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Old 11-30-2011, 10:48 AM
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Default Tiara 3100: Bad handling, Prop pockets?

I'm interested in Tiara 3100's (convertible) post 1992 as they have a deeper v (18 degrees at transom) than the earlier models (16 degrees I believe). But the post 1992 models also have propellor pockets to improve the prop shaft angle.

I'm worried that because of the pockets, it will be difficult to handle docking and at slow speeds. Does anyone have experience with these models? Hard to believe Tiara would produce a bad handling boat? Would increasing the rudder size help without too much increase in friction while underway?
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Old 11-30-2011, 11:39 AM
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I've deon a lot of research on the Tiara 31 and never came up with any info on the boat handling poorly.

That said, they did not make the convertible on the new hull. I Don't know what year they stopped but before '92. Even prior to '92 the convert's are few a far between compared to the open.
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Old 11-30-2011, 11:50 AM
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A few things:

1 - There are no post-1992 convertible 3100's. Tiara stopped making the 3100 convertible when they discontinued the old hull. If you want a convertible you'll need a 3600.

2 - I never touch the wheel or use rudders to dock. With twin inboards you dock with the throttles and trannys.

3 - Tiara's rudders are small. It does not matter for general slow speed maneuvering. When I'm coming into the canal and harbor just set your rudder angle gauge so the rudders are at zero and steer with the throttles. However, if you are doing slow speed trolling as we do on the great lakes on one engine, you might want to upgrade the rudders. Many captains here just bolt on over-lays on the existing rudders. Others pop for bigger real rudders. Its not a Tiara only-thing, nearly every charter here has up-sized rudders, Trojan, Bertram, Hattaras, Viking, etc. Any good marina will know what size to up-size. Of the approximately 20 Tiara charter boats in my harbor, me and one other guy have the standard rudders. The pockets have nothing to do with it, the older non-pocket Tiara's have tiny rudders too.

Unless you are slow trolling on one engine, don't bother, just learn to drive with the sticks.
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Old 11-30-2011, 12:13 PM
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I had pockets on my 30 Sea Ray, and could put the boat on a postage stamp in a 30kt wind and 10kt cross-current, unless of course the dock was full of onlookers...

Backing down sometimes required a bump of the throttle, but other than that, maneuverability was excellent...
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Old 11-30-2011, 04:18 PM
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I have a 29 Open with pockets. It handles great. As steelhead mentioned the rudders are small. Fine in forward but useless in reverse.

Occasionally a bump on the throttles helps. It does stear great with the engines.

One time I had to come in on 1 engine. I couldn't turn to starboard to get into the lagoon to my slip so I had to go past and loop around to port. I even backed into my slip. I just took a little planning and anticipating the moves.

Overall, it's a non-issue.
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Old 11-30-2011, 04:44 PM
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My 3700 has pockets while my 3300 doesn't. I don't notice any difference in slow speed handling. Dock with the throttles and gears only, generally, except when approaching a face dock single handed, I'll drop a spring line on a cleat, leave an engine in gear with the helm hard over to hold the boat against the dock while I get the other lines set.
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Old 11-30-2011, 08:00 PM
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Many thanks for this advice. Didn't realize the 92's and newer were all open. I need a convertible and the 36 is too big. Anyone have any opinion on the pre-92 3100Tiara convertible. With 16 deadrise, how is she in rough water?
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Old 12-01-2011, 07:48 AM
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I have an '88 31' Open which is the same hull just less weight up top. We run it mostly on the Chesapeake and it can be wet running at angles into a closely spaced, steep chop, but that's what the full windshield and wipers are for. It tracks wonderfully up or down sea and has never made us feel unsafe. We commonly will go out on days when we would have thought twice or stayed a the dock with our old 26' Wellcraft. The worst conditions we've had it in was around Smith Point, wind against tide and running with the seas in 5-7+'...18kts up them and 24kts down the face.

Very stable at anchor or on the troll. Trolls great on one motor at about 2.5kts with a slack tide burning maybe 2 gph. Cruises at 3050rpm at 22kts burning 22-24gph per the Flowscans.

I've never had any problems with handling, in fact by comparison to similar boats I believe it handles well.

Would prefer if had the larger tank - 246 vs 206 gallons I believe, but most of the ones with larger tanks were recalled. Let me know if any questions can answer.
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Old 12-01-2011, 07:53 AM
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There are four 3100 convertibles in my harbor that I know of. I know the owners and all are very happy. I'm in Waukegan, Illinois and if you don't know, Lake Michigan is very choppy. Here everyone looks at beam and lengthy is secondary. those guys are very happy with them. Tiara changed hulls in mid-1992, making things very confusing. There were a few 1992 converts made and some Opens on the old hull. Tiara then brought out the new hull in mid-1992 but continued to make the old hull, calling it a Pursuit 3100. All 3100's with Pursuit names are the old Tiara hulls. The boat docked East of me is a 1996 Pursuit 3100 and I fish his boat alot. I have also fished old hull 3100's in both Open and Convertible and I have never seen any problem with ride, stability or comfort.

If length is an issue, make sure you know the real length of the boat. The old 3100 is 33.5' feet overall. The new hull is bigger and dryer. My 1999 3100 Open is 35.5' overall, which was proven to me by my new storage place. The marina I used to store with charged me for 33'. The new marina was a Tiara dealer and measured it out to prove to me mine is 35.5' , so I know its true.

Other boats that are popular in my area and I have seen and heard good things about you might want to look at as well would be

- Trojan 10 Meter Sedan, 33' and 13' beam. Its more stable than the old Tiara hull
- Blackfin 29 & 32 Converts
- Bertram 31 Flybridge
- Luhrs 32 & 35 Convertibles. - Luhrs gets slammed here all the time, but a few captains are running them out of my harbor and love them. There is a 32 Convertible on my dock and it seems great to me.
- Trojan F-32 is popular and well liked, but the back deck area is too small for serious fishing IMO.
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Old 12-01-2011, 07:54 AM
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i ran a 30' penn yan with prop pockets in lake ontario and it handled incredibly well when docking...turned on a dime and was very maneuverable at slow speeds....it was like ballet at the dock...
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Old 12-02-2011, 05:05 PM
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All the Tiara 31s and 33s with the larger tanks were not recalled, they were fixed by Tiara. They pulled the tanks and coated them and reinstalled them. Most with no visible evidence of the repair. The concern was that the larger tank had a central sump that went below the tops of the central stringers and could be exposed to standing bilge water. The coating on the tanks protects them from possible corrosion. Tiara did this on their own nickel even though all these boats were out of warranty. If looking at a boat with the larger tank, get the HIN and call Tiara to see if the did the remediation on the tank. They have records of every one they did.

Back to the topic, my 3300 has 14 deg deadrise and I, too, use it all over the Chesapeake. Funny, too, that the worst I've had to deal with was 5-6 foot standing waves at Smith Point, mouth of the Potomac. Never felt unsafe, but would not do that again on purpose. The lower deadrise does improve efficiency, so that's the upside. I don't worry much about getting wet, my enclosure stays zipped up and I'm running the helm air conditioning. And the windshield wipers work fine. I've been on the Trojan 10 meter and I have to say the Tiara runs better and is head and shoulders better in fit and finish. I guess that's why I bought it....
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Old 12-03-2011, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RM View Post
Very stable at anchor or on the troll. Trolls great on one motor at about 2.5kts with a slack tide burning maybe 2 gph. Cruises at 3050rpm at 22kts burning 22-24gph per the Flowscans.
That is economical for big blocks. I would have figured they burned more than that.
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Old 05-31-2012, 11:18 AM
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I'm chiming in about 5-6 months to late but it may be of use for future searchers...

We have a 1984 3100 Convertible with the "flat butt" and no pockets. It's a rough riding boat in the smallest of waves but silly stable. A helm up top in such a small boat can give you lots of roll and the pre 1992 are incredibly stable in my opinion. I'd say there were 40-50 opens made for every convertible, so not very popular in my area...I'm one of three I've ever seen on Lake Erie. So I think that is the driving reason they discontinued them post 1992 but combine that with my observation that a more v'd bottom would cause more roll on a tall/short boat...and that could close the deal on Tiara/S2 reason. I've felt that roll on small Carvers and Sea Rays of the same age with a bridged helm.

Now to get to the users original question about pocket "perception"...

I had a Cruisers 29' before this with pockets and although I loved them for many reasons they didn't bite very well in a strong cross wind...and I attribute that to the pockets. There was a delay at slow speeds and I had to give it way more gas then my 3100 when I screwed up. The Avante Vee is a "tall" open cruiser because of the way put the helm up and it could cause a sail effect at times at dock with the wind in the wrong place.

Now a boat like the 3100 Convertible is a lot taller and does catch a lot more wind but I feel just as stable or even more so docking with a cross wind...it seems to bite more then the Cruisers and I attribute that to not having pockets. Yes the rudders are small but the props bite way better.

I've driven my buddies 44" Chris Craft with big props and diesels and although nothing bites like those BIG props my 3100 is way closer to that Chris Craft in a cross wind then my Cruisers ever was.

I'd usually say that my 2 cents worth but since it's a boat it's more expensive, so that is my $1.02 worth...
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