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Old 02-28-2010, 06:15 PM
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Default Another CAT Question? 18' Nautico-Seagull??

HI: I am looking at a 2001 Nautico Seagull Cat with a 70 hp 4-stroke Suzi on the back. My question is what should I know about how this rig is put together & is that amount of hp on the back sufficient? The guy who owns the boat said that at WOT the boat will do in the 27 to 28 mph range & will cruise in the low 20's. I am concerned about the lack of power & just wanted to get some input. Thanks, Steve

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Old 02-28-2010, 06:20 PM
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Diver

I have the bigger brother (20') of that boat, a Seagull 20. I think the 70 if properly propped will probably perform just about as the old owner told you, actually maybe a bit better. I would expect 30-32 mph WOT and cruise mid-20's (of course, cruise depends on what cruising RPM you pick for the Suzi.)

As for construction, the Nautico definitely has wood in the deck and may have elsewhere as well. They had some quality problems early (96, 97 thereabouts) with the Nauticos, but later were generally pretty good. I would have someone who knows what they are doing look at the wood situation though, perhaps even a full survey if you have any doubts.
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Old 02-28-2010, 06:36 PM
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Thanks for the reply KPS! The owner did tell me about the original wood problems but said that this boat was reworked along with many others at the time. Apparently the wood was replaced with marine grade & also flotation added to the hull. I was not going to have a survey done on this rig but perhaps it might be best if I do. How much do you think putting a T-top on this boat would affect how it rides/handles? Just curious. Thanks again, Steve
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Old 02-28-2010, 07:36 PM
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Steve

Yes, on the price these boats are selling for, a full blown survey can look a little expensive. Still, might be worth it. That was the exact problem with the wood....not wood itself, but they used an inferior grade of plywood and didn't coat it right, especially on the very early Nauticos, which were built in Mexico. (Don't worry, well before 2001 the Mexican building was a thing of the past.) "Reworked" is kind of like "remanufactured" with engines; one man's rework is another man's bandaid. Not trying to diss your seller, but bad wood in these boats can be a real bitch.

About the t-top, hard to say. I don't have one and don't want one. What I do know is that a friend of mine was looking at a boat like mine, but with t-top. He seatrialed it, and while other more nasty problems with that particular boat got most of his attention, he did feel that the top did not help the boat. Should tell you that these planing cats are light, the 20' ones go about 1600 lbs dry and no motor. The 18 is less; I'm not sure how much. The weight of a t-top is going to have an effect.

I have a 4S Honda 90 on mine and performance is fine; the one he trialed had a nice newer 4S Suzi 140, and even with that power he felt it was slow to plane (mine is very quick) and wallowed some (mine doesn't.) He attributed much of that to the top, although regarding the planing, the prop may or may not have been correct.

Good luck.
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Old 02-28-2010, 08:37 PM
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Sorry, but I have to disagree with the stated performance numbers. I have an 18' 2001 Seagull with a Yamaha 115 on it. It had the Suzuki 4 stroke 70 on it before. There is no way that boat is cruising in the low 20's....16-18 mph is more realistic. The stated WOT is just a tad on the high side, 25-27 mph is more realistic. When Leader started producing that hull, that put either 90's or 115's on it. When SeaCat started producing it, they put a 140 on it, and still do. I tried many props on mine and I settled on a stainless 4 blade. Personally, I feel the 70 is too small. The 90 will leave you wanting a little more, the 115 is perfect and the 140 will always leave you with just a bit more than you need.

Moving up to the 115, my cruise is now 24-25 mph @ 4000 rpm's and my WOT is 35.4 MPH. In my opinion, a t-top will kill that boat. Great boat for 2-3 people in the bays and Gulf of Mexico.
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Old 02-28-2010, 10:07 PM
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runabout

I think you may be putting two hulls into one here. The 18 Nautico is not the mold/hull that Leader and ProKat used, I don't think. AFAIK, they were using the 20 Seagull/Nautico mold, which was always a 90-150 from the Seagull factory, when sold as a Seagull. I know for a fact that that this larger mold is the one that ProKat used. Perhaps Leader did use the 18, along with the 20. I just don't know. The larger (20 foot) Nautico came from the Seagull factory as a twin engine boat.

About a Sea Cat, I assume you are talking about their 18 footer produced in the 2004-2006 period? If so, I was not aware that was pulled off a Nautico mold, but it certainly could be. But news to me.

Having said, I will certainly defer to your numbers as I have not run the 18 ever. But I will tell you that my 20 with 90 will do about 35 or 36 WOT and cruise nicely in the mid 20's. That is lightly loaded, two or three people, half full of gas (about 30 gallons.)

Member Lazy Iguana here, who is not around much anymore, has the same boat as mine but with a 150 Merc (I just don't remember which 150) and reported his WOT as around 40, with cruise just into the 30's.

Last edited by KeyPineSavage; 02-28-2010 at 11:49 PM.
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Old 02-28-2010, 10:47 PM
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The 18' nautico/ seagull is only rated for max 90 hp. It is a great boat for inshore and bays. It greatly increased the number of comfortable fishing days when I had mine at the beach. With my 90 wot is 34mph with cruising in the mid 20's. I would never think about a t top for this boat due to the beam. Getting ready to put mine on the market due to lack of use inland.
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Old 02-28-2010, 11:49 PM
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btaylor

Yes, those are more like the numbers I was thinking about in regard to the original posters specs. with the 70 on the boat he's looking at. Also more in line with my thinking than runabout's thoughts about the 70 (not that I am questioning his numbers with his own 115.)
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Old 03-01-2010, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by KeyPineSavage View Post
runabout

I think you may be putting two hulls into one here. The 18 Nautico is not the mold/hull that Leader and ProKat used, I don't think. AFAIK, they were using the 20 Seagull/Nautico mold, which was always a 90-150 from the Seagull factory, when sold as a Seagull. I know for a fact that that this larger mold is the one that ProKat used. Perhaps Leader did use the 18, along with the 20. I just don't know. The larger (20 foot) Nautico came from the Seagull factory as a twin engine boat.

About a Sea Cat, I assume you are talking about their 18 footer produced in the 2004-2006 period? If so, I was not aware that was pulled off a Nautico mold, but it certainly could be. But news to me.

Having said, I will certainly defer to your numbers as I have not run the 18 ever. But I will tell you that my 20 with 90 will do about 35 or 36 WOT and cruise nicely in the mid 20's. That is lightly loaded, two or three people, half full of gas (about 30 gallons.)

Member Lazy Iguana here, who is not around much anymore, has the same boat as mine but with a 150 Merc (I just don't remember which 150) and reported his WOT as around 40, with cruise just into the 30's.
Key Pine,

Not confused. Leader used the same mold as the Seagull 18. May not have been the mold purchased from them, but copied. Leader produced the 18' predominantly and in much fewer numbers, a 20' and a 22'. Although they made a few of the 18's in the early days as a non-lined model, the later models were predominantly a lined model. They mostly came with a 90, although I have seen a few with 115's on them. Don't know if that was from the factory or a re-power. If you look at the SeaCat website, the 18' is pictured and it is the Seagull hull. As I said, I don't know if the original hull went to Leader and then to SeaCat, or if Leader made their own hull. I do know that when I spoke to Don Fiedler about the SeaCat's, he mentioned that the Seagull hull has was a great design and has been copied many times.

I believe you are correct about the ProKat's, I don't think they ever produced an 18' model, only the 20' and larger.

I know my 18' is only rated for a 90, but I did the repower and wanted a little more. Mine had the four stroke 70 on it. WOT could maybe touch 27, by myself, with only a couple gallons of gas under perfect conditions. Put 4 average size men in that boat and your looking a WOT of 21-22 and a cruise of 16 mph.

I'm not downingthe 18' with the 70, just trying to post realistic #'s. My suggestion to the OP is to take a hand held GPS with him and sea trial the boat under normal conditions. If he is going to be going with 2-3 guys on a regular basis, take them along. If it's just going to be him and one other, than sea trial that way. 400-500 pounds does make a huge difference with this boat. It's a great boat for the right person, I love mine, but it's predominantly only used with myself and one other.
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Old 03-01-2010, 06:30 AM
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I had the 18' Leader cat with a 70hp Suzuki 4s. Water would enter the scuppers if you walked to the back. If you desire more speed then I would make darn sure the hull can handle the extra weight. The 70 seemed fine for my inshore needs.
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Old 03-01-2010, 09:21 AM
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Well thanks for all of the excellent advice offered. Looks like I will be steering away from that particular boat at this time!

Steve

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Old 03-01-2010, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by ReefDiver View Post
Well thanks for all of the excellent advice offered. Looks like I will be steering away from that particular boat at this time!

Steve

No reason to steer away from it unless it doesn't meet your specific criteria or needs. Couple of questions and maybe we can help you out with suggestions as to what boat will work best for you. Where will you be using the boat? Keys, FL East Coast, FL W Coast, Texas, NC? Will it be used for fishing, diving, island hopping? How many occupants normally? Budget?

The listed cat is a great boat and if you are running around the bay and island hopping with the wife or gf, it may be perfect for you. The speed doesn't really matter then. Loading it up with 3 or 4 guys and running 10-15 miles or more offshore, may want to look at SeaCat 21...won't be much faster, but definately better suited for that use on a regular basis. Running 10-15 miles or so offshore with just yourself and one other fishing, not a bad boat if you don't have the need for speed.
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Old 03-01-2010, 12:52 PM
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Runabout: I am located in CT & we fish LIS waters with occasional trips to Montauk & such. Usually fish 3 guys with lots of gear, etc... (loaded down I guess). Also would need a T-top on the boat. I like the boat but with only the 70 hp engine I really don't think it would work for me. Thanks again for all the help!

Steve
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Old 03-01-2010, 02:01 PM
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I would suggest a 21' SeaCat. Most of them already have T-tops on them and have an 8'6" beam. From my experience, twin 90's on that boat are a good power choice. Good solid boats with good sea keeping abilities and it will not feel loaded down with 3 people, full of fuel and gear. Long way from you, but there is one in good condition down here in the Tampa, FL area for $10,000 with a trailer.
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Old 03-01-2010, 03:58 PM
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Key Pine,

Not confused. Leader used the same mold as the Seagull 18. May not have been the mold purchased from them, but copied. .....

Runabout

First, totally agree with your advice to the OP about what he should watch out for. Also, as I said never questioned your own numbers.

Also, thanks for the education on the Leader 18. I have never even seen one. As I said, I was sure about the Leader 20 and then the Prokat 20 CC.
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Old 07-10-2010, 12:33 PM
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Default Nautico 18'

I just joined because the posts and replies were so good and informative. I too am looking at a 1999 Nautico 18 with a 2002 Johnson 4 s 90 hp. I understand that the motor is a Suzuki and that's ok. How do I tell if the hull is U.S. made and free of plywood problems? Here's a link to the ad http://raleigh.craigslist.org/boa/1802526873.html Not much in extras. Here's one in Fla. http://www.boats.com/boat-details/Se...nsole/22236251
Any comments would be helpful. I have lots of boating experience, mostly in sailboats. My fishing buddy got married and SHE LIKES TO FISH! I'm in coastal N.C. and really need to get back to fishing! Thanks in advance for any advice. Buck
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Old 07-10-2010, 08:54 PM
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Both of those boats...and ALL of the 18' Nautico by Seagull have wood in them. Only the 19/20' Seagull is wood free. The 19/20' Seagull (not Nautico by Seagull), like KeyPine has, was offered as a wood free,single engine boat with a liner. There is also the 19/20' Nautico by Seagull (same mold as the Seagull that KeyPine has) that has the wood construction and was only offered in a twin engine configuration without a liner. All boats that were made and sold as Nautico by Seagull have wood in them and no liner. Personally, of the two boats listed, I would stay away from both, but for different reasons. The one listed in Raleigh is over priced and I don't think I would buy an 8 year old Johnson four stroke, but that's just my opinion. The other one listed by Seven Seas is killing me....love the bow stop!! Did they steal the rope from Jethro's pants to tie it on there? Besides the fact the boat has a 7' beam, not the 8' beam listed, I don't think that boat can handle the weight of the t top. Not to mention that the top has been re-welded from cracks on both sides of the console. There are better deals out there on the Nautico's, like this one: http://sarasota.craigslist.org/boa/1821380072.html

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Old 07-10-2010, 10:59 PM
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About the specifications and construction, runabout has given you exactly correct information, as I understand it. (One minor exception....I have heard, and saw one review, that they made a few of the 20 Nauticos with a single engine configuration instead of the usual twins.)

About the Mexican construction, only the early Nauticos, and I think only the 18's, were made there, and I don't know exactly when they quit and brought production back to the States, but it was fairly early. 1999's (both the ones you are looking at) are fairly early, but I just don't know. It was the sealing of the wood in the Mexican boats (or non-sealing) that caused most of the trouble, AFAIK. The US built units supposedly did not have this problem, even though they still had the wood.
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Old 07-11-2010, 10:42 AM
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Default Nautico 18

Thanks so much for the helpful replies. I'm getting a little leery of the Nauticos although, I'd have to inspect one thoroughly before deciding. The one on the Sarasota Craig's List is very attractive but a long way to go to inspect. I'm limited to a smaller boat due to my 4 cylinder Tacoma 2WD. It's rated for 2000 lbs. and I wouldn't be driving more than about 100 miles each way. I'm also looking at a 80s period 17' Whaler SS w/1999 Yamaha 2S 90 hp for 3500.00 asking. It needs trailer work and I would annt to install a console w/seat and a cooler seat w/flip flop backrest. Add to that 2 pedestal seats and a foot controlled trolling motor and I'm up to about 6k. Buck
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Old 07-11-2010, 12:53 PM
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Buck

Couple of thoughts. That Tacoma will pull that Nautico just fine, especially for the distances you are talking about.

I've had some small Whalers. They are what they are and good in many ways. But I'd say the cat would ride about three times better than a 17 Whaler. More chop you've got, the bigger the difference will be.

Last, yes about close inspection. First is the wood, and for that you probably need an expert, but not necessarily a full formal "survey." Wood, or at least the wood that causes the problem, is mostly in the decks and in the transom. Second, a lot of the Nauticos that I've seen were fished hard, damn hard, and being basically a sort of "price point" boat from the start, they show it. This you should be able to tell when you look. (And that may be OK, if it gets you a solid but bit tired boat at a good price.)

Either way, buy something and get on the water.
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