an observation/venting re: hawaii charters

dqship · 07-25-2009, 02:28 PM

I have just returned from spending the last couple of weeks in the islands, and went out on two charters during my time there. For the sake of this post I am going to keep the charters unnamed except to say both are based in Oahu, because I have heard of similar stories from others who've fished with still other boats.

I think there's a problem in the charter industry in Hawaii, driven by the prospect of crews and captains taking a boat's catch to market. It seemed to me (and as mentioned above, has seemed to others with whom I've spoken) that there is an interesting dichotomy taking place -- captains have customers who are paying a decent chunk of change to have the experience of catching fish, while captains themselves are making their living off of tips and the sale of fish. I made it pretty clear when making my reservations that I was interested in catching fish, not of any particular species or persuasion...rather just getting a solid bend in the rods throughout the day. However, for commercial sale of fish, they need big ones to make the taking them to auction worthwhile.

Long story short, on both trips I took, I got the impression that the captains were more interested in risking a skunk for that one big bite, when the (albeit smaller) light tackle bite was plentiful to be had, in the form of both mahi, football and larger yft, and skippies. Needless to say, outside of catching a few skippies for live bait, the action was lackluster at best. I know fishing and chartering a boat means no guarantee of catch, but I was curious to see what some of you guys think about this dichotomy. I can see it from both sides, I wouldn't want my livelihood robbed as a charter captain by filling the box full of un-sellable fish when a tip from the customer would never make up for the $profit of that one big bite. But at the same time, we are paying a lot of money for their services and the expectation for them to work hard to put a bend in the rod for the day, when fish are around. I guess that if they feel the money is better in the commercial sales, they should probably take that route exclusively and leave the chartering to guys who are wanting to focus on customer service. I don't know. I understand fully that it keeps the cost of charters down to a reasonable level in the islands, but it seems to be a situation where either one party or the other is bound to lose more often than both win.

Any feedback or other experiences would be welcomed. I'm mostly just venting here about my spending $2k last week to catch jack sh*t with mediocre customer service to boot.

bc22 · 07-28-2009, 12:58 AM

Been there done that. Although really only done once, i've learned my lesson. I will never pay good money for a charter in which the captain and crew get the fish and profit from sale and the customer gets only pics. The only exception on charters i would consider paying and where i don't get to keep my catch (or a choice to keep the catch) are catch and release fisheries like some billfish, fly fishing for bonefish, or similar. If tuna or mahi is on the end of my line, it's grilled supper and sashimi.

I have some family that lives in Hawaii and would like to visit and sample the famed fishing, but the whole charter and no fish to eat at the end doesn't excite me. I think, as you've mentioned, there definitely exists a conflict in interest in what the paying customer expects and wants and what the captain wants.

As seen in another thread here about "10 best places to fish", there are a lot of choices other than hawaii for many reasons. My next winter fishing trip is likely Panama or Guatemala or back to Mexico aboard a long range boat. My last trip to Mexico in June gave me a years load and then some of nice YFT and Calif. Yellowtail in which i shared with many and will again enjoy some more tomorrow. Pics definitely bring back great memories of good fishing trips, but pics with some fish to eat from the same trip is absolutely killer and always puts a smile on my face.

dqship · 07-28-2009, 05:22 AM

Yeah, don't get me wrong...I didn't make the trip to HI specifically for the fishing...I'd no doubt be in Mexico, Panama, etc. if it were just for the fishing. Had some business to do out there and decided to throw in a couple of fishing trips to maintain my sanity over the course of a two week long marathon of meetings. I don't really even care about the lack of fish on the table after the trips, truth be told I don't know if I could have accepted anyways since I was staying in a hotel and didn't have a great means to get stuff shipped back home...I am more frustrated about the "have your cake and eat it too" mentality of the average operation.

Oh well, it's water under the bridge and a lesson learned for the future. Next time spend that kind of money on a week of hiking the volcanoes instead...right!? haha...

-d.

pglein · 07-28-2009, 09:53 AM

I would NEVER pay to go fishing if I didn't get to keep what I caught (unless it was a catch and release fishery). Otherwise, what the hell is the point of even going?

You got ripped off.

Capt. Jeff Rogers · 08-02-2009, 10:25 PM

Aloha dqship,

As a Hawaii charter captain I really appreciate your very truthful thoughts rather than just flaming on us here. You have sincere questions and comments. I can't speak for Oahu but here in Kona we are slowly getting away from the "dichotomy" that you are speaking about. Many of us here are now filleting the catch of the day for our customers. The fact that you were in a hotel (if the crew knew) might have made a difference in the target species. I cover "keeping fish" on my web site at http://FISHinKONA.com/FAQ.htm to avoid confusion and I rarely get any suprises at the end of the day. Unlike even most captains in Kona, I enjoy catching all kinds of fish for great action rather than trolling around all day in the deep trying to get an unlikely fish. With that attitude, I still manage to get a few big ones though

Check out my web site.

Capt. Jeff
http://FISHinKONA.com

nausetlight · 08-03-2009, 05:37 AM

We have chartered just about everywhere we've been and a charter was available, From Cape Cod to Bora Bora and we've had some incredible experiences along with the bad ones. Picking the right boat is tough but when you find a good one the experience can be second to none. One time we were giving the fish away at the dock and the captain bitched, until I set him straight as to who just paid for the trip and I'll do whatever the hell I want with the dozen or so Mahi I had caught and was giving to the locals. We regularly charter with an excellent captain and crew out of Gloucester, The only time the customer doesn't get the fish is if it is over 73" and is classified as a commercial giant bluefin tuna which are regulated. They instead give a credit toward a future trip, which works for me.

Capt. Jeff Rogers · 08-03-2009, 10:30 AM

My last 3 yellowfin that were over 100 lbs. I cut up for the customers because they were local or had local connections that were looking forward to plenty of fish. Although I cut most of the fish, I sell some too. I have seen several arguments over fish at the dock. I tend to lean toward the wishes of the customer but with that, one time someone came to me and asked if I was going to do something about the fish in the parking lot. What? The customer wanted the fish whole because (I think) they thought they could sell it. When that didn't work out (against the law), they just left it rotting in the sun. That same thing happened to a captain friend of mine with a 100 + yellowfin. A total waste of a big fish! Another time a hotel called me and asked me to come to the hotel and pick up my fish. What? The guy had left 2 mahi mahi in the bathtub. No ice, otherwise the hotel workers would have taken them I'm sure. I didn't go get them either.

Each boat/captain has it's own policy. I just try to make mine clear on my web site to avoid confusion.

Capt. Jeff
http://FISHinKONA.com

dqship · 08-03-2009, 01:49 PM

Jeff, Kudos to you for a classy reply and for spelling out your policies clearly on your website. If only everyone was devoted enough to do the same...haha...

Pretty freaky stories about people's waste and haste. Don't get me wrong: I think you guys ('you' being Hawaii operators) should have the opportunity to sell catch not desired by customers, or those catches that fall within a prescribed policy. But I also think you have a more important responsibility, as a charter business, to see that the customer (without whom nothing would be brought on board that day) leaves satisfied. Unfortunately, charter businesses (particularly in Oahu) are driven at a far greater pace by tourists and island visitors than local regulars. This doesn't breed any additional motivation for forthrightness on the part of the operators, IMO, since the next crop of customers is on the next plane to land, and the necessity/probability of relying on repeat business isn't nearly as high in other markets due to geographic isolation.

It's pretty clear to me, Jeff, by your taking the time to reply to this message and the policies on your website, that you run your operation the right way and are customer focused. I don't know, maybe my expectations were too high, but I know of another boat that was out the same day that killed it on mahi so there were fish to be had. Perhaps I could have done a better job of conveying my wishes to the crew, as well. It's rarely a one way street.

pglein · 08-03-2009, 04:19 PM

Here's an idea: give the customers a choice, they can keep the fish, or they can sell it back to you for 1/2 what you think you'll be able to get for it at market (or whatever percentage you think is appropriate).

That's a great way to ensure the fish doesn't go to waste, while also giving the customer the choice to do what they wish with it.

Johnbear · 09-30-2009, 01:54 AM

I can't speak for Oahu but here in Kona we are slowly getting away from the "dichotomy" that you are speaking about. Many of us here are now filleting the catch of the day for our customers.

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