Vacuum pack machines - The Hull Truth

MI Ben · 08-29-2005, 10:59 PM

I freeze a good deal of fish but am never confident that I'm ensuring the best long-term quality in the deep freeze. What do you guys think of vacuum pack machines? If you recommend them, what model/make?

Thanks!

Shark Bait II · 08-30-2005, 12:34 AM

Vacuum machines are the best way I know of to preserve meat products. I usually put up several hundred Red, Silver and King Salmon each year with some Halibut and Moose if I'm lucky. Properly vacuum packed fish will stay good for at least a year if not two. But the key is properly vacuum packed.

There are two basic types of machines: One is is the "Suck" machine like the Food Saver and Vac U Save the other is a "Chamber" machine like professional food processors, butchers and delis use.

A "Suck" machine sucks air out of the vacuum bag and then a heat strip bar seals the bag. For kitchen use and small quantities they are OK. I have had a Vac U Save Professional (same as a Food Saver Professional- both are made by Tila in Italy) for about 20 years. Cost is about $300. These machines have several major drawbacks. 1. If what you are packaging has any or much liquid in it the machine sucks the liquid out of the bag with the air and then when it tries to seal the bag you will get some seal failures. 2. All have a very short duty cycle of about 20 minutes before the thermal limit switch kicks in and stops the machine - you then have to wait about 30 minutes for it to cool down. 3. You can only get one thickness of bag - about 3 mil. On the plus side they are cheap and small.

If you want to get serious about vacuum packing a "Chamber" machine is the only way to go. I have had one for about 5 years. In a "Chamber " machine you place the product in the bag and place the bag in the chamber and close the lid. The vacuum pump evacuates the entire chamber (to darn near complete vacuum say 29.96" Hg) and then the seal bar seals the bag. The machine then opens a port to the atmosphere and then the 14.5# or so of atmospheric pressure compresses the bag because there is no air in it. I can vacuum pack water in a bag if I want to - in fact the pressure gets so low 40 F water will "boil" but the water does not exit the bag. One the plus side. 1. Extremely high vacuum 2. Bags come in 3, 4 and 5 mil thicknesses 3. About a 100% duty cycle -I have run mine for over an hour feeding bags in as fast as one is sealed. 4. The machines come is several sizes. The down side: 1. Cost - about the cheapest one I know of is a little over $1,000 - they run as high as $15,000 for a big unit. 2. The machines are heavy. 3. They take a lot of power (120V)

My machine is a Process Plus Deli-Vac KVP-400A with the larger 20 Meter Oil Rotary Pump, it is all stainless steel, about 18" X 18" X 18 " and weighs about 150#. I paid a little over $2,000 5 years ago. Thats a lot of change for a meat packing machine but it has been well worth it because I pack a lot of fish and meat for personal use each year. Did about 300 Red and King Salmon in three days this July.

I have found a few packages of fish that got "lost" in one of the freezers for over three years and they did not have any freezer burn on them. I am a believer in "Chamber" vacuum packing machines. There are several brands of machines on the market. See what you can fine in your local area. Drop me a PM if if have any additional questions or want me to see if I can get any info on a specific machine. The guy I deal with has been selling vacuum machines for over 25 years - I trust his information.

4000 · 08-30-2005, 12:59 AM

Wow. that really sucks!(the air out of the bag I mean)

Well, I've been using the low tech Food Saver for a while now and yup, the drawbacks are there. But if you're using it for fish, you should take a paper towel and remove as much surface liquid as you can any how. It's what the sushi chefs do to keep fish tasty. Water breaks down the meat.

During the fishing season, I keep the Food Saver right on the boat. When I get back to the dock, I fillet and store ALL fish in the food saver right away. Even if I plan to eat the fish that night, it keeps everything clean and much easier to handle. My car won't stink up and I keep a seperate cooler just for the fish that has already been vacum packed. Plus, if you have a ton of fish to give away, my friends and neighbors appreciate the clean package.

Definitely keeps fish fresher even if I leave it right in the frige for a week. I have a ton of cod in my freezer right now and even after thawed, is fresher than anything that I'll ever find even in the "better" groceries. It takes some practice because if you fill the fish in the bag sideways, there's a chance that the food saver will "think" that there is a vacum even though there's a big airpocket on the bottom and some areas of the fish. I just make sure that I constantly move the fish a bit during the vaccum process.

Chamber machines sound great but I think if I had that kind of money, I'd go out and buy a some Penn Internationals instead.

MI Ben · 08-30-2005, 01:15 AM

Awesome thanks! I just ordered the food saver 1000-something model. Look forward to some professional looking freezer packs

Undaunted · 08-30-2005, 08:57 AM

check Ebay for the Foodsaver bags and rolls. You can get then for far less than in stores

jtburf · 08-30-2005, 09:07 AM

I semi freeze my fish first to stop the liquid from killing another vac-u-sealer ...

Love it it's the next best thing to sliced bread!!!

John

Mist-Rest · 08-30-2005, 09:23 AM

The fish juice makes a mess but it works with a little help.

msumoose · 08-30-2005, 09:32 AM

My Wife likes mine too...She buys the huge family packs of HB meat at the Sam's club, comes home and we break it out in to portions for 2. I have saved mucho dinero this way. Also use it on other meats like steaks and pork that come in the big family packs for less money. It is also great to go ahead and season or marinade your meat. The vacuum really pulls the flavor into the meat, and you can freze it for a later date.

COOL BREEZE · 08-30-2005, 10:09 AM

Thanks for the info Shark Bait II

Ocean Breeze · 08-30-2005, 11:55 AM

I use a vacuum pack machine but before I use it I put the meat in the bag and roll up 2-3 paper towels and put it below where I am going to make the seal. This will absorb the water before it gets to the machine. It just about solved the water in the machine problem.

cadjh · 08-30-2005, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Shark Bait II - 8/29/2005 11:34 PM

A "Suck" machine sucks air out of the vacuum bag and then a heat strip bar seals the bag. . These machines have several major drawbacks. 1. If what you are packaging has any or much liquid in it the machine sucks the liquid out of the bag with the air and then when it tries to seal the bag you will get some seal failures.

An effective method of preventing liquid "suck" is simply to partially freeze the bag and contents prior to sealing. I put the filled bags in the freezer for 20 min. or so, then vacuum seal. This completely eliminates the problem of liquid oozing out during the sealing process.