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Random Quote: Hey, when I want your opinion I'll give it to you!
I recently bought a 1998 Skagit Orca 27 fiberglass pilothouse. My former boat was an 26' aluminum plate pilothouse, so I'm learning the ways of PRF. Anyway, here in the Pacific Northwest hitting "stuff" floating in/under the water is a way of life. With aluminum, unless you also hit the engine's lower unit, no worries. But with fiberglass, there are chips in the gelcoat that need to be repaired. It's not that it's hard or complicated, just repetitive here, where the forests fall into the sea.
I'm also like to canoe, and this winter, I noticed that my veteran 17' Old Town Tripper had started to wear a little thin at the bow where I run it up on the bank all the time. Old town sells a kevlar keel repair kit. You rough up the poly-plastic along the keel with sandpaper, lay down a strip of kevlar cloth, and then mix the two-part resin/hardener and paint/saturate the kevlar strip onto the canoe's keel. The result is a "bulletproof" keel. I've run my canoe up onto concrete ramps a few times just to test it, and I haven't even scratched it.
So, I got to thinking (always dangerous, I know). What would happen if I kevlar'd the keel of my Orca???
I don't care about looks or a slight loss of top speed, ONLY ruggedness! I've seen the glue-on rubber keel guards that are on the market, but my kevlar keel canoe looks tougher.
It wont last any longer than a patch done out of regular glass. I would do the keel guard and be done with it. Now if you really want to go nuts ,look at some of the commercial Whalers... They had a stainless keel guard.
Although kevlar is light and strong, abrasion causes it to frazzle easily into little fuzz. Fiberglass and other materials are more abrasion resistent. In the case of your canoe repair, the resin probably has not worn to a point that the kevlar is exposed.
It just seems to me that gelcoat (and the Marine-Tech used to patch it) are kinda brittle. Always chipping off after bumping into "stuff". I'm afraid that a rubber keel guard will merely hide future chips. The cross woven kevlar cloth looks like it will bind things together better?
I've got a Panga that has some forefoot damage and I'm thinking that after I repair the FG damage, I'm going to put on one of the glue on keel guards that I see on quite a few boats. Anybody had any experience with them?
It wont last any longer than a patch done out of regular glass. I would do the keel guard and be done with it. Now if you really want to go nuts ,look at some of the commercial Whalers... They had a stainless keel guard.
I disagree as to Kevlar.
Our hulls are Kevlar hulls, SeaHunter, and do not agree with your view of the material.
Now, in saying that, I am not an engineer, but have access to some of the best, and I dont know how to build a stronger hull, nor a more expensive one for that matter.
One of the very best engineers that I have driven crazy for years, is right up yonder in your neck of the woods. I dont claim to be a laminate engineer, but do claim to know some of the best and can not agree with you on the matter.
I've got a Panga that has some forefoot damage and I'm thinking that after I repair the FG damage, I'm going to put on one of the glue on keel guards that I see on quite a few boats. Anybody had any experience with them? Pat
Kevlar is a great material for bullet resistant vests, its bullet resistant property comes from the tightness of the weave and multipal layers used. Is it worth the cost of using a few layers in hull construction ? I think I would have to see some real world test results Kevlar vs fiberglass in a controlled impact to be convinced of its use being worth the cost
I deal with similar issues fishing rivers here in OK I went with a hamby keel guard on my rig can't say enough good about it just make sure to have it professionally installed
Kevlar is a great material for bullet resistant vests, its bullet resistant property comes from the tightness of the weave and multipal layers used. Is it worth the cost of using a few layers in hull construction ? I think I would have to see some real world test results Kevlar vs fiberglass in a controlled impact to be convinced of its use being worth the cost
Brad,
Please inform JW that I'll do my very best to answer any Kevlar questions, Carbon Fiber, he may have.
If I cant, I'll get one of our engineers into the conversation.
I have no idea why I constantly try to teach him stuff.
As recently as this morning I attempted to make him feel better by allowing him to think he knows more about a subject than I do.
The only disadvantage to a Kevlar hull is cost. Something like 8X more than E glass per pound, and vinyl vs. poly resins about 2 or 3 times as much.
I dont think there's any issue as to which is better, stronger, or the like.
However, you do make a point. There are those that understand the differance, will pay for it, and others who understand the differance, but wont pay for it.
That's why you guys will continue to succeed, as will we.
There's buyers for both.
I put three guards on my Carolina Skiff 19 DLV because I wanted to be able to run up on rocky beaches. I used Kevlar and epoxy thickened with cab o sil as an adhesive. It worked well and was not abraded much when I sold the boat.
The downside is that it was a baby sh@t yellow color.
The upside is that it cost way less than a KeelGuard.
__________________ That's my 2 cents. And you can keep the change.
If went to Kevlar laminates it would make the bottom more "shatter resistant" upon hitting a log. However hitting a log is just not just one point of impact on the keel. There are dead heads (where just the end of the log floats, at the surface. It can impact on other parts of the hull. You have to have faith that your boat is well built (it is).
As for as the abrasion on the forefoot and keel--putting a sacrificial strip of glass cloth, with epoxy resin is what I did every season for a RIB we took our dogs ashore in at least 3 times a day in the PNW. We also mixed aluminum powder in the last coats of the epoxy. The rebuilt keel laminate was faired to the hull and with bottom paint could not be seen. After using the dinghy this way for 4 years, there was no damage to the boat, or thinning of the laminate. Almost every beaching involved rocks--and some were rather sharp.
Yes, logs and trash is a problem in the PNW--put on a sacrificial strip, with epoxy--if you want to use Kevlar--OK--but I don't think in your specific instance you will gain much. Definitely use epoxy for better adherence and chip resistance.
Kevlar keel guard? 
