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Old 01-18-2005, 03:43 PM
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Default Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

My 2002 Scout 202 Dorado with Yamaha 150 HPDI with 250 hours on it started having problems this fall. The motor began to hesitate at 3000-4000 rpm's, not got to full throttle. It idled fine, motored out at 1000-2000 rpm's fine, but when I put the throttle down, it really bogged down, then took off, then bogged down etc.

It was recommended that I contact Norwest Marine in Norwalk CT. I spoke with Jeff and Mark on the phone today. They have obviously seen a lot of this in hundreds of motors since ethanol. Don't want to beat a dead horse. Basically, Mark says that if it is sediment in the fuel pump, that that is not covered under warranty, which is good until 2007, and the part is $1,300. I have changed all the filters both in and out of the motor, and it still is running poorly. It is going to cost me $2,000 to fix my motor. I am willing to pay it if it fixes my boat and if the fuel pump is the problem, but how does this sound to you?

Thanks in advance.
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Old 01-18-2005, 03:53 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Quote:
Lacey - 1/18/2005 4:43 PM

I am willing to pay it if it fixes my boat and if the fuel pump is the problem, but how does this sound to you?

Thanks in advance.
Like a lot of money for a fuel pump. Gosh I'm running two 150 HPDI with about the same hours and no problems at this time. Hopefully you will get to the bottom of it and it won't be $2000 buck.

I'll be watching this post so if I do run into this concern I'll be prepared.

JohnE
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Old 01-18-2005, 03:59 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Yam supplies the warranty on the motor. You supply the fuel for the motor. If your fuel is hurting the motor it's your problem. If the motor is not operating despite having good fuel than it's Yam's problem.

I don't understand why it's going to cost you $2,000 to clean out a fuel pump! I've replaced fuel pumps in carbed 150's that cost $55.00 apiece and takes 5 minutes to change them out. I realize there's an obvious difference with the pumps on HPDI, but $1,000.00 apiece?

Also, there's got to be a way to feed your engine something else other than than alcohol crap!
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Old 01-18-2005, 04:11 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

It's hard to believe there's sediment in the fuel pump, I don't care how many hours you have on your Yami. Those filters aren't an after thought, nothing gets by them. They can glog but there's no by-pass.
Sounds more like the dealer doesn't know what's wrong. That's understandable, from years of automotive repair, I know there's nothing harder to diagnose than a problem you don't experience. Personally, I always told the customer that, and ask them if they wanted me to look I would , but I refuse to guess. If my guess turns out wrong, the customer gets the repair for nothing. I'd ask the dealer if he has the same principles. If not don't let him touch it.
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Old 01-18-2005, 04:49 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Lacey,

Did you check or clean the VST med pressure fuel pump screen? What about the canister filter after the VST tank but before the High Pressure fuel pump?

Has anyone ran the engine with a fuel pressure gauge attached under way...under load? Anyone YDS it yet?

I have heard a lot of terrible things from ethanol issues.......we are lucky in our area we don't have them. But to say its a fuel pump(which one?)*and that it was clogged and evidently*has been*trashed from that....all from a phone conversation???

Could very well be....but I would troubleshoot it before I made a suggestion like that to a customer.

Good Luck,

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Old 01-18-2005, 05:08 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Quote:
s0101365 - 1/18/2005 4:11 PM , I don't care how many hours you have on your Yami. Those filters aren't an after thought, nothing gets by them. They can glog but there's no by-pass. .
Not 100% true.....not trying to start an argument but the engine mounted clear replaceable filter on*Yamaha's have a 30 micron rating. If you are using the oil filter looking Yamaha spin on boat mounted*filter, that too has a 30 micron rating. Anything smaller then a house will get by them. It's very important to have a Yamaha or Racor 10 Micron water separator type installed.

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Old 01-18-2005, 05:08 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

time for a second opinion
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Old 01-18-2005, 05:31 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Quote:
SIM - 1/18/2005 5:08 PM



Quote:
s0101365 - 1/18/2005 4:11 PM , I don't care how many hours you have on your Yami. Those filters aren't an after thought, nothing gets by them. They can glog but there's no by-pass. .
Not 100% true.....not trying to start an argument but the engine mounted clear replaceable filter on*Yamaha's have a 30 micron rating. If you are using the oil filter looking Yamaha spin on boat mounted*filter, that too has a 30 micron rating. Anything smaller then a house will get by them. It's very important to have a Yamaha or Racor 10 Micron water separator type installed.

SIM

SIM- why would Yamaha use a 30 micron filter on the engine if that was not good enough to prevent damage to the fuel system? Seems to me that the very design of a 30 micron filter as the last defense kind of sux. Engineering design hasn't changed in the area of filter matching. You always should have the last filter be capable of filtering out the minimum size that can harm the system. I can't believe that is the set-up for the engine mounted filter.
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Old 01-18-2005, 06:29 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Yes.. I would aggree with the filter comments. What's the big deal though......don't you have a boat mounted 10 Micron*filter sitting in front of your engine?

Common rigging practice and common sense........really.

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Old 01-18-2005, 06:41 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Wow, I've been having similar problems with yo 150 HPDI Yam too. I have roughly the same number of hours also. The motor idles, and goes anywhere from idle to 3-4 speed fine, but leave it in the corner for a while and the fuel pump cant keep up or something. It starts to cut out. We noticed that when it was cutting out, the fuel pump bulb was really slack, like it had no suction. When we pumped up the pressure, the motor runs fine. But that only buys you about 10 minutes at full trottle. We have the had the motor in the shop on 3 separate occasions, and they cant seem to fix the problem. We are going to have to find someone else, or call the folks at Yamaha to take a look at it. Who knows?

-Alex
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Old 01-18-2005, 07:18 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Quote:
Amitchum - 1/18/2005 7:41 PM

Wow, I've been having similar problems with yo 150 HPDI Yam too. I have roughly the same number of hours also. The motor idles, and goes anywhere from idle to 3-4 speed fine, but leave it in the corner for a while and the fuel pump cant keep up or something. It starts to cut out. We noticed that when it was cutting out, the fuel pump bulb was really slack, like it had no suction. When we pumped up the pressure, the motor runs fine. But that only buys you about 10 minutes at full trottle. We have the had the motor in the shop on 3 separate occasions, and they cant seem to fix the problem. We are going to have to find someone else, or call the folks at Yamaha to take a look at it. Who knows?

-Alex
If the bulb is collapsed, then you have a blockage between the bulb and the fuel tank. Better check the filter/water separator between the bulb and the tank, and the bac-flow valve at the fuel pick-up at the tank.
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Old 01-18-2005, 07:45 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Quote:
SIM - 1/18/2005 6:29 PM


Yes.. I would aggree with the filter comments. What's the big deal though......don't you have a boat mounted 10 Micron*filter sitting in front of your engine?

Common rigging practice and common sense........really.

SIM
I am trying to find out exactly what my engine has right now. Shop manual doesn't specify micron size of either the engine mounted low pressure filter or the engine mounted high pressure filter after the pump, both require changing at 400 hours according to the maintenance schedule. Suffice to say that I do have a RACOR installed on the boat and strongly believe in them. The point is though, how many boats (new dealer rigs or re-powers) leave the dealership with a high quality pre filter such as a Racor? If you bought a new rig and a year down the road had a "fuel related problem" and Yamaha denies warranty service. Who should really own that problem? (a) Yamaha, who let their product get rigged on a boat without proper fuel filtration (b) the boat mfg/dealer who did not install a quality filter but chose to install a $6.99 spin-on even though they knew (or should have known) the engines filter system was weak or (c) the boat owner who bought a package deal and maybe didn't know the pitfalls of the set-up as it was sold to him? The answer IMO shouldn't be the corporate "We can't control the quality of fuel owners put in their boat."

Just my opinion. Last I looked a high quality pre-filter costs as much as as a couple good life jackets.
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Old 01-18-2005, 07:53 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

we have cleaned and replaced all filters, including VST. Running a 10 micron Racor filter. Always had Racor since new. Have not checked pressure underway. I could care less if it is warrantied or not. I put the fuel in, it is my problem, period, I just want my boat to work, reliably. If they fix it great, if I fix it great. I bought the boat fully knowing that there would be costly repairs. I was told by many that Norwest has an outstanding reputation and stands firmly by their work, however, I am getting several opinions, and THT offers great advice from people who have my vantage point. Thank you all for you time and effort in responding.
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Old 01-18-2005, 07:54 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Quote:
skopje - 1/18/2005 7:18 PM

Quote:
Amitchum - 1/18/2005 7:41 PM

Wow, I've been having similar problems with yo 150 HPDI Yam too. I have roughly the same number of hours also. The motor idles, and goes anywhere from idle to 3-4 speed fine, but leave it in the corner for a while and the fuel pump cant keep up or something. It starts to cut out. We noticed that when it was cutting out, the fuel pump bulb was really slack, like it had no suction. When we pumped up the pressure, the motor runs fine. But that only buys you about 10 minutes at full trottle. We have the had the motor in the shop on 3 separate occasions, and they cant seem to fix the problem. We are going to have to find someone else, or call the folks at Yamaha to take a look at it. Who knows?

-Alex
If the bulb is collapsed, then you have a blockage between the bulb and the fuel tank. Better check the filter/water separator between the bulb and the tank, and the bac-flow valve at the fuel pick-up at the tank.
Could also be a blocked vent. Try running with the fuel fill opened. If things are ok then you know your vent or vent line is causing a restriction. Collapsed fuel primer bulb usually indicates vent,anti-siphon valve or seperator/filter. However , if the bulb is not collapsed and the engine picks up speed when you manually pump it then you need to check after the bulb like the fuel pump or engine mounted filter.
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Old 01-18-2005, 08:55 PM
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Default RE: Yamaha 150 HPDI Fuel Pump?

Sounds to me that the fuel feed problem has nothing to do with the motor! If the bulb is collapsed that means a fuel blockage between the tank and the bulb.

I'd start looking in that area before paying some yahoo $2,000 to replace engine parts! Could be as simple as hunks of crap in the tank causing intermittent fuel pickup problems.
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