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Random Quote: Get the Big net, this aint no little Sunfish ( Norman Thayer Jr. On Golden Pond)
I have a lot of respect for the e-tec's. The only thing that I can see going against it is will it last as long as a 4 stroke? As a 2 stroke is it not working on every stroke and thus will "wear out" faster? They're ain't no 2 stroke cars left..does that not tell you that long term the 4 stroke will be around longer?
"They're ain't no 2 stroke cars left..does that not tell you that long term the 4 stroke will be around longer?"
All that tells me is the auto industry never fully realized the potential of the 2 stroke engine. Even the motorcycle industry didn't get as far as E-Tec has (I think), or else they might not be running 4 strokes in motocross these days in increasing numbers.
Bomb has a good thing going considering their economy and emissions numbers. I hope they leave everyone scratching their heads saying "why aren't we building cars with this?"
Gersly, What do you mean by "As a 2 stroke is it not working on every stroke and thus will "wear out" faster?"? The power stroke of an engine is when the work takes place and on a two stroke that happens every two strokes and every four on a four stroke. I believe in general that two strokes don't last as long because the oil/gas mixture does not lubricate as well as a four stroke lubrication system.
Gersly, What do you mean by "As a 2 stroke is it not working on every stroke and thus will "wear out" faster?"? The power stroke of an engine is when the work takes place and on a two stroke that happens every two strokes and every four on a four stroke. I believe in general that two strokes don't last as long because the oil/gas mixture does not lubricate as well as a four stroke lubrication system.
Also, I know quite a few waterman around here that have 1500-2000+ hours on there ole ox66's and they're still cooking. How many hours do you expect out of an outboard? Alot depends on how much ya use your engine and how well you maintain it. I do know a guy (clamer) that has 2500+ on his F115 and its still running like new.
I have a lot of respect for the e-tec's. The only thing that I can see going against it is will it last as long as a 4 stroke? As a 2 stroke is it not working on every stroke and thus will "wear out" faster? They're ain't no 2 stroke cars left..does that not tell you that long term the 4 stroke will be around longer?
Huh? It is true that 2-strokes are "working" on every stroke but each of those strokes are working only half as hard as a 4-stroke is on its "every other" power stroke.
Assuming the E-TEC is built the way they have it advertised, it sounds like it will probably last longer than a 4-stroke. How many 4-strokes can be run out of the box at WOT?
The 2 stroke power stroke is every cycle of that cylinder. Power stroke pushes it down, then it clears the burn chamber of spent residue/gases , reloads with fuel on the upstroke and fires when it reaches the top on its compression stroke.
Here's some first hand info on the E-Tec. I'm running a 90hp E-tec in commercial service (guiding full-time in South Florida). I've put almost 400 hours on the motor in the last 10months and can't say enough good things about it. In a month or two I'll have it up for sale (with two years warranty remaining) and buy another one... I'm on their guide program, but after a small help in initial purchase price I'm just another customer when it comes to maintenance issues.
The "run it without breaking it in" part is absolutely accurate, that's what we did with it and it's still the most reliable motor that I've ever run. That said here's what you're looking at in maintenance costs when that 300hr service rolls around. The spark plugs are quite a bit more expensive than normal but that's the only elevated maintenance cost that I'm aware of. The real difference will come from whoever does your maintenance. These motors need Bombardier qualified techs and they must have the software for that specific model or they're only guessing. Some dealerships may balk at the additional cost to their service side but not if they want to stay current. Because I'm in commercial service we (me and my mechanic, who's a certified master technician) decided to use a 150hour maintenance schedule to be on the safe side and that's how we've worked it. Although they come with a 300 hour recommendation, they still have the same old 100 hour lower unit (but definitely heavier built). That's a large part of why we're doing the service intervals shorter than recommended.
After 10 months of running distances (avg 50 to 70 miles a day) in the saltwater Everglades the motor starts first time, every time, does not show a hint of any smoke, and covers about 5 miles for every gallon of fuel. To compare, my last motor was a 2003 Evinrude 115 Ficht. It only got 4 miles to the gallon at comparable speed (cruising at 30mph) and weighed 65lbs more...
What everyone should be looking for is when they bring out V-4 E-Tecs. I'll bet that other manufacturers aren't looking forward to it at all.
__________________ Tight Lines
Capt Bob LeMay
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I'm running an old custom rigged Maverick skiff. For a few years in the late 80's they built a 16'10" hull without an inner liner. The quoted hull weight was 735lbs. Back then one of the only ways of getting a light weight hull was to do without much of an interior (like the early Hewes Redfishers). I got them to sell me the bare hull and rigged it myself. It's never been particularly fast but is very sturdy and dry riding. It's perfect for the great distances I'm running each day and I can (and do) pole it all day, even against the wind when necessary...
With a 115 the top speed (according to my GPS) was 41 or 42mph, with the 90 E-Tec the top speed is only 38... As a guide I'm far more concerned with "legs" (how far I can run on a given amount of fuel) and longevity than anything else. I normally run at 4200 to 4500 rpm to produce a 30mph cruise speed. With the assist of trimtabs (Bennett's) I can jump up on plane in shallow water in less than one and a half boat lengths.... All I need is around 2 feet of water and the trimmers all the way down.
Hope this helps, motor comparisons should be made with similar hulls. Most newer hulls are probably a lot faster than mine, but I'll probably still be running it years from now....
__________________ Tight Lines
Capt Bob LeMay
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I think it's very interesting that all the guides are reporting in on the e-tec, yet we can't get a single word from the SKA guys on the 300 Yam fix - are they under a Yam corp gag order?
Glen
I have a lot of respect for the e-tec's. The only thing that I can see going against it is will it last as long as a 4 stroke? As a 2 stroke is it not working on every stroke and thus will "wear out" faster? They're ain't no 2 stroke cars left..does that not tell you that long term the 4 stroke will be around longer?
Glen, i think 2 stroke in cars wouldn't be as practical, due to weight,noise and smoke, they had no real reason to pursue the new tech. as did o/b makers cause engine weight in cars is not as crucial as in boats. i put 4000 hrs on an old (1972) in- line 6 115 merc in the 70's and early 80's. i sold it on the boat to a guy who put another 200 +/- before the water jacket corroded through and started to leak.
i agree 4 stroke is probably the future of o/bs more because of emissions than anything else.
evernic
trophy 2802WA 2x225 mercEFI
north miami beach fl.
i agree 4 stroke is probably the future of o/bs more because of emissions than anything else.
I don't think I would agree with that. The following regarding emissions is from an Australian white paper I have on the E-TEC (I fairly certain this paper was produced by BRP):
Quote:
Emissions
Engine emissions are mentioned a lot today and even though none of the Australian/New Zealand marine engine
markets is yet directly affected by emissions legislation, they are driving the technology of most modern engines.
About 70% of the worlds outboard markets are now, or will be by 2006, directly controlled by emission
regulations. There are three main emission regulating bodies, the USA Federal EPA, The California Air
Resources Board (CARB) and the more recently formulated EU (European Union) Recreational Craft Directive.
US EPA
The US Federal EPA affects all of the United States. It started in 1998 and is being phased in each year until full
compliance is required by 2006. Hydrocarbons (HC), Oxides of nitrogen (NOx) and Carbon Monoxide (CO) are
all measured and reported, but only HC and NOx are currently regulated. Corporate averaging is allowed, so
that each “clean” engine produced provide credits that allow some “dirty” engines to be made. The legislation
even allows for buying a selling of credits should an engine maker want to. To give you an idea of how the rules
get stricter with time, back in 1998 we could make about 20 old technology “dirty” engines with the credits we
got for making just one “clean” model. However by 2006 it will be completely reversed, with about 20 clean
engines required for every old technology “dirty” model sold. The US EPA 2006 regulations represent a 75%
drop in emissions over older technology carburettor engines.
CARB
The California Air Resources Board took the Federal EPA rules and said “we’ll go tougher than that”, the US
federal 2006 rules are in force by 2001, then another 20% lower emissions by 2004 and another big drop for
2008. These rules were given star ratings to make it easy identify the engines that comply. One star for 2001
models, 2 stars for those complying with 2004 rules and 3 stars for 2008. Engines sold in California must have
Star ratings shown on a label. The same pollutants are measured as for Federal EPA. Only applies in California,
but with 25 million people, good boating weather and lots of places to go boating, it’s a big market.
EU
Applies to all countries in the European Union. Applies different rules to 2-stroke and 4-stroke engines, and
separate requirements for all three main pollutants (HC, NOx and CO). The levels allowed are similar to the US
EPA, but no corporate averaging is allowed, and independent engine testing is required. The need for outside
independent testing and regulations for CO levels, mean the EU rules will be quite a challenge for some engine
technologies.
Total Reportable Emissions
To give you an idea of how E-TEC easily complies with emission regulations, here is a chart of how the various
outboard technologies compare. The dark (lower) bars are the HC and NOx emissions levels. Most modern low
emission designs are a marked improvement over the older technologies shown in the two right-side bars
(Carburettor 2-S and EFI 2-S). However only the very best of modern designs can achieve the California 3 Star
rating (below the dashed line). E-TEC is equal to or better then all current designs for HC and NOx, and is
lower than any for CO. All E-TEC models will be 3 Star rated.
The simultaneous opening of both intake and exhaust ports in 2-stroke engines, for nearly one half of the cycle,
was once their Achilles heel. It allowed the easy escape of unburnt fuel that caused high emissions. However,
with DI it becomes an advantage, as scavenging the cylinder with a new fresh charge of air is relatively easy,
compared with 4-stroke engines where the inlet is only open for one out of 4 strokes. This means that DI and ETEC
engines have much lower pumping losses (effort required to scavenge the cylinders) and that leads to lower
emissions and better fuel economy, especially at low speeds.
Sorry, I have no way of reproducing the graph but the CO values reported in the graph show the E-TEC producing about 70 grams/kilowatt-hour and the best EFI 4-stroke (w/o catalytic converter) producing about 125 grams/kilowatt-hour. The big question I have for the future of outboard technology is how are the 4-stroke makers going to get their CO values down if the environmental regulatory agencies clamp down on CO emissions to let's say the 70 range? Automobile manufacturers use a catalytic converter to reduce emissions from their 4-stroke engines. Is this possibly what is in the future for 4-stroke outboards? By the way, Audi's newly introduced engines are using direct injection technology much like what is found on direct injected 2-stroke outboards. Direct injection, whether it be on 2 or 4-strokes, is here to stay and will become the norm over time.
Add me to the list of happy Etec customers. I've had a 90 since last spring and its been flawless. Mine is on a 1720 key west and it'll top out around 42(gps) with a light load and near 40 with a full tank and fishing load. So far, it is everything they say in the ads. I guess time is the only thing left for 'em to prove.
evernic - 1/8/2005 9:48 AM
4 stroke is probably the future of o/bs more because of emissions than anything else.
Doubt it ...
The current 4-stroke OBs on the market today CANNOT meet the tougher EU emission standard without ADDING a catalytic converter. The Evinrude E-Tec meets it "as is".
__________________ [red]MISS TEAK[/red], 25' Parker mod-V Sport Cabin "Life's too short to own an ugly boat ..." www.classicparker.com
evernic - 1/8/2005 9:48 AM
4 stroke is probably the future of o/bs more because of emissions than anything else.
Doubt it ...
The current 4-stroke OBs on the market today CANNOT meet the tougher EU emission standard without ADDING a catalytic converter. The Evinrude E-Tec meets it "as is".
Hey I hope you are right, i prefer 2 stroke, just seems right to me for an o/b, since that is all i have ever owned since 1972
I own a 2006 E-Tec 200HP I purchased new. It has 100 hours on it and has been treated like a baby with regular maintenance, added inline gas filter, routinely add fresh gas with Marine Stabil,, use only 100% Synthetic Marine 2-cycle Pennzoil, etc. It is kept on a lift and run only in the clean freshwater lake we live on. For the first 3 years, I loved this motor. Runs quiet, plenty of power, easy on gas, but this month, one of the piston heads shattered. I was stunned as after running outboards since I was 11 years old in the 50's, I have never had an engine problem. My dealer spoke to Evinrude and they "suggested" bad gas. Well, let me assure you, that's was not the problem.
I mentioned what had happened to a friend of mine who is one of the foremost fishing guides in the state if not the region and he said this if fairly common for the E-Tec to make it through the warranty period and then have problems because they have been set to run lean to meet emission standards.
Has anyone else experienced this problem or had Evinrude or a dealer admit to a problem with these engines after the first 100 hours?
Thanks for your help.
Dude, realy sorry to hear about your motor, but this thread is six years old! Post a new thread and title it "E-Tec goes boom" and you will probabley get all sorts of help here. Wecome to the forum!
RE: Opinion on Evinrude E-tec engine 
E-Tec Piston Shattered at 100 hours Use 
