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Most boating customers would never get into the boat business, I agree that yes it probably is a very difficult business to make a profit. That being said, why are you in the business if there is no money in it as you say............Nobody forced you into the boat business and if it is so difficult then get the hell out, its still a free country isn't it. I am only looking at it from a consumers point of view because yes I am a consumer and no I am not in the boat business, Do you think that the average consumer gives a rats ass about the local car dealership having a tough time when they walk in to haggle a deal? Same for boats, consumers may be buying a "lifestyle" in your mind but the bottom line is you are trying to sell a boat and the buyer is trying to pay as little as possible for it, they don't care how much you are into the boat for , if you were taking a trade you would try to pay as little as possible for it.
I was saving your post for the end. I would love to debate with you, but I need to go...seriously...
You are the prime example of what drives us, the dealer, nuts. You are the type of guy who wants the level of service that my dealership provides but you don't want to pay for it. To answer some of your other post quickly. This is my job. This is what I have done my entire life. You may not believe it, but I enjoyed working on boats. Some people do not just work for the love of money as you implied in a earlier post, but I expect to be able to make a living at it. At the risk of sounding self promoting here is a link to a video of my dealership. http://www.eastcoastmarineservice.co...l%20Screen.wmv
Now ask yourself. How much do you think it cost to run a dealership that has a 97.5 to 100% CSI??? When a new boat comes off a truck there is a little more to prep than just a 3000.00 detail.
I seriously have to run.... I will try to respond in more detalil in the next day or so.... sorry for the quick replys!
Please do not get me wrong... I did not miss your point and I agree that the industry needs to change. But there are way too many people who feel that the dealers are just pulling in the cash and that is just not true.
100% agree with you. This is an industry where more often than not, it is a labor of love. What boater wouldn't want to be around boats all day? And the manufacturers exploit that to the max.
Most boating customers would never get into the boat business, I agree that yes it probably is a very difficult business to make a profit. That being said, why are you in the business if there is no money in it as you say............Nobody forced you into the boat business and if it is so difficult then get the hell out, its still a free country isn't it. I am only looking at it from a consumers point of view because yes I am a consumer and no I am not in the boat business, Do you think that the average consumer gives a rats ass about the local car dealership having a tough time when they walk in to haggle a deal? Same for boats, consumers may be buying a "lifestyle" in your mind but the bottom line is you are trying to sell a boat and the buyer is trying to pay as little as possible for it, they don't care how much you are into the boat for , if you were taking a trade you would try to pay as little as possible for it.
Nauset,
With all due respect sir, you are somewhat talking out of both sides of your mouth. I completely understand your point of view however your theory is quite tainted. When you walk into a boat dealership to trade in your boat, we buy your boat for wholesale. By doing this you are not held responsible to warranty that boat like we are. Likewise, you do not buy your boat for retail price so why should we give you retail for your boat? While I realize your the customer the relationship between dealer and customer has to be give and take, not just take.
I would be one to bet that when you are out on your boat and something breaks you would want immediate service, likewise, we as a dealer would like to be able to provide that. Immediate service however is something that is reserved for my paying customers. Will I jump at a moments notice for a customer of mine? Absolutely. Will I jump at a moments notice from someone who bought a boat from someone else and wants me to service it, most times not. I have a responsibility to my paying customers which support me to provide the highest level of customer care I possibly can. I am more then happy to help someone else, but it must be on our schedule. Just like PABOAT, we are also recipients of many CSI awards for excellence in service, that is how I treat all my paying customers.
In closing I will tell you that you are in my territory in regards to a boat sale, I am less than 2 hours from you. If you walk into my dealership you would be treated with the utmost respect and a high level of service. Will you pay a premium for it? Yes. Will you have an absolutely perfect experience with your new boat? Absolutely. You will always get what you pay for.
PABOAT, send me a PM, glad to see a fellow Monterey Dealer.
Builders that are direct seem to be doing well at the higher end such as Sea Vee, YF and Sea Hunter. If there is a problem, most times it is something not related to the actual hull, but to the engine, steering, pumps etc, where any certified mechanic will take care of the problem during warranty, so it appears as though the model works in specific market areas.
I was saving your post for the end. I would love to debate with you, but I need to go...seriously...
You are the prime example of what drives us, the dealer, nuts. You are the type of guy who wants the level of service that my dealership provides but you don't want to pay for it. To answer some of your other post quickly. This is my job. This is what I have done my entire life. You may not believe it, but I enjoyed working on boats. Some people do not just work for the love of money as you implied in a earlier post, but I expect to be able to make a living at it. At the risk of sounding self promoting here is a link to a video of my dealership. http://www.eastcoastmarineservice.co...l%20Screen.wmv
Now ask yourself. How much do you think it cost to run a dealership that has a 97.5 to 100% CSI??? When a new boat comes off a truck there is a little more to prep than just a 3000.00 detail.
I seriously have to run.... I will try to respond in more detalil in the next day or so.... sorry for the quick replys!
PA: Thanks for your honest and professional opinions and insight. This is why I love THT.
Let me share an instance that may shed some light on my viewpoint. First of all I am not afraid of paying top dollar for anything and definitely not one to beat a dealer into submission to get the lowest possible price.If a dealer needs x amount to keep the doors open I can understand that of course, what bothers me is when you pay for that perceived quality and it is not delivered. I had purchased a new Grady White when delivered would not shift out of gear, bilge pumps and livewell pumps not working and electrical system blowing fuses in addition the overpriced bottom paint job was 2" too low. Salesman that delivered the boat hit the dock because it would not shift out of gear! The next day a mechanic shows up at my dock and tells me after working on it for an hour that "that is as good as the can get it and if I don't like it I should have bought a different boat!!! This was my first 24 hours as proud owner of a "top quality" boat and this was what a $3000 freight and prep charge should avoid by thoroughly checking all systems before delivery, an elite dealership my ass.
The situation got to the point that Eddie Smith (CEO of Grady) had the dealer come and get the boat to straighten it out. Obviously nothing was "prepped" on the boat other than a wash and wax. Do you think that is okay? This is Grady dealer that has all kinds of service awards on the wall yet to this day does not know how to service their customer base. Not many people use this dealer for service after warranty because of their reputation for high prices and questionable quality of service.
On a boat that has the outboard rigged at the factory like Sea Hunt, Grady, Whaler etc..I'm not sure what "prep" needs to be done. Any options the buyer chooses to install on the boat might be part of that, but past that..what's left? A minimum wage lot guy who marginally washes it before I pick it up?
As for paying extra for the "local" guy..I's just not my job to make sure he stays in business. If they can't figure out out to be competitive and make a profit, how did that become my problem? My last 2 boats have been purchased several hundred miles away from my home--in both cases because the dealer 2 miles from my house could get within several thousand $$ of the price. If they go out of business..it's really not my problem. If it ever needs it...someone will work on the boat.
Let me share an instance that may shed some light on my viewpoint. First of all I am not afraid of paying top dollar for anything and definitely not one to beat a dealer into submission to get the lowest possible price.If a dealer needs x amount to keep the doors open I can understand that of course, what bothers me is when you pay for that perceived quality and it is not delivered. I had purchased a new Grady White when delivered would not shift out of gear, bilge pumps and livewell pumps not working and electrical system blowing fuses in addition the overpriced bottom paint job was 2" too low. Salesman that delivered the boat hit the dock because it would not shift out of gear! The next day a mechanic shows up at my dock and tells me after working on it for an hour that "that is as good as the can get it and if I don't like it I should have bought a different boat!!! This was my first 24 hours as proud owner of a "top quality" boat and this was what a $3000 freight and prep charge should avoid by thoroughly checking all systems before delivery, an elite dealership my ass.
The situation got to the point that Eddie Smith (CEO of Grady) had the dealer come and get the boat to straighten it out. Obviously nothing was "prepped" on the boat other than a wash and wax. Do you think that is okay? This is Grady dealer that has all kinds of service awards on the wall yet to this day does not know how to service their customer base. Not many people use this dealer for service after warranty because of their reputation for high prices and questionable quality of service.
That is a great example of why many dealers are in peril right now. When times were good, many got lazy and forgot what it takes to create a loyal customer base and true customer satisfaction.
3 Cheers for PA Boat Dr.!!! You Tell em! I have seen it for years, the public wants: Cheapest Price Possible, will drive 500 miles to save 500 dollars, and expect class A service from their local dealer and expect us to bend over backwards to fix anything and everything, by next week. When things don't go the way they think it should, they call the plant and attempt to tattle on us like 4 year olds. The manufacturer's Like Parker back us up 100% telling you to buy from your local servicing dealer because they know that you, the customer will NEED us after the sale eventually! I was taught, you have to collect it to give it back. We do just that with our local customers and have THE best reputation for "Taking care of our own" If I didn't collect it, I'm not giving it back. We still live in a world where you get what you did or DIDN'T pay for! PS-FYI-The reason 98% of all boat manufacturers don't go direct, is they do not want to deal with the pain in the ass public for sales and especially service! I too feel myself getting upset and could go on for days, but it's time to go. Kudos PA Boat DR.
That is a great example of why many dealers are in peril right now. When times were good, many got lazy and forgot what it takes to create a loyal customer base and true customer satisfaction.
And apparently these same dealers do not want the customers questioning anything they claim. look at the dealer responses to this thread, The customer is cheap, the customer wants everything for free, the customer doesn't understand how tough it is, the customer is wrong......Yeah and the dealers are always honest and never overcharge, I see its us not you, we are the reason so many dealers are in trouble. "Damn customers want what they paid for how dare they"........keep whistling past the graveyard instead of adapting to the new consumer, informed and sick of getting screwed......
3 Cheers for PA Boat Dr.!!! You Tell em! I have seen it for years, the public wants: Cheapest Price Possible, will drive 500 miles to save 500 dollars, and expect class A service from their local dealer and expect us to bend over backwards to fix anything and everything, by next week. When things don't go the way they think it should, they call the plant and attempt to tattle on us like 4 year olds. The manufacturer's Like Parker back us up 100% telling you to buy from your local servicing dealer because they know that you, the customer will NEED us after the sale eventually! I was taught, you have to collect it to give it back. We do just that with our local customers and have THE best reputation for "Taking care of our own" If I didn't collect it, I'm not giving it back. We still live in a world where you get what you did or DIDN'T pay for! PS-FYI-The reason 98% of all boat manufacturers don't go direct, is they do not want to deal with the pain in the ass public for sales and especially service! I too feel myself getting upset and could go on for days, but it's time to go. Kudos PA Boat DR.
How dare the public want both the best price and top service.....I didn't know we had to choose, maybe we did before but its a whole new game, adapt or be extinct
Wow classic "us against them" mentality imo. However, I can understand both sides. My 2 boat purchases have been from the builder direct and from the builders factory store. Pretty painless. I think I'll stick with that business model.
Oh and not to hijack the thread but anyone know if Steigercraft sells direct??
......did anyone uncover if there is remotely any truth to the original question from OP??
Truth? Yes its true that I heard the rumor . I was asking if anyone else had heard the same thing and next thing you know its Consumers vs. Retailers........
Edgewater is dealing direct to a certain extent as is Pro Line among others, why wouldn't Grady and Parker consider similar marketing if it moves some of the inventory left on hand and put people back to work. I applaud Pro Line for doing something out of the ordinary in corporate america, putting profits aside to keep people working and will probably ending up a better company in the end. A good deed that may turn out to be a great success in the long run.
I also want to ask the question again of the dealers, how many, if any, boats will you order for inventory for the upcoming season? If the answer is substantially less than in previous years, how will you make up for the loss of profit margin that a new boat sale brings ?
Exclusive dealer areas, low balling on trade ins, gouging on freight and prep, less than professional service. People the time has come to treat the consumer as a long term customer instead of a one time easy mark. If you do not change your business model to reflect changing times, you'll all be extinct. Complain and make all of the excuses you wish........all the way to out of business
Forty two years and counting selling over 300 boats per year, yes, including this year, and a very nice percentage of that is repeat and referral. I don't know who you base your assumptions upon, but I agree that dealer will be gone soon, or has been gone for a long time.
Low ball a trade? We need trades. Gouging on freight and prep---they are real expenses that can be spelled out easily. Less than professional service just doesn't happen with a legitimate long term successful dealer.
And as to changing times, they change yearly and monthly as any business person will tell you; whatever industry they may represent.
If you had a bad experience with a dealer or two; that makes me sad. But there are far more good ones than bad; all you need do is seek them out and it shouldn't be hard--they are the ones who have always been there.
And apparently these same dealers do not want the customers questioning anything they claim. look at the dealer responses to this thread, The customer is cheap, the customer wants everything for free, the customer doesn't understand how tough it is, the customer is wrong......Yeah and the dealers are always honest and never overcharge, I see its us not you, we are the reason so many dealers are in trouble. "Damn customers want what they paid for how dare they"........keep whistling past the graveyard instead of adapting to the new consumer, informed and sick of getting screwed......
And you judge us all by one experience you had with one dealer. Have you ever heard the story about one bad apple doesn't spoil the whole bunch? Tell me the business you are in so I can relate the one bad experience I am sure I had with it--You owe us that much by now with your attitude!
Truth? Yes its true that I heard the rumor . I was asking if anyone else had heard the same thing and next thing you know its Consumers vs. Retailers........
Edgewater is dealing direct to a certain extent as is Pro Line among others, why wouldn't Grady and Parker consider similar marketing if it moves some of the inventory left on hand and put people back to work. I applaud Pro Line for doing something out of the ordinary in corporate america, putting profits aside to keep people working and will probably ending up a better company in the end. A good deed that may turn out to be a great success in the long run.
I also want to ask the question again of the dealers, how many, if any, boats will you order for inventory for the upcoming season? If the answer is substantially less than in previous years, how will you make up for the loss of profit margin that a new boat sale brings ?
Oh, and by the way, Parker is definitely NOT selling direct; nor is Edgewater. Not sure about Grady, but would bet major money against it.
Builders who sell direct are free to do so; but dealers will shy away from them as has always happened in the past---why would you want to compete with your builder?
How do you make up less profits on new boats? Buy more used of course until that market dries up; then start buying new again---just like what happened in the early eighties, the early nineties and the early 2000's. Everything is cyclical; the boat industry is no exception.
