their products. Might be more four strokes offered than two strokes.

If the marketplace is demanding four strokes, by let's guess a 9 to 1 margin, and BRP wants to grow their marketshare, why would they not want to know offer a four stroke outboard? The BRP spinsters can now say they and only they have developed a four stroke that rivals their two stroke in performance. Like Burger King, BRP will let a customer have an outboard motor "his way". Four or two, have it your way.

Maybe some of this chilish two stroke versus four stroke will go away. I doubt it.
I think when it is said and done, the result will be much less revolutionary than the hype. I'm guessing an evolution of the Etec with some cool controls etc. etc.

But it is fun to speculate on what could be - and the biggest of those speculations has to center around the two stroke vs. four stroke thing. Don't kid yourselves, if BRP made a better financial case for making that change, they would do it in a heartbeat.

Outboard buyers are passionate about one "stroke" or the other. Outboard builders on the other hand are passionate about costs, returns, and marketshare. They are looking at selling worldwide both recreational and commercial, not just the American recreational market. If the long-ball smart move is that change, they'd come up with just as creative a marketing plan to support it as they did when trying to sell two strokes in a four stroke world. They didn't go two stroke because they thought it was the greatest, or easiest to sell, they went that road because they were in a deep hole and that was the best and cheapest way out.

As for Jethro's "Burger King" thougtht . . . . think back, it has already been done, and they could easily do it again. When OMC transitioned into Ficht, for several years we had Evinrude injection engines being sold alongside Johnson carb'd old technology. I assume BRP still owns the Johnson name, so it would be a natural fit if they wanted to do the same thing again with 2-4 Strokes.

That said - I don't expect much revolutionary from this announcement.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by catfoiler View Post
The new outboard will be totally no maintenance. You simply provide gas and oil everything else is completely sealed then after the motor hits its lifetime operation of 1000 hours you just take it back for a brand new one. This is based on the fact that the majority of boat owners use their boats 50-75 hours a year so with an expected life of well over 10 years it will be a game changer for the industry.
In reality some etecs already have a hard time meeting their 3 yr / 300 hour no maintenance claim for one reason or another and end up needing service well before then. And now they think they can triple that.

How are their magical fuel filters going to handle 1000 hours of marginally pure gas at times without needing to be changed. Interesting to see how they're going to get around that one.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by jethro1 View Post

Look at the BRP engine line up for all of their products. Might be more four strokes offered than two strokes.

If the marketplace is demanding four strokes, by let's guess a 9 to 1 margin, and BRP wants to grow their marketshare, why would they not want to know offer a four stroke outboard?
I don't think the "market" is demanding four strokes or two strokes. The user "market" is demanding less expensive, low maintenance, fuel efficient, powerful, light weight, reliable outboard motors regardless of the number of strokes, be it zero, two or four.

However, those who derive income from servicing outboard motors clearly have an interest in promoting the outboard motors with however many strokes that provides the most service opportunities for them.
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Blue Chip View Post
Please let it be a 4cyl 250hp.
Four cylinder?
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by RyanL11 View Post
The W12 is just two VW VR6's put together. VW has a W8 as well. That would definitely be interesting if they looked into something like that.
Volkwagen still produces at least two W engines. The quad turbo W16 in the Veyron and the W12 in the Bentleys. We saw the W8 in a limited run of the 1999 version of the Passat (which was essentially a Frankenstein monster made from Audi A4 and A6 components) a number of years back. Last I heard, they still produce the big Phaeton in Europe, but it may have Audi engines now.
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by jethro1 View Post
Three cylinders, 1500cc and 260 HP is pretty impressive.

http://www.brp-powertrain.com/en/des.../378_read-363/
Well, somebody was asking for a 250 hp 4 cylinder. How about a 345 hp 2 liter 4 cylinder? Or a 6 slightly bigger than a verado at 520 hp!!!!!! Realistically, you aren't going to see an engine wrapped that tight in a larger outboard application, but we know that BRP is getting anywhere from 115 to 260 hp from this 1.3-1.5 liter 3 cylinder line. Rotax is a world leader in these smaller 4 stroke engine technologies and I think that is the growth side of BRP's engines biz. BRP abandoned the sport boat business back in 2012 to concentrate on its other lines, including engines and propulsion systems for sport (jet) boats. With thaw way that environmental laws are going, you have to wonder how much longer you will be abel to sell two stroke engines, no matter how "clean" they are? Yes, I know they still make 2 strokes for snowmobiles, but don't you think that those are more likely to be outlawed at some point than outboards?

Last edited by jdm61; 05-12-2014 at 09:02 AM.
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Whaler27 View Post
I don't think the "market" is demanding four strokes or two strokes. The user "market" is demanding less expensive, low maintenance, fuel efficient, powerful, light weight, reliable outboard motors regardless of the number of strokes, be it zero, two or four.

However, those who derive income from servicing outboard motors clearly have an interest in promoting the outboard motors with however many strokes that provides the most service opportunities for them.
Are you referring to present day four strokes when you say " less expensive, low maintenance, fuel efficient, powerful, light weight, reliable outboard motors"? Because four stroke sales in the USA are are about nine to one vis a vis two strokes.
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:01 AM
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Runs on sea water
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by jethro1 View Post
Are you referring to present day four strokes when you say " less expensive, low maintenance, fuel efficient, powerful, light weight, reliable outboard motors"? Because four stroke sales in the USA are are about nine to one vis a vis two strokes.
And won't economies of scale eventually overtake slightly lower production cost per unit at some point? You have to do the same amount of work to upgrade each engine to new standards, but you have fewer sales to absorb that cost with the 2 strokes.
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by jdm61 View Post
Volkwagen still produces at least two W engines. The quad turbo W16 in the Veyron and the W12 in the Bentleys. We saw the W8 in a limited run of the 1999 version of the Passat (which was essentially a Frankenstein monster made from Audi A4 and A6 components) a number of years back. Last I heard, they still produce the big Phaeton in Europe, but it may have Audi engines now.
The W16 is just two two W8's combined, much like the W12 is just two VR6's combined, and the W8 is two VR4 engines combined. Audi and VW share pretty much everything.

It would be interesting to see a VR4 or a VR6 go into an outboard. Compact and lots of torque.
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