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Random Quote: My wife doesn't trust me. She thinks I want to screw her.
My buddy traded in his old boat as part of a deal on a new boat. Acceptance and finalization of the deal was contingent upon sea trial and final prep of any faults on the new boat.
The dealer involved, had accepted a deposit on his old boat. There has been much delay/deviation by the dealer that has caused a lot of anguish to my buddy. He has not taken delivery of the new boat as of yet!!!
Worse yet, is the fact that he has 'stumbled' upon the buyer of his old boat. The new "owner" has taken delivery and has been using the old boat for at least a week!!!!
And, my friend still has in his possession the ORIGINAL NY StaTe Title that has never been transferred/ signed over to the dealer to resell. This was part of the condition of accptance.
No, it is not a legal transaction. An idividual, let alone a dealer cannot sell something that does not belong to them. The Sate of New York has some pretty stringent consumer protection laws that deal with this. Have your friend contact his local Attorney Generals office to investigate. If he does so, he will have to be ready to provide the proof. If he could get a copy of the bill of sale and a statement from the "new owner", it would be some pretty damning evidence. The most important thing he should do is pursue it......legally. Bad dealers need to be rooted out.
Your friend has another, potentially worse problem.* You can't legally insure something you don't actually own.* So even if the "new owner" thinks he has insurance, he doesn't.* So guess who would end up with the loss if anything happens -- the actual owner, your friend.*
I believe that fraudulent conveyance of a boat without the real owners knowledge constitutes theft. I believe a police report would be appropriate at this point along with certified notification to the insurance company of said theft. This would relieve the true owner of liability in this situation.
Your buddy has fallen to nothing more than his own ingorance. He probably signed over his old boat as trade-in on the new boat. If he signed the papers the dealer probably just got the title reissued and sold the boat he took in trade. This is a problem I have warned folks about in the past. When you sign over your old boat in trade you are just hoping the dealer can deliver your new boat. Most contracts I have looked at protect the dealer not the buyer. Worse yet the dealer can probably back out of the contract and you buddy may have to only look forward to his day in court. Read and understand before you sign.
This is the second or third thread in the last couple weeks that deals with an improper purchase of a boat.
We had the one where the guy is suppose to have bought a stolen boat and the Feds are taking it back.
The one in Alaska where the dealer sold a boat out from under the first purchaser who had already registered the boat in his name, even though he hadn't paid a dime for it yet.
Now we got this one where a dealer resells a trade in before he has possesion of the legal title and before the new boat buyer recieves his new boat.
I guess my comment has to do with how in the heck do some of these guys take care of business? Do they just throw money out the window and hope for the best? Is there an actual method to this madness?
Let's see how this transaction could have handled better.
Dealer would get the trade in at the same time the purchaser gets possecion of the new boat. Of course this is AFTER all sea trials and acceptance inspections are completed. Not to mention the little details like signing over titles, notarizing bills of sales, and paying for the new boat.
Yeah, Yeah! I know the dealer/salesman is going to hit you with the "let's get it done speach". You guys know the one, where somebody else is at the very exact point you are in buying the exact same boat you are looking at, so the dealer incourages you to take possesion, now, today, and worry about the "detailed" paper work later.
Why don't nobody listen to my Momma anymore?
Momma says, "Take care of your business or somebody is going to give you the business."
__________________ Cape Horn 17, Yamaha F115
with
Elmo the Boat Dog
Your friend probably signed a power of attorney which gives the dealer the right to order a new title and consumate the deal without the hard copy of the title.
When you trade a car in, many folks don't have or know where the title is, so they sign the POA and the dealership takes it from there.
As long as the dealer eventually comes up with a boat for you, there is no "loss" and no grounds for a lawsuit. If you back out of the deal, the dealer writes you a check for the amount that you agreed for the trade (and keeps the difference).
In NY, it is not that easy to get a replacement title. The person who was originally issued the title must make the application for a new one. I spent well over 15 years dealing with NY Dept of Motor Vehicles; with the offices I dealt with, one number off on the VIN (on the green MV-82T) and they would send you packin'. No, that is not to say there aren't ways around it, guess I just never thought that way.
Big E - 5/9/2005 5:08 AM
And, my friend still has in his possession the ORIGINAL NY StaTe Title that has never been transferred/ signed over to the dealer to resell. This was part of the condition of accptance.
IS THIS LEGAL?
Big E: What seems to be the problem? Your friend obviously wanted to get rid of his old boat and was given a price for his old boat as part of the trade in. He should be happy that the boat is sold. Was he going to try and hold his old boat as a bargaining chip of some sort? I would bet he could have gotten more for his boat if he sold it on his own but he didn't go that route. If he's not happy with the dealership then he should ask for the money for his old boat. With money in his hand he can do what he chooses. A lot better position then old boat in hand trying to find a buyer.
He's got nothing to loose by asking the dealer wazup with his old boat just to make sure he's no longer obligated in any way.
__________________ Steve 2006 23'CC Dusky - 250 e-Tec
The boat was agreed to be traded in as part of the contract, and was delivered to the dealer. At that point it no longer belonged to your buddy, it belonged to the dealer. The fact that he in turn sold it before receiving title means nothing, as he has the original deal as a contract.
DEALER SOLD/DELIVERED THE BOAT! 
