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Random Quote: Lets sit down and see where we stand!
We are NOT talking about displays on 100 ton tankers or military carriers like the USS Ronald Reagan. We are talking about recreational units from $500 to a couple grand. They all have the same display technology, and they were ALL made in the same plants in Korea and China. Sorry, that's the fact. Are you aware of how many plants actually make LCD displays around the world? You will be very surprised at the answer.
Your subjective argument basically said, "Birdman is correct". Thanks. You simply keep stating "what a particular users THINKS or PREFERS". That is not what the facts are based on. As I mentioned, I like PC's better. But PC's do NOT have the better UI right now, MAC's do by a mile. So my own personal suggestive reality is, I like the PC UI better. But the FACT remains, the MAC has a better UI, whether I like it or not. That is NOT subjective, it's fact. Now if 90 out of 100 users like a UI over another, then the fact is, that UI is better (aka easier) to use.
Your just mis-interpreting what part of subjective your looking at. I'm looking at the pure facts of which UI is easier to use, period. Not by any particular group of people, not by what certain folks might like better (from their point of view), I'm just talking hard facts like: how many buttons to push to do something, or how easy is it for a non-knowledgeable user to find somehting they never looked for before, how many keystokes are things, how technical deos the user need to be to understand what he is doing. For a filter, does he select "Low, Med, High", OR, does he select "DEEP WATER", "Medium Water or SHALLOW WATER". The later being easier because it's in plain english. Those are NOT subjective items, those are facts.
And for those type of reasons, the Gamin's current interface is 100 times easier to use, period. Now, wether YOU (or anyone else) in particular would "prefer" (now we are talking subjective) it one way or another, that is another story.
What's important is that they are ALL good enough. Period. They all do the same job, and they all exceed our real requirements.
Second, Garmin isn't in financial trouble; Raymarine is. That may be because they missed the market shift, or because the bottom fell out of their base, or they were heavily leveraged and the executives mismanaged their future, or all of that and then some.
It doesn't matter.
Garmin is a superior value. Furuno has excellent products, but they carry a price premium (and they just increased their prices). Raymarie offers an excellent product line, but again, cost is up there. RM may not be able to continue operations and that's a darn shame.
All the other babble is just chest thumping and men-unit comparison.
__________________
Terry Jason 35, Yanmar 370 hp, Lots of fun at a leisurely pace
lets all go back to a weight with a string attached to give us depth,,, and a lookout on the top of the mast to give us radar,,, and a cone with a hole in it to give us a VHF,,, Man,,, you guys would fit right in in that era. Give a canon and a sailboat ( cause again there was no power) and let yas shoot each others brains out... and we can watch from our skiffs. Buy what you like and be happy,,, if its great for you it might not be great for someone else. Sort of like someone else's wife,, well most of the time,,,Smile,, joe
You seem hell bent on determining what someone else should like. Get over it as what you like and what someone else like is and can be 100% different.
Anthem
This sort of sums up recent THT Methodology 101, not just from Birdman, although this is an excellent example, and certainly not just in the Electronics Forum. Lately so many here seem "hell bent on determining what someone else should like." Somebody posts, "I need to know if product Y will do so and so. And by the way, I really don't want to talk about product X. I know it and what it will do, but I just don't like it, so tell me about Y" Well, a very large percent of his "answers" will still be about X....how it is really SO much better he's just a dumb azz not to want it instead, how X compares to Z, yadda, yadda, yadda. This helps no one and nothing except the ego of the non-answer poster and his need to run on and on.
Need to get back to staying on track. I pretty much agree with Jeff from Navionics about a fork having been stuck in this thread a long way back.
We are NOT talking about displays on 100 ton tankers or military carriers like the USS Ronald Reagan. We are talking about recreational units from $500 to a couple grand. They all have the same display technology, and they were ALL made in the same plants in Korea and China. Sorry, that's the fact. Are you aware of how many plants actually make LCD displays around the world? You will be very surprised at the answer.
Your subjective argument basically said, "Birdman is correct". Thanks. You simply keep stating "what a particular users THINKS or PREFERS". That is not what the facts are based on. As I mentioned, I like PC's better. But PC's do NOT have the better UI right now, MAC's do by a mile. So my own personal suggestive reality is, I like the PC UI better. But the FACT remains, the MAC has a better UI, whether I like it or not. That is NOT subjective, it's fact. Now if 90 out of 100 users like a UI over another, then the fact is, that UI is better (aka easier) to use.
Your just mis-interpreting what part of subjective your looking at. I'm looking at the pure facts of which UI is easier to use, period. Not by any particular group of people, not by what certain folks might like better (from their point of view), I'm just talking hard facts like: how many buttons to push to do something, or how easy is it for a non-knowledgeable user to find somehting they never looked for before, how many keystokes are things, how technical deos the user need to be to understand what he is doing. For a filter, does he select "Low, Med, High", OR, does he select "DEEP WATER", "Medium Water or SHALLOW WATER". The later being easier because it's in plain english. Those are NOT subjective items, those are facts.
And for those type of reasons, the Gamin's current interface is 100 times easier to use, period. Now, wether YOU (or anyone else) in particular would "prefer" (now we are talking subjective) it one way or another, that is another story.
And I'm not talking displays on 100 ton tankers or aircraft carriers. Now, maybe you think 45-75ft boats are aircraft carriers and you can't tell the difference between the two of them. . . . BTW if you're talking largest displays for a couple of G's, thats pretty foolish as most of the large Garmin units you're talking about are way over those couple of G's. Don't try to carve out your wrong statements.
I don't think you get it that you aren't correct. I haven't made broad sweeping assertions that are indefensible. You have. You can say a majority of people may prefer an interface over another. But you can't say Mac's have a better interface to everybody - PERIOD.
I have no problem with opinions. I have a problem with people calling other people WRONG when they aren't. You're still trying to point out opinions that are wrong which just isn't possible as they are opinions. I'm throwing hard facts at you that you were 100% wrong which aren't opinions.
Now you're starting to twist the facts. you can argue ergonomics all you want. The study of ergonomics with qualitative and quantitative analysis can be interpreted as fact with sufficient market breadth. The concept of "ease of use" for a particular user will always be subjective to that user. So, all your twisting and turning isn't going to change that. If one person determines that punch cards are easier for THEM to enter code, then hey its their interpretation of ease of use. PERIOD.
BTW, most mainstream displays are made by a few manufacturers. Most marine manufacturers use Flextronics as their OEM manufacturer as well and they source from their component manufacturers. HOWEVER, the top end marine displays are NOT all produced from the same manufacturers. If you knew the market, you wouldn't make such ignorant comments. The special features/characteristics of these displays isn't the glass, its quite a bit more than that. There are quite a few of these manufacturers out of Eastern Europe and elsewhere. If it was as simple as just the glass being made, then there wouldn't be a difference between PC LCD's and marine LCD's. Maybe I should turn the question around - do YOU know all the various places that these specialized displays are made around the world ? I doubt you know as I don't even know all of them and I know where a lot of these are made more than you.
Now, defend this - "And for those type of reasons, the Gamin's current interface is 100 times easier to use, period.". I'd like to see you quantify this. you can't. It's an ignorant and idiotic statement to make.
This sort of sums up recent THT Methodology 101, not just from Birdman, although this is an excellent example, and certainly not just in the Electronics Forum. Lately so many here seem "hell bent on determining what someone else should like." Somebody posts, "I need to know if product Y will do so and so. And by the way, I really don't want to talk about product X. I know it and what it will do, but I just don't like it, so tell me about Y" Well, a very large percent of his "answers" will still be about X....how it is really SO much better he's just a dumb azz not to want it instead, how X compares to Z, yadda, yadda, yadda. This helps no one and nothing except the ego of the non-answer poster and his need to run on and on.
Need to get back to staying on track. I pretty much agree with Jeff from Navionics about a fork having been stuck in this thread a long way back.
SOOOOOOO true.
It's mostly the power of psychology that drives much of these "discussions." Now I DEMAND that you believe that my assertion is correct!!!!
Interesting. When I went to our local fishing show and played with all of the chartplotters, I felt the HDS was the easiest for me to use. I chalked it all up to past experience with Lowrance products though.
__________________ SoCal : Twin Vee 26' Express "MamaMia", 14' Novurania and 9' Zodiac tender
