The Hull Truth - Boating and Fishing Forum

Go Back   The Hull Truth - Boating and Fishing Forum > BOATING FORUMS > Marine Electronics Forum
Search

Notices

Random Quote: I had a few words with my wife, she had a few paragraphs with me.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-08-2010, 01:43 PM
  #1    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default WIRING 101...Bilge Pump/Float Switch

The boat I just got had nothing in the bilge except the float switch (wires cut) and the pump with corroded wiring that came apart as I was removing the switch for testing.

One new float switch is in hand and I want to install the switch and pump into the bilge.

From the wiring harness we have 3 wires: brown, yellow and brown/orange stripe.
(I'm pretty sure that the brown is hot when the helm Bilge switch is turned ON.)

Two brown wires from the Float Switch.

One Brown/one black from the Pump

Can somebody either explain or provide a diagram so I don't do things backwards? Thanks.
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2010, 04:25 PM
  #2    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

........anybody??????
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 11-08-2010, 05:01 PM
  #3    
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location:
Posts: 64
Default

I found this for a rule pump and switch

http://www.chipford.com/graphics/bilge_switch.pdf
AC1977 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2010, 05:26 PM
  #4    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: M.Vineyard, MA
Posts: 6,741
Default

Wiring float direct to the battery: http://www.ittflowcontrol.com/suppor...-a-battery.htm

Wiring thru a panel switch: http://www.ittflowcontrol.com/suppor...nel-switch.htm

http://www.ehow.com/how_5025934_wire-bilge-pump.html

Do not neglect to have an appropriately-sized inline fuse in the positive wire from battery + to the float switch. Do a search for your pump's specs to find the needed fuse size.

For a good diagram , you can search for bildge pump wiring diagram and check continuouswave .

If the pump wiring was coming apart in your hands , a new pump will include the pump/float diagram. Since it can potentially keep you & your boat afloat, don't skimp on bilge pumps.

Edit : AC1977 linked to a better diagram I couldn't dig up .
TTaxi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2010, 05:36 PM
  #5    
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6
Default

Of the three wires, one should always be hot and the other should be hot when you flip the switch. When you flip the switch the one that is hot should disable and no longer be hot. Can you confirm that?

If wired the way I think, the one that is always hot should go the float. The one that goes hot when you flip the switch should go to the pump and the other wire should go to the float. That wire should also go hot when you lift the float switch when everything is wired up

The black wire on the pump should go to a ground

So you should be able lift the float switch and see the pump go or flip the switch and manually enable the pump.
NetKeeper Fishing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2010, 05:57 PM
  #6    
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,468
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bamaboy473 View Post
From the wiring harness we have 3 wires: brown, yellow and brown/orange stripe.
(I'm pretty sure that the brown is hot when the helm Bilge switch is turned ON.)

Two brown wires from the Float Switch.

One Brown/one black from the Pump

Can somebody either explain or provide a diagram so I don't do things backwards?
This is the marine wire color code.

Does the boat have an indicator lamp or an audible alarm to indicate the pump is running?

Was a DVM used to measure the voltages on the wiring harness wires?

According to the code: the wiring harness yellow is ground and brown is hot on the harness; same for the pump, with black being ground.

If there isn't an indicator and if the harness brown is switched hot and if the harness brown/orange is always hot, then connect the pump brown to both the harness brown and the float switch brown (either one). Connect the other float brown to the harness brown/orange. Connect the pump black to the harness black.
__________________
2000 SeaRay 380 Sundancer
Mercruiser 454 MAG MPI Horizon 380hp
Westerbeke 7.0KW BCGB
many cool mods

wingless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 04:25 AM
  #7    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

I'll have time today to check things. I like NetKeeper's thought that the helm switch should disable the "always hot" lead. That was my concern about connecting both the alway lead and the helm switch leads to the pump. What would happen when the helm lead suddenly became hot, too?

More to come later after testing.
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 06:42 AM
  #8    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Fayetteville/Southport N.C.
Posts: 136
Default

Hey Rick, Nothing is going to happen if you are using ONE battery since the hot is the same source. Good luck , Capt. DaveMabes
P.S. You want a hot always so you can not turn it of by accident and leave it of!
__________________

Capt. Dave Mabes OUPV
233 Mako W/A
Twin 140 Suzuki's
Southport N.C.
Eat, Sleep and Go Fishing !
bohemian girl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 03:49 PM
  #9    
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bamaboy473 View Post
I'll have time today to check things. I like NetKeeper's thought that the helm switch should disable the "always hot" lead. That was my concern about connecting both the alway lead and the helm switch leads to the pump. What would happen when the helm lead suddenly became hot, too?

More to come later after testing.
The Helm switch is most probably there to serve as a manual override to the Float switch. i.e. the Float switch dies and you need to operate the bilge pump. It does happen.

You'll have to play with both with a meter but the switch is essentially allowing the power source to the pump be the float switch or the helm switch but not both at the same time.
NetKeeper Fishing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 03:50 PM
  #10    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingless View Post
This is the marine wire color code.

Does the boat have an indicator lamp or an audible alarm to indicate the pump is running? NO, but the HELM SWITCH IS LIGHTED IF I HIT THE ROCKER.

Was a DVM used to measure the voltages on the wiring harness wires? NO, BUT I FOUND THAT WITH NO HOT WIRE, A FUSE MUST HAVE BLOWN. FOUND THAT AND REPLACED THE FUSE.

NOW WE KNOW THE HARNESS Y IS ground, BROWN IS HELM SWITCH HOT, AND BROWN/ORANGE IS ALWAYS HOT.

According to the code: the wiring harness yellow is ground and brown is hot on the harness; same for the pump, with black being ground. YES

If there isn't an indicator and if the harness brown is switched hot and if the harness brown/orange is always hot, then connect the pump brown to both the harness brown and the float switch brown (either one). Connect the other float brown to the harness brown/orange. Connect the pump black to the harness black.
If I connect BOTH the brown (helm switch) and the Always Hot brown/orange wires to the pump....what will happen if the pump is running on auto and I happen to hit the helm switch? Won't that cause a nice big spark just before the pump motor fries??

We know that Pump Black and harness Yellow connect as the grounds.

We know that Pump Brown is the inlet for power.

We know that the Float Switch goes between the Brown/Orange "always On" and the Pump brown.

What we want to know is whether BOTH the Helm and the Auto wires (via float switch) both connect to the Pump wire?
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 03:53 PM
  #11    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetKeeper Fishing View Post
The Helm switch is most probably there to serve as a manual override to the Float switch. i.e. the Float switch dies and you need to operate the bilge pump. It does happen.

You'll have to play with both with a meter but the switch is essentially allowing the power source to the pump be the float switch or the helm switch but not both at the same time.
The helm switches are basic rockers and I turned the Helm switch ON to see if the "always on" wire went cold. It didn't.

Both Helm brown and the "always" brown/orange wires were hot until I turned the helm OFF.

thoughts?
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:11 PM
  #12    
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bamaboy473 View Post
The helm switches are basic rockers and I turned the Helm switch ON to see if the "always on" wire went cold. It didn't.

Both Helm brown and the "always" brown/orange wires were hot until I turned the helm OFF.

thoughts?
what wires are leaving the Helm Switch. Is it one Switch or multiple switches.

Also can you put a tester from one of the hot wires to the yellow wire to see if it does in fact ground.

Was there a high water alarm in the bilge anywhere?
NetKeeper Fishing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:18 PM
  #13    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

The brown wire (from the harness in the bilge) is the one controlled by the helm switch. That's it.

The tester's black lead on the Yellow will allow the brown/orange "always ON" wire to light up. It will only allow the brown helm wire to light up when the helm switch is ON.

No high water alarm that I can see..or know of. Does that help?
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:18 PM
  #14    
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Weeki Wachee (home of the mermaids), FL
Posts: 11,691
Default

Will this do? Had some free time in the spring...
__________________

The Aquasport Boat Club
seabob4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:18 PM
  #15    
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 6
Default

Also have you verified the Float Switch actually works before spending time wiring everything up.
NetKeeper Fishing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:21 PM
  #16    
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Weeki Wachee (home of the mermaids), FL
Posts: 11,691
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetKeeper Fishing View Post
Also have you verified the Float Switch actually works before spending time wiring everything up.
Good point, put a multimeter on it set to continuity. Lift the lever, should have continuity between both gray leads...
__________________

The Aquasport Boat Club
seabob4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:21 PM
  #17    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

Bob; the diagram seems to show that the "always ON" wire is spliced in with the Helm wire; albeit through the float switch.

Is it true that we join both the "Always" wire to the Helm wire..and both of those to the Pump? What would happen when the 12V from the helm switched that got turned ON collided with the 12V from the "always ON" wire?


Quote:
Originally Posted by seabob4 View Post
Will this do? Had some free time in the spring...
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:21 PM
  #18    
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,468
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingless View Post
This is the marine wire color code.

Does the boat have an indicator lamp or an audible alarm to indicate the pump is running?

Was a DVM used to measure the voltages on the wiring harness wires?

According to the code: the wiring harness yellow is ground and brown is hot on the harness; same for the pump, with black being ground.

If there isn't an indicator and if the harness brown is switched hot and if the harness brown/orange is always hot, then connect the pump brown to both the harness brown and the float switch brown (either one). Connect the other float brown to the harness brown/orange. Connect the pump black to the harness black.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bamaboy473 View Post
If I connect BOTH the brown (helm switch) and the Always Hot brown/orange wires to the pump....what will happen if the pump is running on auto and I happen to hit the helm switch? Won't that cause a nice big spark just before the pump motor fries??

We know that Pump Black and harness Yellow connect as the grounds.

We know that Pump Brown is the inlet for power.

We know that the Float Switch goes between the Brown/Orange "always On" and the Pump brown.

What we want to know is whether BOTH the Helm and the Auto wires (via float switch) both connect to the Pump wire?
It doesn't help when my quoted content is edited...

On my boat the indicator lamp is wired to illuminate when either the float switch drives the pump or when the dash rocker switch drives the pump.

Please show where I said this: "If I connect BOTH the brown (helm switch) and the Always Hot brown/orange wires to the pump".

This is what I said: "If there isn't an indicator and if the harness brown is switched hot and if the harness brown/orange is always hot, then connect the pump brown to both the harness brown and the float switch brown (either one). Connect the other float brown to the harness brown/orange. Connect the pump black to the harness black."

That wiring will cause the pump to run, either when the float switch is active or when the dash switch is active.

No fries until you go through the McDonalds drive-thru.
__________________
2000 SeaRay 380 Sundancer
Mercruiser 454 MAG MPI Horizon 380hp
Westerbeke 7.0KW BCGB
many cool mods

wingless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:27 PM
  #19    
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Weeki Wachee (home of the mermaids), FL
Posts: 11,691
Default

Rick,
Disregard the drawing you quoted. Very simple. Ground to ground. One lead off the float to constant hot, protected by a fuse. The other lead off the float spliced to the positive off the pump (usually brown) and run to the helm switch.

The concept is this. Turn on the pump at the helm, juice flows through the lead on the pump, pump turns on. Don't turn on the pump at the helm, water gets in bilge, float lever moves upward, switch turns on pump through the brown/gray splice...

I'll tell you how to do a constant hot pump in the next installment...
__________________

The Aquasport Boat Club
seabob4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2010, 07:33 PM
  #20    
Senior MemberCaptains Club Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,366
Default

not edited with anything other than misunderstanding, I assure you

What I think you've said is to wire the FLOAT between the Pump Brown and harness Brn/Or

Wire the Pump Black to the harness Yellow as a ground.

Wire the Pump brown to the Harness Brown (making a 3-wire connection at the Pump)

Is that it?

If so, my question stands...what, if anything, will happen if the Auto is activated and I turn the helm switch on, too? From what (I think) I understand, if power is getting to the Pump from the auto feature, then will the Helm switch being turned ON add a shorting situation?
__________________
Rick
Alabama Gulf Coast
Chaparral 240 Signature (Sold)
motorhome (newest cruiser)
bamaboy473 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 



©2009 TheHullTruth.com

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0