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Old 01-23-2011, 06:56 AM
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Default HEPA vs. hi effiicency filtration

In line with the knitting needles thread, What is the difference between 99.97 HEPA and 99.7 micro anti allergy filtration other than catching a few more particles - is it the size of thos eextra particles that is critical? There seems to be a big price difference or is it just the brand name? The cheaper ones do not use the HEPA term - is there a standard? They seem to be almost the same. Thanks - we have kids with allergies and purposely use these bag vacuums instead of the bagless (which I still don't get they seem so messy and still have all these little filters...) Anyway neither advertisement discusses particle size....

http://www.amazon.com/Hoover-WindTun...2&sr=8-1-spell

or this HEPA

http://www.amazon.com/Hoover-Type-HE...2&sr=8-3-spell
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Old 01-23-2011, 08:35 AM
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Just an opinion, anytime you use a vacuum, you're going to blow dust around the house by stirring the air with the exhaust. Anything 99%+ is going to do about the same thing with a vacuum. If you have hardwoods, a Swiffer type will do a better job of not spreading dust. If you have pets, you need to check what the chemical is in the Swiffer.

There appears to be several new electrostatic dusters that work for floors, furniture, computer and TV screens, etc. I don't know much about them, but the concept looks sound. Still, you'll need a vacuum of some sort and I buy good filters for my Kirby.

I've always liked a whole house vacuum with an outdoor exhaust. If I ever build new, I'll install a central vac with a "sweeper" door in the toe space of any areas with cabinets.
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Old 01-23-2011, 10:13 PM
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A hepa is folded media filter with a ton more surface area than a standard pleated home filter. They stop the same size particles, but the HEPA lasts a long time before losing efficiency.

You really need a way to compare the life expectancies of the filter component to make a good judgement on which is more economical.
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Old 01-24-2011, 05:08 AM
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Originally Posted by aln View Post
A hepa is folded media filter with a ton more surface area than a standard pleated home filter. They stop the same size particles, but the HEPA lasts a long time before losing efficiency.

You really need a way to compare the life expectancies of the filter component to make a good judgement on which is more economical.
You realize he's talking about vacuum cleaner bags?
Micro filters (9) for $7, HEPA filters (2) for $10.
I don't think I'd need to do a "study" to compare the life expectancy of 9 vs 2. I'm 61 yrs old, I'll be dead by the time I used 11 filter bags. Even if I lived that long, I'd forget why I was doing the study.
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Old 01-25-2011, 08:44 AM
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You realize he's talking about vacuum cleaner bags?
Micro filters (9) for $7, HEPA filters (2) for $10.
I don't think I'd need to do a "study" to compare the life expectancy of 9 vs 2. I'm 61 yrs old, I'll be dead by the time I used 11 filter bags. Even if I lived that long, I'd forget why I was doing the study.
Thanks.....what's your point?
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Old 01-25-2011, 08:56 AM
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Hope this helps:

Vacuum cleaners

Many vacuum cleaners also use HEPA filters as part of their filtration systems. This is beneficial for asthma and allergy sufferers, because the HEPA filter traps the fine particles (such as pollen and dust mite feces) which trigger allergy and asthma symptoms. For a HEPA filter in a vacuum cleaner to be effective, the vacuum cleaner must be designed so that all the air drawn into the machine is expelled through the filter, with none of the air leaking past it. This is often referred to as "Sealed HEPA" or sometimes the more vague "True HEPA." Vacuum cleaners simply labeled HEPA have a HEPA filter, but not all air necessarily passes through it. Finally, vacuum cleaner filters marketed as "HEPA-like" will typically use a filter of a similar construction to HEPA, but without the filtering efficiency. Because of the extra density of a HEPA filter, HEPA vacuum cleaners require more powerful motors to provide adequate cleaning power.
Newer models claim to be better than the first models because of being "washable". Generally washable filters are expensive. Some manufacturers claim filter standards such as "HEPA 4", without explaining the meaning behind them. It refers to their Minimum Efficiency Reporting Value (MERV) rating. These ratings are used to rate the ability of an air cleaner filter to remove dust from the air as it passes through the filter. MERV is a standard used to measure the overall efficiency of a filter. The MERV scale ranges from 1 to 20, and measures a filter's ability to remove particles from 10 to 0.3 micrometre in size. Filters with higher ratings not only remove more particles from the air, they also remove smaller particles.



Now back to my knitting group. LOL
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Old 01-25-2011, 09:30 AM
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Thanks.....what's your point?
The point is that there's no practical amount of time to "compare the life expectancies of the filter component". By the time Grunt finished the bag of 9, he'd be too old to try out the bag of 2. Even if he really uses a lot of filter bags, how do you really know which is best? Your only argument is how long they last and I assume, what's the best buy over time.

There are some good studies on whole house filtration, but I wouldn't trust the hype of a vacuum cleaner manufacturer. I've already gone on record as to how inaccurate Consumer Reports was in my own field of expertize, so I doubt they'd do any better at vacuum cleaner bags.

I'd buy the bag of 9 @ $7 and if I'm still able to vacuum at 70 something, I'd buy another bag of 9. They both filter about the same amount of particles. These are the choices for the Hoover vac that Grunt has. I'm sure there are vacuums and bag that are certified to filter at true HEPA micron standards, but I don't believe that vac is capable of achieving those standards.

I'm gonna go clean my conceal carries with some nice slightly oiled cleaning paper. Any more talk about vacuums and I might have to hand in the Man Card!
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Old 01-25-2011, 09:44 PM
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No argument, just explaining the difference between ordinary sweeper filter media and HEPA.
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Old 01-26-2011, 03:48 AM
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Thanks and no argument with anything said. I think we use a bag every month or every second month. We entertain a lot and our children are here with ther kids every weekend - and our house is sorta a neighboorhood open house for the neighbors and friends kids in the summer who like to use our pool table and pool - fine with us as it tempers the empty nest syndrome. And, my wife seems to like to vacuum snow and water which ends the bag life in short order. I don't care about price if they HEPA really is better since my kids have allergies. My thought was the cheaper ones did sound as good as the HEPA and I thought we were paying for the price only of the Hoover brand.

Don't have one foot in the grave yet but when I slow down too much people do start throwing dirt on me.
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Old 01-26-2011, 05:24 AM
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You/she certainly use a lot more bags than I do. I only use the regular vac for the few rugs in the house. I actually use a shopvac type for the hardwoods. The house is filtered with pleated filters in each return and a 4" thick HEPA filter at the air handler.

Mastercraft http://www.mastercraftusa.com/main.php makes some good vacs, I have a couple of SootMasters left over from the old days. Good luck on your filter studies.
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