*THE HULL TRUTH is the world's largest FREE network for the discussion of Boating & Fishing. Whether you're researching a new boat, or are a seasoned Captain, you'll find The Hull Truth Boating & Fishing Message Forum contains a wealth of information from Boaters and Sportfishermen around the world.
Welcome to the updated THT!
If you are having trouble signing in, please email feedback@thehulltruth.com with your username and we will help you. We thank you for your patience as we help you access the new site!
Random Quote: Dignity's got nuthin' ta do with it. You're hangin' out with us now! Syd the sloth (Iceage)
I’m in the process of purchasing my first boat. It will be kept in Westport, Connecticut and I’ll be using the boat primarily for light tackle fishing in Long Island Sound. For the type of fishing I do, I want to be comfortable when there’s chop, but also stable when drifting and casting. I’ve read just about every thread on THT about hull design, dead rise, draft and a lot of other stuff that I’ve never paid an enormous amount of attention to before the prospect of putting my own money into a boat purchase. I’ve narrowed my choice down to either an 18’ Parker or 18’ Jones Brothers (slip restriction limits me to an 18’ boat, which is a fine size for me). These boats are very similar, with the largest difference that I can see being the dead rise angle at transom. The Parker is 14 degrees, whereas the Jones Brothers is 18 degrees. Looking at the boats in person, the Jones Brothers has a significantly deeper V at transom. The draft is deeper on the Jones Brothers as well. My question goes out to those familiar with the conditions in Long Island Sound, or to anyone with experience with these boats. I know its like trading apples for oranges, but is one of these boats a better choice for me? I’m assuming the Jones Brothers would be better in chop? Would it be as stable as the Parker when at stand still? I plan to sea trial the Parker soon, but I’m having a harder time finding a Jones Brothers in the water that I can test as well. There may not be a big difference here, but this is a big purchase for me and I want to make the correct choice!
Have you tried Rivers End Tackle in Old Saybrook? I think they still sell Jones Brothers boats. For Parker Try Boats Inc. in Niantic. You should definitely ride in both before deciding. You should be able to get a ride in a Parker at Boats Inc.
As the former owner of an 18'6" Lema Skiff, 10 degree deadrise but 10" draft, I can tell you that both of the above boats will limit your access to fishing in the sound on a regular basis. Making the crossing to Norhtport for early season bass and blues in the warm water outflow or hitting Eaton's neck for stripers around the structure or working the mouth of Oyster Bay or the Salt Pond there will be a risky proposition in an 18' boat probably 30+% of the time. For the fall run it will be closer to 50% of the days where you cannot safely cross the sound. Now on the other hand you could spend a lifetime fishing from the Saugatuck to Compo to the Mill Pond to Burying Hill to Cockenoe to Goose Island, Peck's Ledge and the spots along the Norwalks and be quite happy.......
So it really up to you - that's what I did with the first boat which I kept for three years and this season I stepped up to 24' Hydra-Sport Vector which while still a small boat is designed for bigger water - I cross the sound on any day in safety (but maybe not so comfortable). I gave up bumping the sand at the Mill Pond chasing Spring Stripers but I can also cover lots more ground and take along a few friends/family. First boat was $13K with the motor second boat was $56K!
Between the Parker and Jones, you spending a lot of money on a premium product that you will probably grow out of in a couple of years. I would consider a second or third tier boat at half the price that you can beat the snot out of and make some mistakes in (rocks, docks etc.) and not freak out about the damage to your shiny toy.
If you plan to do any bottom fishing at all (chunking in the summer) a little more boat will open up a lot more territory.
Also even with the smaller boat build into the budget some decent electronics.....GPS, Fishfinder, VHF......stereo.
Westport is a great location except for the long schlep out to the Sound....if your draft is shallow enough you can cut across that flat (I did).
I agree with Big Dog 100%. I fish a 17' mako. I usually only fish evenings chunking and casting along the rocks since I get bounced arond pretty good by the weekend and day boat traffic. Only on occassion do I venture over to Manhasset, Hempsted or Execution. Although I am usually good for a couple runs to Louie's for dinner. I am considering a 23' CC this winter and with 3 small children will be looking forward to exploring more of the sound as I do not bring them out on my current boat. If I had my choice I would keep my mako inn addition to the new boat b/c it is a great for getting in to the rocks along the NY/CT shoreline and the bow is a great platform to flyfish from, but am also looking forward to stepping up. But overall BigDog is right...plan on making the run across the sound only about 30% of the time...and plan on getting wet if there is any sort of chop mixed with wind (50% of the time)
if i were looking for an 18 foot boat for the LI sound its attributes prioritized would be: 1. unsinkable 2. stable 3. soft riding. no 18 footer is going to give u a great ride out there. i guess boston whaler and mckee craft would be my first choices. good luck!
Eb I regret selling the Lema every day! The HS is good for blasting around the Sound (or Montauk) but I am much more careful around the rocks.....with the Lema kissing a couple of rocks on the drift meant I was in close enough! Taking the kids to Shea Island to the beach was also easier in the Lema, run it up on the sand drop everybody off, spin it around and anchor. The HS displaces 6,000lbs vs. 900Lbs and it takes some thought about wind/current/tide/other boats etc. For solo fly fishing (1/3 of my time) the Lema was awesome - can't afford the dock space for two boats so getting a smaller boat will have to wait. Then again chasing busting fish in small craft warnings in the Lema was very funky, been through a gale in the HS and made it home without even taking a wave over the front!
I'll stand in line behind Bigdog..well said.. My opinion would be Parker...I'm in Greenwich and have a 22 tiara with a duoprop outdrive..I would love to get into skinny water..No can do currently, but I can eat up the chop across the sound to NY. As was said there are plenty of places for you to "sneak' into for the elusive striper. The shallow draft Parker would put you where I wish I could go. Maybe I'll get another boat.
I’m in the process of purchasing my first boat. It will be kept in Westport, Connecticut and I’ll be using the boat primarily for light tackle fishing in Long Island Sound. For the type of fishing I do, I want to be comfortable when there’s chop, but also stable when drifting and casting. I’ve read just about every thread on THT about hull design, dead rise, draft and a lot of other stuff that I’ve never paid an enormous amount of attention to before the prospect of putting my own money into a boat purchase. I’ve narrowed my choice down to either an 18’ Parker or 18’ Jones Brothers (slip restriction limits me to an 18’ boat, which is a fine size for me). These boats are very similar, with the largest difference that I can see being the dead rise angle at transom. The Parker is 14 degrees, whereas the Jones Brothers is 18 degrees. Looking at the boats in person, the Jones Brothers has a significantly deeper V at transom. The draft is deeper on the Jones Brothers as well. My question goes out to those familiar with the conditions in Long Island Sound, or to anyone with experience with these boats. I know its like trading apples for oranges, but is one of these boats a better choice for me? I’m assuming the Jones Brothers would be better in chop? Would it be as stable as the Parker when at stand still? I plan to sea trial the Parker soon, but I’m having a harder time finding a Jones Brothers in the water that I can test as well. There may not be a big difference here, but this is a big purchase for me and I want to make the correct choice!
With all due respect to the other replies here, you should be OK in Long Island Sound in either one as long as there are no small craft advisories or seas greater than 2-3 feet posted. The greater the deadrise, the smoother the ride in a chop but as you noticed, the boat will have deeper draft and probably not plane as easily. The shallower (less deadrise) will probably be more stable in the stern when sitting still.
I can't recall the last time that conditions in the sound kept me and the Mako 17 at the dock (for example, last Wednesday) unless there were forecasts of greater than 2 foot seas or SCA's posted. If it's your first boat get the one with the highest resale/tradein value, just in case you decide to move up or get out. Good luck!
Master of Steam, Motor or Auxiliary Sail Vessels, ... also Commercial Assistance Towing.
tyhick i was in the same boat your in 3 years ago.i have a slip in ffld marin had a 22 foot max .look real hard . I bourght a new 22 foot cat ,You should look into a18 foot cat,you will not be sorry
First of all I want to thank everyone for your detailed and helpful advise, I value your experience in helping me make the right decision. If I had a place to put a larger boat I wouldn't be in this predicament, but as it stands I have to try to find the best compromise between boat size and where I want to run it. I guess my best bet it to trial the boats and then use them where I can until I'm able to move up in size. For argument sake, would moving up to a 21' boat make a considerable difference in seaworthiness?
FWIW, I fished a Parker 18 on LIS for six years. I also chartered out of it. It's an outstanding fishing platform, and while the 21 parker and Jones are both great choices too, and the 21 parker SE has a good amount more room than the 18, I'd still say that you would find yourself pretty happy in the 18 Parker.
I haven't fished the 18 Jones, but my buddy is very happy with his 20'.
Here's what I'll tell you about the Parker 18 on Long Island sound: It's wet, and it does pound a bit. Both can be helped a bunch by adding trim tabs to the boat. In fact, don't think about running the boat without them. Bringing the bow down at a lower speed really helped the pounding on mine. A poster above said that you have a 30% chance at getting out with an 18 footer. I'd have to say, based on my experience, that's way off. While a 21 would have been nicer or more comfortable sometimes, I don't think that any days kept me home in my 18 that I would have gone out in a 21. And, I got out MUCH more than 30 percent of the time.
(Might be different from the Conn. side, with that South wind every night).
The biggest plus is that it is a rock solid fishing platform. SUPER stable in a rip, and a great light tackle/fly boat. It floats like a cork, and I never felt unsafe in a rip with it.
It also holds its resale value very well.
FWIW, I brought mine back to the Dealer that sold it to me, and he sold it for 3K less than I paid for it in 99. (I had just put a brand new trailer under it, and it was SUPER CLEAN). It also sold in two days. Obviously, that wasn't my cut, but I still was amazed at how little I lost.
Good luck. You can't go wrong with either the Jones or the Parker.
good fishing in Westport also. we limited out on black fish there Sunday. lots of nice inshore spots to fish near westport for an 18'. good luck with that Parker!
CaptSuperFly, I said a 30% chance of a scrub on crossing the Sound from Westport to the North Shore....does not mean he could not get out and fish the extremely productive Norwalk Islands in almost any conditions short of a hurricane....believe I wore rain gear and went out in anything in the Lema....but hid in the lee of the wind. Now I don't think about it in a 24' boat that is built for bigger water.
Also remember this is the guys first boat.....Capt's and long timers are at a whole different level in reading the water, trimming the boat, reading the weather etc......I don't think he should join the Darwin Award club without good hard thinking.
Now back to the 18-21 question...budget considerations aside I think you would get a big jump in performance. I have fished many times on a 21 Parker CC out of Newport in the real ocean chasing Bass, Blues, Pleagics on the fly running 50-70 miles/day. Very good Capt and I always felt safe what a great boat. The Jones Bros and Maritime Skiff or the North Rip 20' would all be equally capable. Would also have a little more room for firends/family so you would probably not outgrow it as quickly.
Don't forget Steigercraft (the Long Beach or Superfly).
Tyhicks, how come you are only looking to dock in Westport? While I live in Stamford I have a slip Rowayton 5 Mile River....works great for me. Norwalk has slips probably cheaper but maybe the security is reduced.
The 5 mile river is pretty full but there are always a slip or two that free up.
With the escalating prices of new boats I was also very pleasantly surprised on the trade in I got.
bigdog1001, I grew up in Connecticut on the Sound and it took me until now, somewhat foolishly, to realize that I can get a town slip for $500 a season. I've applied for all slip sizes, and will have an 18' this coming season. The next size up allows a 21' boat, although that's another four years wait minimum. There's less movement these days I've been told because of the economy and people are thinking twice about buying larger boats. So the 21 and 23 foot slips holders are staying put more than in the past. If I thought a 21' slip would be coming my way soon, I would purchase that size boat and keep it in rack storage in Norwalk or someplace like that until the larger slip became available. This would save the trouble of buying, then selling, then buying again. Rack storage would run close to $2000 for a 21' boat, so the town slip starts to look very sweet. And although everyone (myself included) dreams of having a killer nice, big fishing boat, I agree that being my first boat I need to get my feet wet (sounds like my entire body wet) with something like the 18' Parker.
The Westport town marina is sweet. I wondered if that was the driver on the length. More power to you. You have the best access to the LIS, plus a gas dock and a lot better security situation than in Norwalk.....I don't think you can beat that. You don't even have to make the schlep from the railroad bridge etc. Go for it on the 18' but just be a little careful at first. My wife almost swamped us the second week jumping wakes off a large sportsfisherman heading into the Norwalk Harbor from Green's Ledge....a real Darwin award move....
I might also recommend that you charter a guide for a couple of trips either right now or in May of next year. Most of them will be happy to tailor a trip to teaching you some spots close to your dock....let me know if you need some recommendations. I did that and really helped me learn some good structure and then I could find my own spots by looking for similar patches...shortened the learning curve a lot.
Tyhicks,
For fear of being labelled a spammer, I should point out that I am the McKee Craft dealer in Norwalk, Ct. I will not make any sales pitch. The other forums here cover the McKee Crafts very well. I would like to invite you out for a ride at any time. Yes, we even sea trialed a boat last week. We have a 19' McKee in stock. We have a 17' and 22' that are sold, but are available for sea trials. We will have new inventory including a 18' within a few weeks.
There is no catch. The is no deposit required to launch the boat. Just come and ride the McKee. You'll love it.
Tyhicks,
I cut my teeth around the islands in a 18' Lund. We got out lots of times but had to pick our days. We crossed the pond a few times too. But sometimes my wife was swearing at me the whole way back!!! Anyway, we started looking for a 21' to trailer, but came across a used 23' CC that makes the whole family feel a lot safer and more comfortable. Toggin' this last Sunday with the SCA was no problem at 11B.
As for your choices, pick the one with better resale(toss up?) because that day will come! IMO I think they are both good choices. By the way, I kept the Lund too.
Thank you again THT members, you've hooked me up with a wealth of knowlege which really helps get me going in the right direction. I really look forward to getting out in the water this coming spring. Many, many thanks - Tyler
Tyhicks,
I cut my teeth around the islands in a 18' Lund. We got out lots of times but had to pick our days. We crossed the pond a few times too. But sometimes my wife was swearing at me the whole way back!!! Anyway, we started looking for a 21' to trailer, but came across a used 23' CC that makes the whole family feel a lot safer and more comfortable. Toggin' this last Sunday with the SCA was no problem at 11B.
As for your choices, pick the one with better resale(toss up?) because that day will come! IMO I think they are both good choices. By the way, I kept the Lund too.
EtR - well said. Tyhicks...If I can offer some old sailor's advice, just take it easy. Ya don't have to go out there if you aren't comfortable in it. Trust me, two trips from Westbrook through the Cape Cod Canal in a 24' sailboat with a 6HP Evinrude (pre Loran) and a couple of trips over to Greenport and Mattituck from Madison (in the Lemming) in "less than good" sea states reinforced that (1) you CAN do it if you take your time and don't get macho, and (2) maybe you don't want to
Either of these boats will survive the trip Will your family relationship? BTW I have the same wife through all these voyages. She is quite vocal about my boat handling under certain circumstances. I have come to be an excellent listener Good luck!
Master of Steam, Motor or Auxiliary Sail Vessels, ... also Commercial Assistance Towing.
boat choice for Long Island Sound 
Will your family relationship? BTW I have the same wife through all these voyages. She is quite vocal about my boat handling under certain circumstances. I have come to be an excellent listener 
Good luck!
