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Random Quote: If you haven't run aground, you haven't been around...
I have a friend who was a nuclear physicist in the U.S. Navy and now works for the department of energy. He knows his fuels. Anyway, I know there has been a lot of talk about Ethanol on here lately so I figured I would post what he shared with me:
“Ethanol is nothing to worry about. Ethanol is often blended to about 10% in gasoline – your engine should operate normally, actually there are slightly fewer emissions. IN addition, ethanol breaks down deposits of crud that accumulate in the engine and acts as a cleaner. Pure ethanol can degrade rubber components (not plastic as much), but all new automotive engines have synthetic o-rings and gaskets now in the fuel system. I’m not sure about marine engines, but I imagine that would also be the case.”
Now go ask him since we are talking about the marine environment, where condensation and water is in much higher concentrations if the ethanol will work much like dry gas and will absorb more water into the fuel? If so we have gas tank corrosion problems, and boats built with fiberglass tanks are now reporting the fiberglass tanks are brekaing down due to the ETHANOL.
He may know his fuels, but problem concerns on this board are not the same as those in the auto industry!
Now go ask him since we are talking about the marine environment, where condensation and water is in much higher concentrations if the ethanol will work much like dry gas and will absorb more water into the fuel? If so we have gas tank corrosion problems, and boats built with fiberglass tanks are now reporting the fiberglass tanks are brekaing down due to the ETHANOL.
He may know his fuels, but problem concerns on this board are not the same as those in the auto industry! This is the problem we are facing no one is thinking out of the box and is only thinking the automotive world.
1. It's none too good for just about every synthetic - material fuel tank.
2. Rubber hoses are still pretty common in the marine environment. Ethanol isn't kind to them, either.
3. Ethanol's BTU output per unit of measure can't compare to gasoline. This can mean you won't make the same HP at the same throttle setting / fuel flow. For displacement - critical hulls (where another 500 lbs really can make a big difference in your time - to plane, top speed etc) this can be really bad. I've seen this on vessels as large as 110'.
4. "Crud" cleaned up by fuel on it's way to my engine isn't a good thing....
Most of us who can afford the world of boating probably drive a relatively new car. Some of our boats are 30 or more years old. The cars are designed with the latest combinations of emissions standards and fuels out there. Our boats typically are not (tho the OB's may actually be). Perhaps the manufacturer's association needs to give more input on that. So, with all the maintenance we do just to keep our rigs running with regular gasoline, if someone asks 'hey, how about this chemical additive which may or may not be good for the synthetic components in your vessel and may or may not rob you of power' I'd have to say 'Yeahh... just keep it away from my boat...'.
Now go ask him since we are talking about the marine environment, where condensation and water is in much higher concentrations if the ethanol will work much like dry gas and will absorb more water into the fuel? If so we have gas tank corrosion problems, and boats built with fiberglass tanks are now reporting the fiberglass tanks are brekaing down due to the ETHANOL.
He may know his fuels, but problem concerns on this board are not the same as those in the auto industry! This is the problem we are facing no one is thinking out of the box and is only thinking the automotive world.
That's why I said it was a different view. As I said, he knows his facts on fuel. Perhaps not marine application. I myself know nothing about it and I'm trying to learn here so that's why I asked him. So even at a 10% mix it's causing problems ?
Short answer? Yeah - it's a problem. Like all problems it's worse for some than others. The point, I think is that without it we're back to regular maintenance issues - which is enough for most of us.
I spoke to a friend last night who has an old Bertram.
He's rebuiling his engine and replacing his fiberglass fuel tank right now because Ethanol fuel has dissolved the resins in the fiberglass tank and sent them into the engine where they turned into a sticky black mass that siezed the valve train. It went right through all the filters. He was lucky to only have top end damage to pushrods and heads.
In a related article I saw a recommendation to keep your tank as empty as possible and only buy enough fuel so that you turn it over completely every 2 weeks.
Certainly not the usual procedure in boating........
Oy vey what a mess indeed! God help you if you have metal tanks that hae been sloshed or prosealed. Ethanol cuts it like lacquer thinner, sending to your engine. The aviation community is deeply wrapped up in this issue too with much to lose. How'd you like to replace tanks in an airplane at 25-30$K a pop? I know the Experimental Aircraft Association is battling, state by state, to keep premium grade pure gas with no booze added. They are having some success but the Iowanian farm lobby is strong opponent, looking at latest corporate welfare giveaway. Leave it to the US to come up with an energy solution that lowers the energy output of fuel, drives up consumption, costs consumers grief and enriches a few. Couldn't do something as simple as excise tax based on fuel economy of new cars, noooo....taxes BAD! Subsidies Good!
Oh yeah, almost forgot...buy Archer Daniels Midland stock, America's "family farmer in distress" and you'll maybe make enough $ to buy new engines after ethanol craps out your old ones.
Yep turns out those dumb ol farmers ain't as dumb as some thought they were... (If you are a farmer, I am not calling you dumb...) rather sly actually.
I sort have wished I would have bought a diesel.. At least Biodiesel has a future.
Destinview,
The link describes my friends engine/tank failure to a tee. We've warned our friends with older Bertrams that they are at risk.
Another downside to Ethanol would be the 8% fuel milage drop that my friend's commercial fleet is reporting across the board since 10% Ethanol was introduced in N.Y.
__________________ Alice Q.
26m FV Madeline Jean, Queen Charlotte Isl, CANADA
03Nov suffered a stroke aboard ship - now paralysed - contact 59022 (her brother) for more details.
24Nov - my sister died today. Burial at sea has taken place
So with addition of ethanol (up to 20%in some cases ), etanol basically leans out the engine, as more oxygen is carried into the combustion process. Remember air pumps on cars that pumped air into the engines to oxygenate the mixture.
So lets say that the mixture is leaned out by this process would owners of carbed outboards have the ability to change the jet sizes to enrich the mixture so we do not lose performance?
__________________ 1967 Boston Whaler 13'
"The Cox'N"
Hull # 20940
Yes, it basically leans the engine, but the air pump pumped air into the exhaust manifold to complete the combustion process. In racing, nitrous is an oxygenator, thus additional fuel is sprayed in to compensate. Since alcohol has fewer BTU's per gallon, available energy is less, thus less power/fuel mileage. The alcohols generally have higher effective octane ratings, but that doesn't help a street engine.
Ethanol, a Different View 
