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Old 03-20-2017, 09:31 AM   #21
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Fish',
Soft, small foam baffles that hug the speaker basket won't work. But a rigid pod of 0.25 cu.ft. net internal displacement for an IB 6.5" coaxial will do a great job if the subwoofer and satellites are sharing the same compartment.
It would be better to place the sub low in the center console and place the coaxials high in the side coaming with some degree of horizontal offset. If that's no longer possible, then you still might have the above option.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:44 AM   #22
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Fish',
Soft, small foam baffles that hug the speaker basket won't work. But a rigid pod of 0.25 cu.ft. net internal displacement for an IB 6.5" coaxial will do a great job if the subwoofer and satellites are sharing the same compartment.
It would be better to place the sub low in the center console and place the coaxials high in the side coaming with some degree of horizontal offset. If that's no longer possible, then you still might have the above option.
This whole distortion in the same compartment thing is concerning to me and has me 2nd guessing this decision. Do they sell prefabricated rigid pods for 6.5's? The speakers are installed 2/3's the way up the gunwale, so getting the sub lower and off set won't be an issue. I also only have approx. 6" of depth to deal with. I really don't have the means/resources to try and figure out the logistics of a fabrication solution.

I guess the other concern with mounting in the gunwale (something I didn't think too much about) is the weight of the subs at 4lbs and whether the fiberglass in this area is suitable for such an installation.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:54 AM   #23
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What about something like this? Don't know specifics on plastic thickness or if the depth will even work, just exploring options.

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Old 03-20-2017, 09:58 AM   #24
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Also found this pod/baffle made of ABS plastic, 3" deep, the speaker is 2.6" deep, not sure if that is enough or not?

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Metra-81-...&wl13=&veh=sem
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:05 AM   #25
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This whole distortion in the same compartment thing is concerning to me and has me 2nd guessing this decision. Do they sell prefabricated rigid pods for 6.5's? The speakers are installed 2/3's the way up the gunwale, so getting the sub lower and off set won't be an issue. I also only have approx. 6" of depth to deal with. I really don't have the means/resources to try and figure out the logistics of a fabrication solution.

I guess the other concern with mounting in the gunwale (something I didn't think too much about) is the weight of the subs at 4lbs and whether the fiberglass in this area is suitable for such an installation.
The obvious advantage of adding a subwoofer is extending the low bass reach. The ancillary byproduct to the now high-passed coaxials is even greater IMO. Having the subwoofer and coaxials sharing the same air space serves to undermine many of those benefits as the subwoofer turns the smaller coaxials into sympathetic radiators. It's usually worth the trouble.
You can always reinforce the subwoofer mounting baffle from behind for both mounting purposes and for acoustic reasons. Easy to do. However, given the span of that surface, I would expect the center console to be a more rigid structure.
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:07 AM   #26
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Also found this pod/baffle made of ABS plastic, 3" deep, the speaker is 2.6" deep, not sure if that is enough or not?

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Metra-81-...&wl13=&veh=sem
Almost zero remaining displacement after inserting the speaker motor and basket.
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:30 AM   #27
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Almost zero remaining displacement after inserting the speaker motor and basket.
How deep does a cup need to be in this case when the speaker is 2.6" deep?

I found this cup which not only appears to be better quality and goes as deep as 4".

http://store.earmarkcaraudio.com/Xca...cat=318&page=1
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:42 AM   #28
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Seems like this guy used the above cup for a similar install situation - speaker and sub sharing a compartment.

https://jetboaters.net/threads/sealed-vs-i-b-sub.5437/
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:35 AM   #29
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How deep does a cup need to be in this case when the speaker is 2.6" deep?

I found this cup which not only appears to be better quality and goes as deep as 4".

http://store.earmarkcaraudio.com/Xca...cat=318&page=1
Short of a larger custom fabrication, the off-the-shelf pod shown, or the largest version they would have available, would serve your purpose. You would need an adapter ring to span the distance between the outer pod flange and inner mounting that would be concealed by the speaker rim/grill. And you could stack a couple of rings to increase displacement.
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:54 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by David Analog View Post
Short of a larger custom fabrication, the off-the-shelf pod shown, or the largest version they would have available, would serve your purpose. You would need an adapter ring to span the distance between the outer pod flange and inner mounting that would be concealed by the speaker rim/grill. And you could stack a couple of rings to increase displacement.
The issue I have is access or lack thereof behind the gunwale to install a cup and ring in the more traditional way.

So I am trying to visualize how I would install this thing. The cut-out for the speaker in the gunwale is approx 4 3/4", enough to fit the speaker. Presumable this cup is flexible, so I could squeeze it through the cut out (?), then since the overall opening of the cup is more than large enough, could I not simply mount the cup to the back side of the gunwale using an adhesive (4200) applied around the perimeter of the cup, then after it cures, pop the speaker in and mount it as I normally would or is this a dumb idea?

Last edited by Fish'nFool; 03-20-2017 at 12:34 PM.
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Old 03-20-2017, 01:43 PM   #31
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Something is amiss. There is absolutely no reason to add the isolation pod/ring unless the 6.5" coaxial is sharing the same cavity with the 10" IB subwoofer. 'IF' sharing the cavity, and in near proximity, the pod goes in from behind thru the larger subwoofer opening and all pre-mounting is done with S.S. hardware prior to the coaxial speaker install. A rigid pod (as required) is not at all flexible. 4200? No, not a poly caulk for this application. And no adhesive would be needed.
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Old 03-20-2017, 05:54 PM   #32
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I was thinking the same as David. If they make that white one in a 7" or 8" size it would be perfect. Also you should have plenty of access though the hole that you would cut for the 10" sub. Rag's
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Old 03-20-2017, 06:47 PM   #33
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I was thinking the same as David. If they make that white one in a 7" or 8" size it would be perfect. Also you should have plenty of access though the hole that you would cut for the 10" sub. Rag's
The ear mark caps come in 7"+ sizes.

I guess I still don't understand the purpose of the ring or how these things get installed or in my case how it would be installed without seeing any of the mounting hardware from the outside (we are talking a gunwale install here). Presumably I would need to screw the cap on from the outside since there's no way to do that from behind.

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Old 03-20-2017, 07:25 PM   #34
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Screws that hold the speaker would go through the glass and into the Wood (birch) ring. Then you can screw the plastic cap (baffle) into the wood ring. Rag's
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Old 03-20-2017, 07:44 PM   #35
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Screws that hold the speaker would go through the glass and into the Wood (birch) ring. Then you can screw the plastic cap (baffle) into the wood ring. Rag's
But I suppose I would need to attach the cup to the ring first seeing how I can't do that from inside the gunwale?
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Old 03-20-2017, 08:07 PM   #36
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It's very basic. Pod mounts to ring first. Pod & ring assembly is loaded from the backside and pre-mounted prior to the speaker. Ring serves as an essential adapter to bridge between different I.D.s of speaker hole and ring flange. Countersunk & flush S.S. mounting screws go thru front of fiberglass coaming and into ring that is behind coaming wall with a different pattern than speaker mounting. Speaker rim/grill completely conceals countersunk pre-mounting screws.
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Old 03-21-2017, 05:36 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Analog View Post
It's very basic. Pod mounts to ring first. Pod & ring assembly is loaded from the backside and pre-mounted prior to the speaker. Ring serves as an essential adapter to bridge between different I.D.s of speaker hole and ring flange. Countersunk & flush S.S. mounting screws go thru front of fiberglass coaming and into ring that is behind coaming wall with a different pattern than speaker mounting. Speaker rim/grill completely conceals countersunk pre-mounting screws.
Now that makes sense to me,thanks.
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Old 03-21-2017, 05:06 PM   #38
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okay, new potential plan!

After noting the rod holder and under gunwale rod holders adjacent to the gunwale mounting location and the potential impact these ports would have on bass quality I looked at the console again for an alternative mounting location.

So now I am looking at 2 10's on either side of console point out. see pics below. the location would place them behind an access hatch as seen in the pics in a somewhat sealed space shared with electronics, wires and such, but they are not low, they would be more on plane with the speakers mounted across on the gunwale.

One concern I have is the impact to the compass which would be directly above the port sub. Are there other concerns that I am not thinking of by placing two 10" subs in this space that backs to my MFD's and other electronics and such?

Is it going to vibrate the crap out of the helm?

It does seem there might be more of a potential issue of rattling in this location?

Are 2 10" subs too many?

The fiberglass is thicker here too, not to mention install will be a heck of a lot easier.

Thoughts?
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Last edited by Fish'nFool; 03-21-2017 at 07:26 PM.
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Old 03-21-2017, 07:45 PM   #39
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I can see how that would be easier but subs that high up will not sound as good as down low. Subs do much better down low. It allows them to blend with the mids far better and the sub doesn't over power them by placement alone. I would still mount down low and keep sub as far from mids as possible.
Doing boat installs is always a compromise. The radiator issue is true but not as big of a deal compared to a sub placed in the wrong place. In a boat your size you get it about 90% right. That last 10% will keep you up at night second guessing. Just remember its a boat. Its the worst environment for set ups and sound quality. Like a convertible car but with water and no insulation.
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:06 PM   #40
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I can see how that would be easier but subs that high up will not sound as good as down low. Subs do much better down low. It allows them to blend with the mids far better and the sub doesn't over power them by placement alone. I would still mount down low and keep sub as far from mids as possible.
Doing boat installs is always a compromise. The radiator issue is true but not as big of a deal compared to a sub placed in the wrong place. In a boat your size you get it about 90% right. That last 10% will keep you up at night second guessing. Just remember its a boat. Its the worst environment for set ups and sound quality. Like a convertible car but with water and no insulation.
Thanks.

As for that other location on the gunwale, the other concern as noted is the ports being created in the space through the recessed rod holders and under Grunwald rod holders and the impact this might have on the bass quality.

I also got to thinking these subs could really rattle the thinner walls of the gunwale?

I thought the tighter more sealed space of the console despite being higher up would be yield the better sound result? And here I thought I found a nearly perfect solution.

Am I over thinking it? Just don't want to cut holes and regret it later.
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