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1998 Johnson 50 HP trim/tilt repair

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1998 Johnson 50 HP trim/tilt repair

Old 03-07-2013, 11:25 AM
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Default 1998 Johnson 50 HP trim/tilt repair

I have had a small leak on the top of the main ram and was told that I needed to remove the ram from the motor so that after I unscrew the cap with a spanner wrench I can have enough access to move the ram out of the way. The pin is frozen, I tried heating with a torch and PB Blaster but just can't get enough of a whack on it with a punch and hammer to move it.

The bottom pin is also frozen and has the same problem. I would rather struggle with it myself than pay a mechanic $90 an hour to struggle with it. What tool can I use to loosen/punch this pin out? If I remove the bottom pin and keep the top one on can't I just remove the ram and replace the seal with the ram still attached to the motor at the top?

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Old 03-08-2013, 11:49 AM
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I started a thread a few months ago but couldn't find it, any input?
Old 03-08-2013, 12:04 PM
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You will never drive that {insert the worst word you know} pin out of there.
Here's what I did on a 35hp with the same tilt/trim unit as you have on your 50hp.

1. Unscrew the cap with the spanner and lift the motor until the piston is clear of the tilt cylinder.
2. Support the motor so it doesn't drop down and crush your hand or skull.
3. Put something in the cylinder to keep any trash from falling into it.
4. The cap, shaft and piston should be out of the cylinder and swinging freely while still attached to the pin that will never come out of the bracket.
5. There should be a nut at the bottom of the piston. Remove the nut and slide the piston off.
6. Slide the cap off just like you did with the piston.
7. Replace the seals on the cap and the piston.
8. Reassemble in reverse.
Old 03-08-2013, 12:13 PM
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I think I'll go spray mine with penetrating oil just in case.
Old 03-09-2013, 06:41 AM
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Loose, that sounds pretty good, IF the motor will lift up enough to provide enough clearance to get the piston out, sounds like your trim unit was the same as mine so I'm going to give that a shot. Any tips on how to get a spanner wrench that will fit? Are they adjustable or size specific?
Old 03-09-2013, 07:17 AM
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I just replaced the trim motor on my 1996 Johnson 88 SPL a few weeks ago and could not get the top pin out either. I used a propane torch and a small impact tool with no luck. I bought the trim motor from a local place and the guy there said he has done dozens of them over the years using an oxy acetylene torch and a large impact tool. Never had one that wouldn't come out. If it comes down to you having no choice then $90 is worth it.

I never got mine loose, but instead lifted the engine off the transom and removed the port engine mounting bracket from the hydraulic manifold to access the one bolt holding the trim motor. I did not have to deal with the ram, but the guy I spoke to said life is much easier when you refurbish these on the bench.

From the looks of things, you trim motor is pretty rusty and looks like it might be a candidate for replacement in a season. No way you are getting the fourth mounting bolt out without removing the hydraulic manifold or pulling the engine off the transom (based on my personal experience).
Old 03-09-2013, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by dpdash View Post
Loose, that sounds pretty good, IF the motor will lift up enough to provide enough clearance to get the piston out, sounds like your trim unit was the same as mine so I'm going to give that a shot. Any tips on how to get a spanner wrench that will fit? Are they adjustable or size specific?
The spanner I used was borrowed from a friend who was an OMC tech for many years. It had three pins. The cap easily unscrewed...unlike that cursed pin.
Old 03-09-2013, 02:14 PM
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Loose, did a little googling and see what an adjustable spanner wrench looks like, went to harbor freight and Home Depot without luck but I will find one. My cap has 4 holes on it fwiw. Just to confirm, after cap comes off and I remove nut holding cap etc on the ram, I should be able to lift the motor high enough?

Louie, where are you located, if in S Fl who did you take it to? I replaced that trim motor a little over a year ago and was able to get to all the bolts to get it off/on. I should have put a coat of real water repellent paint over the new one though.
Old 03-09-2013, 03:00 PM
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Start reading here:

http://forums.iboats.com/johnson-evi...ml#post1655454
Old 04-01-2013, 03:31 PM
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Ok, took the advice above and was able to unscrew cap with spanner wrench, lift motor and get to the seals, that was a great tip, thanks! There is an inner seal, green #21, then a cut ring spacer #22 and a top seal, black #23. I put #21 in with the groove facing up, then the spacer on top of that. The first time I put them in it leaked out the top immediately. I assumed I had cut the inner seal so I bought all new ones again and this time talked to a mechanic who thought that the inner seal#21 was in upside down so I flipped it so the groove was facing down.

Again, first stroke it leaked out the top so clearly something isn't right. Fwiw, it really only leaks when I have the motor all the way up, put the support arm down and then lower the motor, when the motor rests on the support arm and I continue to lower pressure builds up and then it leaks. Is it possible there is too much oil in there?

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#21 below
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#21 with groove on top, I put this in with groove facing down
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#21, 22, 23 from left to right
Old 04-01-2013, 06:25 PM
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It looks like your getting close. I cant recall if the seal groove faces up or down. You do have the correct rod seal yes? Its should have been a little difficult to put on. Then once on, it should taken some effort to slide the glands up and down on the rod.

The only reason that its leaking in the up position is if the rod is pitted in that area significantly, not providing a good seal.

Also its leaking around the seal not the oring right on the glands?
Old 04-02-2013, 09:04 AM
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Rod is not pitted, I believe I have the correct seals. It is leaking out the top around where the rod enters. It only leaks when the engine is supported by the bracket and I continue to trim down
Old 04-02-2013, 06:58 PM
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Ttt
Old 04-02-2013, 07:36 PM
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Dash,

If you have the correct rod seal and the rod is not pitted, the unit should not leak. You mentioned it only does it when the rod is fully retracted and you continue to trim down.

Double check to ensure you reinstalled the little ball bearings and the bypass properly. The little tan piece is the bypass which allows fluid to bypass the piston when the pressure builds up. It doesnt sound like yours is bypassing.

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Old 04-03-2013, 07:04 AM
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Ok, that brings up another thing neither of my mechanics could answer, when I assemble the springs etc, how tight should I tighten the lower bolt that holds everything together? I was told to tighten it all the way and that's what I did but that compresses the springs all the way and that sounds like it would not allow that bypass to compress?? Thanks for the insight so far
Old 04-03-2013, 10:59 AM
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You will need the factory service manual as one of the springs and check balls has to go in a particular hole if I remember correctly. Be sure you install new orings and do not reuse them.

Most of the time I see a pitted trim or tilt ram and that is what damaged the original seals and caused the leaks. You may have to replace the piston assembly.

Drill a 3/8" hole in the side of the bracket inline with the upper mounting pin to fit a 3/8" pin punch or steel rod to drive out the upper pin if needed. You need any oxy torch, not MAPP or propane, to heat up the aluminum.
Old 04-03-2013, 01:30 PM
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Well, I just loosened the large nut that had the springs compressed completely, this would allow the springs to have some play and that made it worse, I need to find someone who knows what they are doing, not guessing.
Seahorse, all 6 holes are the same, the cap assembly doesn't have any kind of groove to line it up, I can't see how you could accurately position it in one spot
Old 04-03-2013, 07:06 PM
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Dash,

The nut is supposed to be tight with not play in the springs. I caught hell removing the bottom nut.

Basic bypass is this:

You got 5 ball bearings but 6 holes. 5 springs are black, 1 spring is silver. The silver spring goes with the yellow bypass piece. The yellow piece sticks up thru one of the 6 holes. When you continue to trim up, the yellow bypass will hit the bottom of the seal glands ever so slightly, compressing the silver spring and allow fluid to go from one side of the piston (including quad seal) to the other. The other 5 ball bearings sit in the holes.

There is a poppet valve internal of the unit that prevents over pressurization as well.

Was the back up ring (part 24) reinstalled correctly? The provides support to the rod seal.
Old 04-04-2013, 12:48 PM
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Littletuny,
Thanks for the detailed info! I thought the six springs were all the same but in looking at the pic above one definitely is another color, I'm sure it's not in the right spot, I will make that change, I'm an expert in taking it apart now! Part number 24 went on top of the seal below it, the green one, I'm almost certain it is in right.
Old 04-04-2013, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by littletunny View Post

All of these parts look like what I have EXCEPT I do not have that round, aluminum looking piece in the lower right corner of the pic above from you. It has some different looking holes in it maybe? What is that piece ?

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