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Random Quote: When I die, send my body to my ex-wife. She could use a good meal.
What would be the best EPIRB or GPIRB for the money right now? Not one that would break the bank but a good one for the next five years?
Basically, all the ACR's and McMurdo/Reveres are good units. All units, PLB and EPIRB, cover the basic basics, and send essentially the same signal to the same place. You should review the added features (GPS, floatability, auto versus manual release, etc., etc.) and decide which ones are important enough to you that you are willing to pay for them. Both companies have websites detailing those features, and so do a number of their dealers.
If yours is a decade old it probably the non supported older type.
121 MHz I believe. Get a new one.
I don't have one and I don't go offshore either. One of the older ones came with my boat but it was out of date and used the old non-supported frequency so I disposed of it.
If I ever decide to go offshore, I would certainly get one first.
I just purchased one for my new boat...it was about $750. I got a cat II (manual deployment) because the automatic deployed units have a chance of getting caught up in the hardtop, antennas/net or whatever.. I don't have a good spot to mount it where there are no obstructions.
erb will float and most plb's needs a life jacket to float & will need to be held the whole time. an erb stays with 1 boat. you can not loan it to someone for the weekend. a plb stays with the person and not a boat. you can use it hiking, snow skiing & than go fishing.
It's interesting to note that the US does not have complusory requirements to carry Epirb's as does some other countries. More than 2nm from the coast in any vessel requires and epirb in Australia.
Epirb v PLB? PLB does not meet marine standards and hence is illegal over an Epirb. basically has to do with floatability and battery life.
__________________ The way forward in life is to first listen .......
Interesting that Australia does not accept PLB. Offshore we carried EPIRB's--but near shore, lakes, rivers/waterways, we use PLB in the US--To me the major advantage of the PLB is that you can carry it on your person. That is almost impossible with an EPRIB (as defined by Australia government--must float, upright, antenna out of the water, 48 hours battery). The PLB has only a 24 hour minimum battery--in reality it is longer--and enough to effect rescue nearshore.
I would say that even if you have an EPRIB for legal reasons, that a PLB would be prudent. I know of a number of cases where the EPRIB was stowed away and didn't depoly upon sinking--with loss of life. Better to have the PLB in your pocket and your life!
Also a waterproof hand held VHF, strobe light and GPS are essentials to have on your person/lifevest/ditch bag. The waterproof VHF with DSC and GPS are even better. The McMurdo PLB is $300. Incidently McMurdo now has a 48 hour battery PLB. The Fast Find Max G is listed as being buoyant,--you might check and see if it will qualify for the Australian marine use.
It would be fair to say that PLB's are not a waste on a boat but one must FIRST have an Epirb and this MUST be registered. For sure a PLB on the person as well as an Epirb on the vessel is the way to go.
I suppose once a PLB version is buoyant, floats upright and has a design 48 hour battery life then one would think it would meet the standards of an "epirb".
__________________ The way forward in life is to first listen .......
My plug for Epirbs. I am one of the Coast Guard pilots looking for you if you get lost. Without an Epirb, relying on where people said you would be, huge ocean, literally looking for a needle in a haystack. With an Epirb, still looking for a needle in a haystack, but now I have a little needle in the aircraft pointing to that needle in the haystack!! If you can't afford one, then you can't afford to go offshore!!! I have seen many lives lost simply because of something simple and no ability for us to find you. If you have any questions, please ask me!! We have a lot of new cool equipment we are bringing online now that work specifically with 406 epirbs, I don't want to go out and look for you, but if I have to, please help me find you!!
My plug for Epirbs. I am one of the Coast Guard pilots looking for you if you get lost. Without an Epirb, relying on where people said you would be, huge ocean, literally looking for a needle in a haystack. With an Epirb, still looking for a needle in a haystack, but now I have a little needle in the aircraft pointing to that needle in the haystack!! If you can't afford one, then you can't afford to go offshore!!! I have seen many lives lost simply because of something simple and no ability for us to find you. If you have any questions, please ask me!! We have a lot of new cool equipment we are bringing online now that work specifically with 406 epirbs, I don't want to go out and look for you, but if I have to, please help me find you!!
You have my vote. When you pick up a signal from a EPIRB, how long does it take you gentleman to respond and put the bird in the air? Are there any steps your bace has to go through before they send out a HC or plane. No one knows more about what really happens then you do so if you would I would be very interested in learning how things are handled step by step. Thanks for being there.
__________________ Fountain 31TE...... Hydra Sports 21 Bay...... Dodge 3500 Camping unit "Gone Fishing"..... Tinker Toy..... Sunset Point Nixonton NC
It is a large coordinated effort that we undertake every day, I will speak to my part in the process and tell you as much as I know about the other parts (other coasties please pipe in here). Our district command centers get notification of a Satellite EPIRB "hit". Hopefully it is a registered EPIRB, meaning the EPIRB's identification # can be referenced to a database to lookup its registration and contact the owner. This allows us to verify if this is an actual emergency. I believe (and this is where I need coasties that work in command centers to chime in and verify) it takes three "hits" on an EPIRB, and a position is compiled from those three hits, helps if the EPIRB also has an embedded GPS. When a position is compiled, the duty aircraft for the area is contacted and launched if it is not already airborne on a patrol. The time from first hit to launch can vary, but can be an hour or so. As a side note to this I have been asked many times while airborne to investigate a single hit EPIRB, so the time can be a lot less.
So once we are launched or diverted, we are given a position to start our search in. There are a lot of different variables and scenarios for what type of searches we will perform, but usually on a simple 406 EPIRB case we search a 12 mile radius from the search point. While we are searching the area, we are also using our equipment onboard to actively listen and scan the water for an EPIRB and/or a radar return. How this is done can vary by the type of aircraft we are using, I fly the HC 144 Ocean Sentry. This is our newest aircraft and has some of the latest equipment. We have a piece of equipment that listens to all of the frequencies that a distress signal will broadcast on, when it gets a signal it lets us know and gives us a needle point. We then use our radars, FLIR and good old eyeballs to try and locate the target. This can be daunting, even in perfect conditions. There have been several occasions that I have flown directly over flipped hulls in the water and looked right over them as they often look like whitecaps. Sometimes all you are looking for is a whitecap that will not go away!
If we are searching for a legitimate 406, and have a good signal, it can take several passes in an area to really center on where the needle is pointing, as it is also not perfect with all of the environmental factors that can affect it. When we do find something, our plane has the ability to drop rafts, pumps, radios and other rescue equipment to a person or vessel in distress. Depending on the location of other Coast Guard assets, we will then vector a helo, boat or good samaritan to assist on the surface.
The moral of the story is that safety equipment such as life jackets, EPIRBS, flares and life rafts will greatly increase your chance of survival in a maritime disaster and dramatically help us find you. Again, if any of you have questions, please ask as this is all I do for work and any time I can help to clarify something or help make you guys more safe, I have done my job. I grew up on the Central Florida Gulf Coast and have been fishing my entire life out there. I currently have a 2320 Parker that I fish out of Venice, LA and Pensacola, so the recreational boating community is near and dear to me.
Satellite EPIRB "hit".
HIT, are the satellite's kind of like a radar scanning on a boat but slower? Explain how hit works if you would. You mentioned three hits,, thats why I was wondering about the time frame on there on this one?
How fast after we set the epirb off do you actually pick us up?
__________________ Fountain 31TE...... Hydra Sports 21 Bay...... Dodge 3500 Camping unit "Gone Fishing"..... Tinker Toy..... Sunset Point Nixonton NC
I will have to defer to my shipmates whom work in command centers to get accurate info since I am only a pilot. But as far as my "limited" knowledge into detection, there are several satellite systems that accomplish this job SARSAT and GEOSAR and some NOAA GOES weather satellites. The GEOSAR satellites are polar orbiting, and I believe they often rely on repeater satellites to relay a 406 signal. At any rate, it may take time for a satellite to pass over the area of distress and relay the signal or "hit". This can take a few hours. A 406 EPIRB gives off, obviously a 406 MHz signal, but also a weaker 121.5 MHz signal, which is how we find it. All Coast Guard aircraft can track the 121.5 MHz signal. We constantly monitor this signal frequency when we patrol, so sometimes we hear an EPIRB, which sounds like an annoying beeping, and immediately turn to investigate. The newer aircraft and older aircraft being updated, can also now track on the 406 MHz frequency. This frequency carries more data and can give us a much better position. If you turn your EPIRB on and there happens to be a CG aircraft in the area, you may get a visit from us almost immediately. However, more often then not, it takes a few hours to compile a position by Satellites on a 406 signal, launch an aircraft which must be airborne within 30 minutes for a SAR launch, then the transit time to the position (could be an hour or so). So it could be a few hours before we are on scene if you are far offshore and your only distress signal was a 406. This is why it is important to have life jackets, rafts and flares in addition to your EPIRB if you are fishing offshore. I hope this helps.
I will have to defer to my shipmates whom work in command centers to get accurate info since I am only a pilot. But as far as my "limited" knowledge into detection, there are several satellite systems that accomplish this job SARSAT and GEOSAR and some NOAA GOES weather satellites. The GEOSAR satellites are polar orbiting, and I believe they often rely on repeater satellites to relay a 406 signal. At any rate, it may take time for a satellite to pass over the area of distress and relay the signal or "hit". This can take a few hours. A 406 EPIRB gives off, obviously a 406 MHz signal, but also a weaker 121.5 MHz signal, which is how we find it. All Coast Guard aircraft can track the 121.5 MHz signal. We constantly monitor this signal frequency when we patrol, so sometimes we hear an EPIRB, which sounds like an annoying beeping, and immediately turn to investigate. The newer aircraft and older aircraft being updated, can also now track on the 406 MHz frequency. This frequency carries more data and can give us a much better position. If you turn your EPIRB on and there happens to be a CG aircraft in the area, you may get a visit from us almost immediately. However, more often then not, it takes a few hours to compile a position by Satellites on a 406 signal, launch an aircraft which must be airborne within 30 minutes for a SAR launch, then the transit time to the position (could be an hour or so). So it could be a few hours before we are on scene if you are far offshore and your only distress signal was a 406. This is why it is important to have life jackets, rafts and flares in addition to your EPIRB if you are fishing offshore. I hope this helps.
Where a lot of guys have gotten rid of there 121.5 epirb are you saying that they would still be in good use?
How much longer are you going to monitor the 121.5 freq, and are you going to scan for both in the future or what is it that you have heard about going to 406 completely?
You talking with us is great so yes it helps and thank you very much for your time.
__________________ Fountain 31TE...... Hydra Sports 21 Bay...... Dodge 3500 Camping unit "Gone Fishing"..... Tinker Toy..... Sunset Point Nixonton NC
Epirb v PLB? PLB does not meet marine standards and hence is illegal over an Epirb. basically has to do with floatability and battery life.
Kerry
You keep saying this and have been told before (and I know, you don't care) that this is largely BS. Some of the PLB's have 24 hour battery life, while EPIRB's have 48. The 24-hour life is not part of "marine standards" in the U.S., and in no way is it "illegal." Also, several of the newer PLB's also have 48 hour battery life.
There is no "legality" about floatibiity either; it is just a feature. Some PLB/EPIRB's float, some don't, some do only with what an earlier poster fairly accurately called a "life jacket."
State the facts accurately or please don't state them at all.
(I should note that certain international standards [NOT U.S.] applying to large ships may require the 48 hour battery life for EPIRBS that wish to meet that standard.)
Last edited by KeyPineSavage; 10-02-2009 at 10:24 PM.
liveaboard (and anybody who isn't a pilot (airplane pilot)
Aircoastie is talking about two different things in regard to monitoring 121.5. When he said "We constantly monitor this signal frequency when we patrol," what he was referring to is the fact that virtually all aircraft worldwide constantly monitor 121.5, if they are able. It is the international distress frequency, and behind all dedicated military, company or other emergency freqs, it is the frequency of last resort for all emergency needs. Thus USCG, like every airliner, etc., constantly monitors it and that monitoring is obviously going to continue indefinitely.
Then there was his other subject...how they use 121.5 once they associate a signal with a marine distress situation. Here the 121 isn't of too much use until they are close. It's my understanding that any satellite monitoring of 121.5 has now been discontinued. As Coastie said, they can track on the 121.5 transmission. Just FYI, little 121.5 units are still being used on larger vessels as man overboard units. Every crewmember who goes to the deck has one on his jacket, belt, whatever. The ship carries homing equipment, much like the USCG aircraft has, which will allow it to return to an overboard crewman quickly and accurately.
These last uses really have nothing to do with getting rescue attention when you need it. That is really only done by satellite (unless like Coastie said they happen to have a unit in your area) and ALL the satellite work is now on 406.
You keep saying this and have been told before (and I know, you don't care) that this is largely BS. Some of the PLB's have 24 hour battery life, while EPIRB's have 48. The 24-hour life is not part of "marine standards" in the U.S., and in no way is it "illegal." Also, several of the newer PLB's also have 48 hour battery life.
There is no "legality" about floatibiity either; it is just a feature. Some PLB/EPIRB's float, some don't, some do only with what an earlier poster fairly accurately called a "life jacket."
State the facts accurately or please don't state them at all.
(I should note that certain international standards [NOT U.S.] applying to large ships may require the 48 hour battery life for EPIRBS that wish to meet that standard.)
In the US you really don't have any facts (or no marine standards for that matter regarding Epirbs) as it is your option to have an Epirb or not. You don't have one, you don't want one then I don't care, you don't have to have one.
BUT what I am saying and this just might apply to the US as well if you get it introduced as a legal requirement is that where Epirbs are legislated and must adhere to standards then what I have previously stated is the FACTS.
These FACTS apply to any vessel recreational or otherwise that is more than 2nm from land in countries that have such FACTS.
Now I suppose it all depends on just how, when and why the US legislate Epirbs for recreational Epirbs. You just may have to deal with these same FACTS in the near future as well? At the moment you don't, for how long? Who knows?
__________________ The way forward in life is to first listen .......
Where a lot of guys have gotten rid of there 121.5 epirb are you saying that they would still be in good use?
How much longer are you going to monitor the 121.5 freq, and are you going to scan for both in the future or what is it that you have heard about going to 406 completely?
You talking with us is great so yes it helps and thank you very much for your time.
NO Old 121.5mhz Epirbs are not good to use and in fact illegal to use in the US since Jan 1, 2007.
What has been an issue is ground/aircraft equipment with the ability to track the 406mhz epirb signal. This equipment is still coming up to speed (properly) and no doubt when it does then the 121.5 tracking signal in the 406 epirbs may not be required either in future models?
Would certainly make a 406mhz simplier to make without have to build in 2 totally separate different frequencies.
__________________ The way forward in life is to first listen .......
Satellite EPIRB "hit".
HIT, are the satellite's kind of like a radar scanning on a boat but slower? Explain how hit works if you would. You mentioned three hits,, thats why I was wondering about the time frame on there on this one?
How fast after we set the epirb off do you actually pick us up?
A 406 Epirb is detected almost immediately by the GEOSAR satellites. Being registered they will first try and confirm (telephone) that you are in fact in trouble based on your registration details.
If you have GPS equiped Epirb then they will also have your location to within 150 metres and time then depends on how far somebody has to go to get you (be it boat or aircraft).
If not GPS model then it could take some time for the orbiting LEOSAR satellites of the system to locate your position.
__________________ The way forward in life is to first listen .......
NO Old 121.5mhz Epirbs are not good to use and in fact illegal to use in the US since Jan 1, 2007.
I happened to come across this information, I checked it, then I discarded the one that came with my boat. No sense sending a signal that nobody is listening to.
