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towed back 3 times - yamaha f225 mystery issue

Old 10-26-2019, 10:22 PM
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Default towed back 3 times - yamaha f225 mystery issue

My buddy (not a THT guy) runs a 2004 Yamaha 225 on his parker 2310. about 1100 hours on it. three trips ago it started bogging down and popping/coughing and eventually would only run 2200 RPMs. We came back from Mexican waters about 40 miles at 7mph, but we made it back unassisted. Boat goes into the Yami dealer, they do the 1000 hour service with the timing belt, plugs, filters, all that. found that a fuse on one fuel pump was popped, so the fuel pump was replaced (I think it was the HP, but not 100%). Fuel/water separator is changed annually, nothing seems wrong there. There was a small amount of water (sounds like a few drops in the jar when they let it settle) and a bit of rust in the water separator, but not alarming amount. Changed it with the rest of the filters.

week later, we launch...all is good. get $70 worth of bait and motor bogs down and dies 200 yards past the bait barge. Won't restart. Get towed to the ramp. Boat goes back to the dealer. Injectors pulled, tested, cleaned - none were clogged. Some story about the engine computing needing to be reprogrammed (sorry, I'm lacking details) and the shop says he's good to go.

this week, I'm not with him. launches, goes a mile and a half to the bait barge and the motor starts to load up. Limp back to the ramp at 2000 rpm max....then it suddenly revs up like it should. they run around the bay for 20 min, everything looking good. Head out 28 miles, start fishing, get a jig strike and when they pulled it back to idle to land the fish... motor cuts and won't restart. Tow BoatUS is there in about 75 minutes and tows them back.

Now he's wondering what to do next. Hate to do the "let's try this, let's try that" method of troubleshooting - its expensive and unreliable. Guys on here have seen and solved every conceivable issue with these Yami's, so I'm hoping someone has seen this and has some advice I can pass on to him.

Thanks in advance, THT.
Old 10-26-2019, 10:31 PM
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Had something like this happen, chased my tail for a month. Ended up being the TPS on the top of the throttle body linkage. Best I could tell was it was heating up due to resistance and pulling the voltage down for the entire system. It would run fine the start chugging spitting and sputtering and die. Went with a off brand because the Yamaha part was a few hundred bucks
Old 10-26-2019, 10:40 PM
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TPS, loose battery cables, low pressure fuel pump not working right, water in fuel and it doesn't take much.
Old 10-27-2019, 12:38 AM
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Ok.....seems like low pressure pump and “TPS” are the place to start?
Old 10-27-2019, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by hammerhead_77 View Post
Ok.....seems like low pressure pump and “TPS” are the place to start?
a good start
for the "let's try this, let's try that method of troubleshooting"
Old 10-27-2019, 06:32 AM
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Did you post your question over on MarineEngine.com? Some good stuff over there.
Old 10-27-2019, 06:57 AM
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May be worth taking a small fuel tank along to hook up to if it happens again. Probably not the cause but an obstruction in the tank could cause what he’s experiencing.
Old 10-27-2019, 07:32 AM
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Anti-siphon valve at fuel tank
Old 10-27-2019, 07:55 AM
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first off > get the motor connected to YDS , examining the read out will show definite fault codes.

there will probably be a run of codes , pick the most frequent and go from there.
Old 10-27-2019, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Fwpratt View Post
a good start
for the "let's try this, let's try that method of troubleshooting"
My thought exactly.

Don't want to do that but then come to THT to get any number of cockamamie ideas as to what the problem may be.

Any suggestion that one wants can be found here.

Am I suggesting that we throw money (parts and labour) at the problem? Absolutely.
Old 10-27-2019, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by caper View Post
Anti-siphon valve at fuel tank
i believe this was my problem although i need to run it some more

Easy to test by running it off a small external tank or do what i did, take it off drill the back of the fitting out and pop out the ball and spring.
Old 10-27-2019, 08:05 AM
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I would assume the dealer did the VST service, checking the fine filter screen on the HP fuel pump, but definitely double check that. The symptoms sound like the classic HP pump failing and clogging its own filter screen in the process. The HP pump and filter screen are located inside the VST (Vapor Separator Tank).

If the dealer only cleaned the screen, but did not replace the HP pump, I would guess that the pump has failed. When an HP pump starts failing it can throw out carbon particles which clog its own screen and then the restricted fuel flow causes the pump to fail even faster. This happened to me on my F250 Offshores this past season, possibly triggered by running the tanks pretty low (or so my mechanic claims).
Old 10-27-2019, 08:05 AM
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"Guys on here have seen and solved every conceivable issue with these Yami's,"

Yes. And every single symptom had the exact same core problem.

To wit. "My Yami F225 ran ruff. Cleaning injector number 5 solved the problem."

Therefore, by inference, every single Yami that is running ruff absolutely positively will be cured by cleaning injector number 5.

THT silver bullets.
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Old 10-27-2019, 09:13 AM
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LOL! I love how no one here is cynical or jaded at all!

good tip on the anti-siphon valve. The mechanic is only looking at the motor.
Old 10-27-2019, 09:27 AM
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soooooo ? do you have a print out of the diagnostics , if so screen shot or take a pic and post here.

im guessing it may be a blocked VST vent or tank breather .or #5 spark plug and the rest are going out in sympathy.
Old 10-27-2019, 12:10 PM
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Ok one thing not mentioned....a fuel pump fuse popped, they replaced the pump...did they also make sure that the wiring was good, clean tight terminals? Do these use a relay for the fuel pump like inboards? If they do, was the relay terminal blades and connectors checked for oxidation? Now a bad fuel pump could have been the cause but so could bad wiring (increased resistance) that can cause a pump to fail. Worth checking and a cheap fix if that's what you find.
I know that high resistance in the fuel pump wiring circuits/terminals/connectors has caused problems with Volvo Penta inboard EFI fuel pumps....
Old 10-27-2019, 09:03 PM
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Also could be a bad fuel hose. Looks good on the outside but the inner liner keeps sucking closed which actually is a common issue from ethanol. You can check most all the issues without having to buy new parts. To check the low pressure pump, just unhook the fuel hose from the high pressure pump end and turn the key. If it's shooting far, it's fine. If it's pumps hard then slow it has a issue, no fuel at all and it's dead. Dead pump is unlikely because it wouldn't even run unless there was left over fuel in the vst and it'll run for a minute and die to never crank up and run again til fixed. But you want to hook the motor to a 5 gallon tank with new fuel hose before you start any kind of tests to the motor. The issue you have could have many different parts that could cause that symptom, just gotta go through the process.
Old 10-27-2019, 09:28 PM
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Have they done the extreme basics of a fuel pressure test while water testing it? Much better than throwing parts at it.
Old 10-27-2019, 10:42 PM
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I’m really not completely sure what they did other than the 1000 hr service, change all the filters, replace the fuel pump and clean / test the injectors.. I’ll see if the provided any fault code info.
Old 10-28-2019, 03:54 AM
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Just a suggestion but having the mechanic onboard with the computer hooked up while running the boat may shed some light on what's going on in real time. This way if the engine cuts out, the computer should show what's going right and what went wrong

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