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So what are you saying? I troll the canyons at 7.5knts+ with bars all day and drop the hammer on the tuna. Ever seen squid at night chunking? They can move and fast cruising around in a school.
The videos simply present a contrast. If you watched the second video completely you noticed at the end the squid bolting away at a pretty good clip. But...you'll have to watch.
Who the F knows if the fish even think they are squid.
As provocative as your post is, I'm having a difficult time relating it to trolling speed versus natural speed. Perhaps you can clue me the F in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckman
The fish see them as bait....not as squid.
So all the articles written about what fish prefer to eat are hogwash? And all the different lures shaped like squid, and minnows, and sardines, and crawfish, and trout, and shiners, and mullet, and mackerel are all just a gimmick because in the end we could all troll, cast, and jig the same thing and every species would hit it? Gee, I don't know buck'...you might be in for a debate there. Maybe not.
The videos simply present a contrast. If you watched the second video completely you noticed at the end the squid bolting away at a pretty good clip. But...you'll have to watch.
Well the thread title implies that 7.5knt trolling speed is too fast compared to the other vid of a squid school moseying around at a much slower pace, soooo maybe you want to revise the title like you revised your post to me telling me to wake up...
So all the articles written about what fish prefer to eat are hogwash? And all the different lures shaped like squid, and minnows, and sardines, and crawfish, and trout, and shiners, and mullet, and mackerel are all just a gimmick because in the end we could all troll, cast, and jig the same thing and every species would hit it? Gee, I don't know buck'...you might be in for a debate there. Maybe not.
That may well be a correct statement, Put a poll up for the best dolphin lure and you will get numerous different responses. Same goes for tuna, wahoo, and just about any other pelagic.
EVERYONE has what they consider to be the best lure because of personal preferance or experience. I think that colors do play a role sometimes but in the end I think more times than not a fish see's something zipping by them, they are hungry, and they eat.
Well the thread title implies that 7.5knt trolling speed is too fast compared to the other vid of a squid school moseying around at a much slower pace, soooo maybe you want to revise the title like you revised your post to me telling me to wake up...
The title asks a question. The videos present a contrast between natural and unnatural. You're inferring from the video that I'm implying 7.5 is too fast. I am not.
And in my initial response to your first grumpy post I suggested you needed a nap. I did not tell you to wake up. A significant difference don't you think, like the two videos?
There is a stark contrast in the two videos yes but remember what you are fishing for when trolling is "ACTIVE FISH" which are in most cases on the hunt to eat and whatever it is they are feeding on are fleeing quite fast so that is what is most immitated by our trolling.
__________________ 2007 Lowe FM 185
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There is a stark contrast in the two videos yes but remember what you are fishing for when trolling is "ACTIVE FISH" which are in most cases on the hunt to eat and whatever it is they are feeding on are fleeing quite fast so that is what is most immitated by our trolling.
David I've been thinking about that very idea...that's it's the fleeing that that incites the chase and the strike.
Hey you know what....maybe that's why the turn of the zigzag incites the strike. Maybe that action represents a fleeing school more than straight.
"Look dear...our little boy is growing up so fast!"
Honestly it's like my brain is expanding beyond its normal pea-size. Just before I checked here I read that the trolled spread is also meant to look like a bait school that has been pushed up to the surface and trapped.
David by combining what you've posted on the zigzag thread and here - I'd say the answer to the question in the title of this thread is "probably not." The second video depicts what a bait school looks like when being rounded up, chased to the surface, and fleeing....all visuals that incite predators to strike either the school itself or more preferably the chasers we have strategically positioned behind and to the sides of the school.
Thanks David. I really appreciate your help. It has been invaluable.
LOL hey what do I know I'm just a mid-west know nothing Iowa walleye fisherman
But I grew up in Louisiana fishing the Gulf of Mexico offshore and inshore as well as bass fishing for over 35 years all over the Eastern US from the Gulf to Canada. So I learned a thing or two along the way. Hey they are all fish and most tactics can be used from one species to the other with a little common sense. Read my signature
Thank You and You're Welcome
__________________ 2007 Lowe FM 185
2007 Mercury Verado 150
Motorguide Wireless
Lowrance LMS 111 HD
Mercury Temptest Plus prop
First off I have to say it struck me how baitfish-like the squid in the video looked. If you came across them on a dive you mightn't notice they were squid to begin with. They look like just another group of baitfish. The colour too was fascinating. They were blue, as though blending into the blue background.
Second thing to consider is that those were reef squid. Pelagic squid - those that live out in the open ocean - can and often do move a lot faster. A couple of species have developed the ability to glide in a similar way to flying fish.
One of the real virtues of squid spreader bars is that they can be trolled at quite a range of speeds from 7-8 knots to really quite slow. Sometimes trolling at a slow speed is in fact the best way to fish them. Other trolling baits like rigged ballyhoo can also be fished slowly if the situation demands.
Steve that's great information. Actually this is more of a general trolling thread versus species-specific. But your input about the preferences of the BFT v YFT is excellent. Man I can't even imagine hauling one of those fish you guys routinely catch up there onto my boat.
Certainly there have been numerous discussions about troll speeds. IMHO the speeds are from 2 to 20knts. Slower is nearly impossible and faster a waste of fuel. My top end troll speed is about 14knts, just as my rig is on plane and fuel consumption is (more or less) minimal. Why fish prefer fast or slow matters not. If they prefer slow, then go slow and vice-a-versa for fast. If your baits/lures are correct, if you’re on the fish and you’re not catching….try a speed change. There’s been many a NE Giant captured slow trolling wide spreaderbars with large teasers at 3 to 5 knts of boat speed. Schoolie tunas of all verities captured at “canyon” speeds (7 to 9 knts) and Mahi and Hoos and tunas at the 14knts speed range. A compliment of lures that are NOT speed sensitive and can run thru a wide range of speeds is, IMHO, a big plus. Weather the fish see you presentation as finbait or squid matters not. If they bite it then alls good. Listen to the fish, do not try to out-think them. Speed, bait size or color…Listen to the fish. If you’re on them, they’ll tell you what they like. This link is to a vid that shows bars at slow to “canyon” speeds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22jBC2VYgPM. R’nR Bob
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Trolling your squid too fast? (Revised) 
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I'm just a mid-west know nothing Iowa walleye fisherman 
