The Hull Truth - Boating and Fishing Forum - View Single Post - Daiwa SEABORG 1200MJ??? Anyone use it yet???
Old 05-23-2018, 05:19 PM
hamma job
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Originally Posted by coores14 View Post
working for LP can create bias. I respect your knowledge, but not being able to understand why someone might buy a "plastic magic beanstalk" for swords is heavily influenced by the reels that you want to sell.
Biased, for working for LP? Absolutely. It also makes me uniquely qualified to throw the flag here. Especially when questioning an imported reel bearing a shockingly similar name (1200mj vs s1200) to mine. Puts a little bit of excrement flavor in my cheerios. I'm just looking to call a spade a spade here. My background for that? I have a bachelors and masters degree in mechanical engineering and have worked in manufacturing fishing equipment for 10 years. I make 1000+ electric reels a year. I also have caught a fair number of swordfish and have helped a lot of people learn how to do it. It's one of my passions, and I have spent a lot of time on the water getting things right not only from an equipment standpoint but also from a technique standpoint. So, based upon this, here is my $0.02 on "plastic magic beanstalks" and electric reels in general. Think of it what you will.

Motors: Brushless motors are very efficient, but there is no way of getting away from the basic guts of a motor. The output of an electric motor is a balance of the motors potential speed and torque. Motors, at the simplest level contain magnets and copper windings. If you increase both of these you can get more speed, more torque, or a combination of both out of the motor at a given current. You can have tiny tiny motors that are incredibly high speed, but, as you expect, are used in very low torque applications. Higher current also leads to more heat in the motor. Heat is removed by several elements, mainly the mass of the motor's internal components, and their contact with the case and the case's mass and ability to remove heat. At the end of the day- the bigger the motor (the more copper windings, the bigger and more magnets)- the more "powerful" it is and the more able it is to efficiently operate at higher currents. A motor the size of the shotglass can't be compared to a motor the size of a highball glass- regardless of how efficient they are and especially regardless of what "giga" or "max" or "-dura" prefix you put on it. Hence the "magic beanstalk" comment.

Control boards: Again, a place where the ability to dissipate heat comes into play. Efficiency goes a long way here as well. Wasted energy shows up as heat. However, in high current situations it is nearly impossible to eliminate the buildup of heat in electrical componentry. Heat sinks are used to carry the heat away from electrical components in these assemblies. In the general case of transferring heat- mass, surface area, airflow, and material are critical. This is why you have fins on a radiator, it is also why radiator fins are made of aluminum. This is also why there are holes in the plastic sideplates of some reels. This is to allow the air to penetrate to heat-sinking elements of the drive. It also allows salt water into these areas as well. Plastic is a terrible thermal conductor. Just ask a TLD or a Penn Senator.

Drag: Heat again is a major deal here, especially with electric reels. You get rid of it the same way as electrical heat as I mentioned before through mass, material type, and surface area. Drags on electric reels however pull double duty because they fight both the reel and the motor. If you have the fish stalling out the drag, heat is still being generated through the friction of the drag against a stationary spool. This is even further compounded if the fish takes a run and the motor continues to spin (worst case scenario). This heat has to go somewhere

Pulling power/speed/max drag: A great stat for a magazine article, and a commercial. It is also never policed, nor is there an industry standard for how it is measured in electric reels. 40lbs pull? For how long? At how fast? 100lbs of drag? I can make something with 1000lbs of drag, it doesn't mean that the drive can pull at that rate, but I could publish the number (I wouldn't ) and someone might buy it because of that. I could design and develop a motor that is 8x as fast, but I'd likely sacrifice torque to stay in the same envelope, or it might get cherry hot after 30 seconds, or it might burn the drag up in 2 minutes after someone hangs bottom and runs the motor against the drag. Again, nothing comes for free.

Heat is by far the most important thing here when we talk of electric reels as you can see. All of the components contribute heat to the equation and you have to get rid of it. Just think of the heat you would be generating winding a fish up from the depths! Similar work being done and energy expended. There is no such thing as free energy, there is no perpetual motion, and there certainly isn't a magical reel. Maybe there is and the 8 Japanese engineers from Daiwa that spent a half hour in my booth at the MIA boat show a couple of years back found it. I doubt it.

Cost of componentry and distribution: Some of these import reels are going through 6+ channels of distribution from the factory to the consumer. Each layer takes their cut. Shipping 8 guys to the MIA boat show from Japan isn't cheap. Prostaffs and giving away free product isn't cheap. Giant booths at ICAST aren't cheap. Advertising in print, tv, and social media isn't cheap either. Also, the cost of doing warrantee work at satellite locations. That definitely can't be cheap. That gets absorbed somehow. None of the guys I saw, much like myself, or any tackle dealer, looked like they had any interest in working for free.

A lot of this stems from doing seminars and talking to people as a fisherman who does this a lot and cringes when someone buys the wrong tool for the job because they were misled into believing that there's a new, magical, tool that does the equivalent of a piece of my equipment at 1/4 the cost. A lot of people end up frustrated and angry before they give the game a try in earnest. A lot of people say theyre going to upgrade but get so frustrated trying to figure things out on the cheap that they quit before the payoff comes, likely spending as much money as they would have to do it correctly from the getgo. Budget minded? Who isn't!!! I've said it 1000x. An 80W is a fine option. I've caught a pile handcranking. Not the most fun thing to do, but it works. There simply is no $1000 or $1500 electric reel solution to the swordfish dilemma.