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Old 03-10-2003, 03:26 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

Many people at my local marina tell me I should remove my oil injection from my johnson outboard and mix the oil in the gas tank. Their argument is that if the injection system ever fails I will ruin the engine. There is a low oil light in the tach, but does that come on before there is any damage, I'm not sure. Has anyone had any problems with these omc systems failing? Thanks
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Old 03-10-2003, 03:54 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

Remove it!!!!!

Especially the older OMCs. I don't know what year your motor is, but I have seen more than my fair share of them fail.

What happens is the oil pump is vacuum driven and if the diaphram ruptures, you are smoked.

If it ain't broke don't fix it.
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Old 03-10-2003, 03:54 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

Seapro-It's a hard call to make. I had a 96 150 Evinrude for 6 years with the VRO oil injection you have with no problems. Others will say to mix the oil and the gas. If you have a 30+ fuel capacity it is a pain to mix the oil with the gas at the exact 50:1 ratio. The VRO pump puts the oil in the gas as needed. I just always made sure the oil level was going down in the tank. A lot of people would blame an engine failure on the VRO and would say they only had 1 burnt piston. If the Vro fails on a Johnson-Evinrude, all the pistons would be bad. The oil light will come on when no more oil is being mixed in the gas at the VRO pump and if shutoff immediately, no damage should occur. TRAILER BOATS magazines did a nice article on Evinrude-Johnson VRO oil injection as you have a couple of years ago. It has been used since the early 80's to a current 03 motor. Snowmobiles are also oil injected with a lot more severe environment with no problems.
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Old 03-10-2003, 05:04 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I'm afraid of oil injection, when my motor's warranty ran out, the oil injection came off. Not worth the piece of mind to me - I also gurantee you'll get a bunch of responses from people that have never had a problem with it and find the oil injection to be a blessing. I believe them but I still fret about the oil injection going out when I need it the most (like getting caught in a bad thunderstorm, etc.). Just one less thing for me to worry about. Just my opinion.

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Old 03-10-2003, 07:57 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

Buy a Suzuki! That's what I got on my 21'Seapro W/A. There is about a one gallon tank in the engine which is gravity fed. No pumps to break! Or better yet,buy a four stroke!
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Old 03-10-2003, 10:30 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I agree with Boatman Buzz. Keep your VRO.

The TBM article in Feb 2000 has lots of good tips to keep your VRO running. Here is a short summary:

Sediment and/or water can build up on the bottom of the oil tank. Draw a sample from the bottom with a turkey baster and squirt it into a jar. If it lookt like you have water and/or dirt, remove and drain the tank. Clean throughly, replace filter and purge/replace the oil line. This sounds like a good thing to do annually.

Replace clear oil cap with black (#176217)

Inspect all oil lines carefully ! If oil lines are more than a few years old (or are smooth vinyl) replace with 1/4" ID rubber (#333485). Avoid tie wraps and worm gear clamps in favor of OEM rachet clamps (#333654).

Inspect all vaccuum lines carefully !! If more than a few years old, replace them.

Inspect all fuel lines carefully !! Clogged filters, anti-siphon valves, kinked lines will cause problems.

Install blue pulse limiter (#435009) to protect VRO from backfires.

Don't run carbs dry as you will suck in too much oil !

There are lots more tips that are model year specific, so go to your local library.
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Old 03-11-2003, 04:52 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I'm running the original motor & vro on my '89 and they both work flawlessly. I personaly don't know anyone who's had a failure. When I asked the Proline dealer when I bought the boat about it he said the fuel pump draws in the oil from the VRO so you couldn't be running without oil(barring an empty tank). Is this true? Maybe the failed motors are guys who troll exclusively which is using little or no oil?
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Old 03-11-2003, 05:55 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

Here's some figures from the manual on my 87 200 hp Johnson. The VRO mixes 150:1 @ idle, 80:1 @ cruise speed and 50:1 @ wide open throttle. I have disconnected my VRO and my motor runs flawlessly with a straight 50:1 mixture. I can slow troll all day long and it will plane right off afterwards. How much easier can it be than to put a gallon of oil in and 50 gallons of gas. Outboards need to be decarbonized no matter what mixture or oil you run in them.
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Old 03-11-2003, 08:22 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I just upgraded my motor to the new oil\\fuel pump. It's now called oms I think. The old vro was functioning just fine. All the lines however were cracked and hard. I replaced all fuel lines, oms [vro] pump and all its lines. Test run it performed flawlessly. There have been many claims that oil injection was to blame for cylinder loss. There are a lot of folks out there that just cannot accept the fact that something they did [or didn't do] is responsible for their loss, and must blame the motor. As previous poster said, if the vro fails you loose all cylinders. The vro pump has a feature that shuts off oil pump if no fuel present, so you cannot over oil. All the new two cycle motors have a vro pump of some kind. If you have an old one, update it. You should have reliable operation for quite some time.

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Old 03-11-2003, 08:29 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

and monitor the usage. You should be able to see if the oil consumption matches up with your fuel consumption pretty easily. Your low oil warning will go off before any engine damage occurs. I always carry a gallon jug of oil on my boat (53 gal tank) as backup in case the oil injection fails.
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Old 03-11-2003, 08:47 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

VRO= variable ratio oiler. 50:1 is a compromise, giving you enough oil so you don't destroy your engine at WOT. That does not mean 50:1 is the ideal ratio for idle speeds. Yes it is more complex than just mixing it yourself, and yes things can fail, but your outboard is a lot more complex than a set of oars - would you dump your engine and go back to rowing on the chance your engine might break down?
We run snowmobiles in the winter, and all of them have VRO's. I wouldn't even think of mixing my own oil. There's a chance it could break down and toast the engine (which could really ruin your day when flying down a trail at 90mph). My plugs were fouling up and I had to change them on the trail. While doing this in -5 degree weather, I must have accidentally banged the little rubber boot that connects the air box to the carb. This caused one carb to run very very lean. Luckily I stopped and pulled the plugs after riding a couple of minutes, to see if everything lookied ok. The thing was ash white, and the cylinder head was far hotter than it should have been. I found the problem and slipped the boot back on. Had I not stopped, I definitely would have toasted that cylinder within minutes. My point is, things can fail, but I'm not going to dismantle something the manufacturer put there for good reason on the chance it may fail.
And if you think snowmobiling isn't hard on an engine, keep in mind that the thing sits outside all winter, it doesn't get winterized between uses, and then every weekend it gets fired up in weather a lot colder than when you are boating. The cluth doesnt' evn engage until 4000 rpm, and while accelerating, that cold engine is turning up to 7000 rpm.
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Old 03-11-2003, 11:22 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

It can be disconnected for about $100 and then premix and add ringfree to every tank. It only takes a little time to measure and its alot less expensive than a rebuild. The alarm will only work if the wiring is all up to snuff. I would remove it on any motor out of warranty- It's just not worth the risk. Decarb the motor every 75hrs. but run it slow after for a couple of hours. With no carbon built up its easy to scuff a piston.
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Old 03-11-2003, 12:31 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I had a 95 Evinrude 60 hp with the oil injection....a lot of folks told me to disconnect the oil injection but I would not listen (as usual). It quit on me alright....had my son on the tube behind me...blew the back of the engine. The mechanic told me that it was the first he'd seen that went out while running, usually they went out right after startup.

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Old 03-11-2003, 04:13 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I trust the VRO to feed my engine a better proportion of oil than it will get if I have to do the adding. I fill my gas tank every second trip. I fill it to the top. Oil could be added, but I would have to first calculate how much to add, then make sure to add the correct amount. I also have a concern about how well the oil and gas get mixed up if you add the oil at the end in a permanent gas tank. Adding the oil first means that I have to guess how much gas she will hold plus have a lookout by the pump telling me when I've reached my goal. I'm unlikely to end up with a full tank that way.

If someone has an easier and more accurate way to do the premix thing, let me know.
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Old 03-11-2003, 04:46 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

I am also thinking of pulling the oil injection as soon as my warranty is up on my 200 carbed merc.I am saying this because i go to Greece every summer for a few months,and know many people with boats and they all premix.Outboards in Greece are priced almost 30% higher than the US and come with 6 month warranty.I have freinds that have outboards from the early 80's with 0 powerhead failures.They use oil that i wouldn't put in my weedwacker and run WOT for hours.Most problems they have are electrical never mechanical.Last summer in Greece i went to a Suzuki dealer to price a 140 4 stroke.I was speaking to the mechanic and he told me that in the US powerhead failures were so common because our gas is no good.Regular unleaded in Greece is 96 octane and super unleaded is 99+.I run my engine at WOT for a minute or so and back off because i am afraid it is going to blow.I was on my friends boat last year fishing the Greek islands we did 90 miles in 3 1/2 hours WOT the whole way.
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Old 03-11-2003, 05:48 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

can you back up some of those statements?
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Old 03-11-2003, 06:50 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

Least we forget how it once was, our marina sold Exxon gas that was Regular 94, Plus 96, and extra 98+ octane. We didn't pump regular, only Exxon Plus and Exxon Extra in the '60s and early '70s.
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Old 03-11-2003, 08:15 PM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

cat man i am telling what i have seen.No brand oil,all premix, they do not know what decarbonizing is and use high octane fuel.And i was on a boat with a 140 yamaha WOT for 3+ hours.Powerhead failures are so uncommon that i never heard of one or now someone that had one (in Greece).The only way to really find out what helps is if a fuels specialist will chime in and let us know if a higher octane rating will actually be better for an outboard.The only thing i have noticed is that they go through a lot of sets of spark plugs.

[This message was edited by petros on 03-12-03 at 12:12 AM.]
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Old 03-12-2003, 05:21 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

The method of octane measurement is different in Europe than in the U.S..

Read the second and third paragraph of this.
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Old 03-12-2003, 05:37 AM
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Default Oil injection or premix for an outboard?

One thing can be said about premix, if you put the oil in the tank with the gas, then YOU KNOW YOUR ENGINE IS GETTING OIL.

If you rely on the vro, you arent positive are you?

The only engine manufacturer I would really recommend it to be removed from are the older OMCS.

Take what I say with a grain of salt, but have any of you ever rebuilt an engine. How about a 2 stroke engine. How about one that has failed because of VRO failure. I HAVE!!!!

So many hoaz, so little time.
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