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Old 11-05-2010, 06:47 PM
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Default Bill of Sale example, purchase deposit wording.

I am in the process of purchasing a boat from a fellow THT'er and I have paid a deposit that I agreed is non-refundable should I renege on the deal. I need something that protects me should the seller renege on the deal so I can get my deposit back.

I am also looking for an example Bill of Sale for a boat purchase. Is it typical to have a Bill of Sale for the boat AND the trailer, or is it just considered one unit?

If anyone has anything they can email to me I would be very appreciative. Or if you have something you can fax to me, my fax# 419-837-5006.

I am just looking to create some documentation that protects both of us and really don't feel like paying an attorney to write up a document. I trust the seller and want to keep it simple.

Thanks, Russ
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Old 11-05-2010, 07:15 PM
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I posted an example here: http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-...bill-sale.html
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Old 11-05-2010, 07:38 PM
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Thanks GF! I will see if I can personalize it.


Russ
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Old 11-06-2010, 05:27 AM
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This will be a measure of your fellow THTer's character. If, as you said, you have already paid the deposit and agreed it is non-refundable, it's a little late to think about adding a condition to get your deposit back if the seller backs out. If he agrees to the amended conditions at this point, that's a checkmark in the plus column for him. I hope that's how things turn out.
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Old 11-06-2010, 05:31 AM
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This will be a measure of your fellow THTer's character. If, as you said, you have already paid the deposit and agreed it is non-refundable, it's a little late to think about adding a condition to get your deposit back if the seller backs out. If he agrees to the amended conditions at this point, that's a checkmark in the plus column for him. I hope that's how things turn out.
Sounds like his agreement was he loses his deposit if HE renegs on the deal. If the seller backs out(finds a higher bidder, for example) I think he should get his deposit back. What happens if during sea trial an engine blows? I would think his deposit becomes refundable.
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Old 11-06-2010, 11:25 AM
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Sounds like his agreement was he loses his deposit if HE renegs on the deal. If the seller backs out(finds a higher bidder, for example) I think he should get his deposit back. What happens if during sea trial an engine blows? I would think his deposit becomes refundable.
I agree with what you say should happen, but it sounds like the deposit was paid without all those conditions agreed upon in writing. That places the buyer at the mercy of the seller's character.
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Old 11-06-2010, 11:37 AM
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Russ, my question is whether you have anything in writing that goes along with the deposit that you sent. If not, then it's a mutual trust thing that really can't be reversed without both parties signing off on the additional terms.

If you don't have anything in writing and want a Binder (lists conditions under which sale will proceed), send me your e-mail addy and I'll forward one to you. It's in MS Word so you and the seller can modify it to suit your particular needs.

I can also forward a sample Bill of Sale, which is the natural continuation of the binder when all contingencies have been met and signed off on.
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Old 11-06-2010, 12:06 PM
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No I didn't do anything in writing, I am usually a paperwork guy but I trust the seller. It's my wife that said I should get something in writing to get the deposit back should something happen and the seller renege's on the deal. I don't think the seller will have a problem revising the terms because as long as he covers his end of the deal everything is cool. I am more concerned if something happens to the boat on his trip from Georgia to Ohio, I can't be responsible for the boat until it gets to my residence. If it gets damaged I need to make sure the seller is responsible for the damage and/or I get my deposit back.

Rick- My email is: russturbo@aol.com

Thanks for the advice.

Russ
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Old 11-06-2010, 02:18 PM
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I agree with what you say should happen, but it sounds like the deposit was paid without all those conditions agreed upon in writing. That places the buyer at the mercy of the seller's character.
Really doesnt place him at the mercey of seller. read his post agasin:

"I am in the process of purchasing a boat from a fellow THT'er and I have paid a deposit that I agreed is non-refundable should I renege on the deal."

The part about" should I renege on the deal" He didnt agree to pay a nonrefundable deposit should the seller reneg.
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Old 11-06-2010, 07:10 PM
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FWIW, all of my boat transactions have been the same; nothing leaves the driveway that isn't insured by the owner. In other words, if a buyer pays me, the his insurance covers the boat from the second his money reaches me. That's in the Binder and the Bill of Sale. I think that coverage would be quite skewed if somebody had a deposit on a boat that was still owned by the seller; to me the seller would be the only person that could legally insure a boat, so if a claim was made, the seller would be the only loss payee.

If you have a deposit on at boat and don't own the boat while it's being brought to you...then my suggestion is the NOT continue the process. That isn't to say to drop the sale; but it means that you and the seller need to know exactly who is the loss payee should anything happen to the boat.

Last week I had a transporter bring a boat from CA to AL. The transporter's insurance would likely have covered any loss, but I bound the boat/trailer on midnight before the day of pickup; making me the loss payee.




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No I didn't do anything in writing, I am usually a paperwork guy but I trust the seller. It's my wife that said I should get something in writing to get the deposit back should something happen and the seller renege's on the deal. I don't think the seller will have a problem revising the terms because as long as he covers his end of the deal everything is cool. I am more concerned if something happens to the boat on his trip from Georgia to Ohio, I can't be responsible for the boat until it gets to my residence. If it gets damaged I need to make sure the seller is responsible for the damage and/or I get my deposit back.

Rick- My email is: russturbo@aol.com

Thanks for the advice.

Russ
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Old 11-06-2010, 09:14 PM
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This is what I sent to the seller, does this sound reasonable? Anything I should add? The last line about getting title in the State of Ohio may not be appropriate...not sure how I can protect myself for that one since the boat does not have a title and the State of Ohio requires a title. I am going to the State Division of Watercraft on Monday morning to figure this one out.

Buyer xxxxxxxxxxx agree's to pay xxxxxxxxx a non refundable deposit of $1,000 for the purchase of a xxxx Pro-Line xxxxx the deposit will be non refundable if the Buyer decides to not purchase the boat for whatever reason.

The $1,000 deposit will be refunded by the Seller; should the boat not be delivered as promised to the Buyers address before 11/30/10. If the Seller renege's on the sale of the boat for whatever reason, if the boat and/or trailer is damaged during the transport of the boat, if any of these circumstances arise the full $1,000 deposit will be returned to the Buyer.

The condition of the boat and any damage that is sustained during transport will be the sole responsibility of the Seller until the boat is delivered in good condition (good condition must be agreed between both the Buyer and the Seller) to the Buyer's residence, delivery of the signed bill of sale and current registration. If the Buyer is unable to legally title the boat and trailer in the state of Ohio because the correct documentation cannot be provided by the Seller, the Buyer is entitled to a full refund of the $1,000 deposit and the purchase will be considered null and void.


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Old 11-07-2010, 02:55 AM
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In the situation you have worded above, the seller would still own the boat until you take delivery at your house, is that what you intended?

That's not usually the way it works.

In most transactions, you would pay for the boat in full and take ownership at the current location of the boat, get it properly titled and registered in your state and it is then your (the buyer's) responsibility for transport.

If I were the seller I would not accept the agreement as you have it worded.
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Old 11-07-2010, 03:33 AM
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In the situation you have worded above, the seller would still own the boat until you take delivery at your house, is that what you intended?

That's not usually the way it works.

In most transactions, you would pay for the boat in full and take ownership at the current location of the boat, get it properly titled and registered in your state and it is then your (the buyer's) responsibility for transport.

If I were the seller I would not accept the agreement as you have it worded.
X2 I wouldn't drive my boat 10 miles before I got paid for it. Otherwise, seller is at the mercy of a buyer that's never seen the boat, and he can nitpick it to death with plans of reducing the price paid.
Insuring the boat during the trip is a function of who owns it, too.
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Old 11-07-2010, 04:23 AM
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FWIW, my uncle is trying to get Ohio to issue a title on a car he inherited without a title. It is not stolen- we know the vehicle history. The process has taken 6 weeks and counting so far- not fast or easy. It's likely you will need a bill of sale to start the title application process, in which case you won't know that you can get an Ohio title until the sale is completed.
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Old 11-07-2010, 06:11 AM
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FWIW, my uncle is trying to get Ohio to issue a title on a car he inherited without a title. It is not stolen- we know the vehicle history. The process has taken 6 weeks and counting so far- not fast or easy. It's likely you will need a bill of sale to start the title application process, in which case you won't know that you can get an Ohio title until the sale is completed.
Obtaining an ohio title wont be difficult if you get a bos stating the hin and motor # and have a copy of something showing the previous owner owned it. A registration would work fine. Russ, if/ when you try to obtain a title, pm me and i'll walk you through the process. There are a couple small details that will save you a huge headache.
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Old 11-07-2010, 11:09 AM
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I agreed to pay the current owner cash when the boat gets here. There has to be a little trust involved in my opinion. If I back out of the deal the seller keeps my $1,000 deposit. If I were going to pick up the boat and had said that I wouldn't pay for the boat until I got it home, I don't blame the seller for not accepting that.

GF-The seller is brlnging the boat to me, I'm sure he's not going to unhook the boat and sign over the paperwork until he gets the cash. I don't understand your position. Would you pay for a boat in full BEFORE it gets to you? Especially if you have never seen the boat in person?

I know I'm trusting the seller that everything he is telling me is the truth. But again I'm not paying him for the boat until it gets here so we are both essentially protected.

Jeff- I will certainly take you up on your offer for help in getting the boat titled in Ohio. I bought a Scarab Sport w/ twin 225 outboards from Michigan and it probably took me 25 hours of work to get everything I needed to get the boat and the engines titled. The Scarab had a title for the boat but neither engine had a title. I had to get the serial number tracings off of the outboards and I don't even remember what else the State of Ohio required. It was a total nightmare and I don't want to go through that again.

I am paranoid about the title thing because I know a guy that purchased a travel trailer that didn't have a title and after doing everything he could simply not get a title and had to sell it back to the guy he bought it from. The State of Ohio seems to be WAY worse than most states when it comes to titling. I couldn't even get a trailer plate unless I provided a trailer mfg, serial number, weight tag, and date the trailer was made.

Russ
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Old 11-07-2010, 01:53 PM
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Just curious, Russ. How far is the seller travelling to get the boat to you?
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Old 11-07-2010, 04:21 PM
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Georgia to Ohio.
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Old 11-08-2010, 05:09 AM
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Jeff- I will certainly take you up on your offer for help in getting the boat titled in Ohio. I bought a Scarab Sport w/ twin 225 outboards from Michigan and it probably took me 25 hours of work to get everything I needed to get the boat and the engines titled. The Scarab had a title for the boat but neither engine had a title. I had to get the serial number tracings off of the outboards and I don't even remember what else the State of Ohio required. It was a total nightmare and I don't want to go through that again.

I am paranoid about the title thing because I know a guy that purchased a travel trailer that didn't have a title and after doing everything he could simply not get a title and had to sell it back to the guy he bought it from. The State of Ohio seems to be WAY worse than most states when it comes to titling. I couldn't even get a trailer plate unless I provided a trailer mfg, serial number, weight tag, and date the trailer was made.

Russ
Exactly. There are a few things that will make this part painless.
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Old 11-08-2010, 05:17 AM
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and have a copy of something showing the previous owner owned it. A registration would work fine.
That detail sounds like a valuable tip and could easily be overlooked in a sale.
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