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Random Quote: We all have issues, some more than others.
I just replaced a water pump on my 97 Johnson 130hp and getting the lower unit back on is a SOB! It looks like they started the bolts and tried to force it back up. If I hadn't figured out a trick it would have taken three people to get everything lined up to install the LU.
I can't remember if you have used a heat gun to find out how hot it is actually getting and where it's getting the hottest. I had a 90 Yamaha that would get just hot enough to go into guardian mode but not really any hotter and not hot enough to do any dammage. The hottest part was right where the guardian switch was located. I put a temperature gauge on it, disconnected the guardian mode switch and drove it like that for years. This is certainly not a recommendation.....just saying what I did to an old motor.
I can't remember if you have used a heat gun to find out how hot it is actually getting and where it's getting the hottest. I had a 90 Yamaha that would get just hot enough to go into guardian mode but not really any hotter and not hot enough to do any dammage. The hottest part was right where the guardian switch was located. I put a temperature gauge on it, disconnected the guardian mode switch and drove it like that for years. This is certainly not a recommendation.....just saying what I did to an old motor.
I wanted to ask that same question, but based on the mechanics experienced...I didn't really want to question him....when our 250's were running warm (they didn't overheat, but got up there) when we replaced the poppet valves, the first thing he did is hit each cylinder bank with a temp gun....That way you know if the engine is actually overheating, or if it is a sensor or emm issue.
Sorry to hear that, I was really hoping you would be back in business....one last question, did this happen immediately after the service was done on that engine...or did it come up later?
Sorry to hear that, I was really hoping you would be back in business....one last question, did this happen immediately after the service was done on that engine...or did it come up later?
FloridaRob
30 Grady Marlin
250 ETECS
this problem appeared after other repair work had been completed.
the history, as best i can remember:
repair and maint work by dealer 1 in early 09
mid february - blew stbd hub off miami - 1 st time out after repairs by dealer 1
fixed and blew stbd hub 2 more times - took prop to shop and did prop swap myself
stbd hub blew on trip to keys - bought a used prop for replacement
port hub blows next day on same keys trip
drop off boat @ dealer # 1 - boat sits for 3 weeks untouched, different excuse every day.
pick up boat from dealer 1 (untouched) and take to dealer 2
--notice - no overheating - just blowing hubs ---
dealer 2 changes both water pumps - thermostats - zincs - gaskets - ect, says that dealer 1 had both water pumps installed improperly. went for a seatrail, ran at least 10 miles, everything ran good. "blown hubs were caused by lack of proper gasket installed under trim "fin"" i assume this refers to a prop hub cooling modification i have heard a rumor about?? anyway, everything seemed good.
fishing trip off lauderdale, 2 days after picking up boat, stbd engine dies, wont restart, get home on port - again, no port over heat.
drop boat off @ dealer # 2 - replace stbd emm and oil pump under warranty -- seatrail with dealer 2 mechanic -- stbd runs good, port overheats. remove poppet valve on seatrail - no more port overheat.
boat back to shop for poppet valve replacement under warranty
seatrail boat again - port over heats -- back to shop.
bitch and scream @ evinrude, they finally (takes 2 weeks) send local factory rep, who blames everything on "dirty water". so....remove all transducers (that have been in place since boat was new - 400hrs on old ficts, and 350hrs on these etecs) and add intake "clamshells" to inboard intakes.
seatrail again - port over heat again - and port engine will no longer shift @ end of seatrail, but did shift ok @ begining.
back 2 shop -- bla bla bla - fix lower unit shiftting problem under warranty - try some other overheat fix, dont remember what
seatrail again -- port still overheats -- stbd side blows prop hub !!!!
back 2 shop -- grasping @ straws --- swap lower units -- take to ramp -- run with clear hoses looking for water. dont really know out come as i was not there. recondition stbd hub, again.
back to shop - remove power head looking for blockage -- none found -- remove cylinder heads looking for blockage -- none found --- swap lower units back
seatrail again -- port overheats -- port lower unit will no go in gear @ end of seatrail, gears are wasted.
back to shop - replace lower unit under warranty - mechanic puts on new water pump and housing
seatrail again -- you guessed it !!!! port overheats
back to shop -- tear engine apart to replace water tube in mid housing.
seatrailed again yesterday 9/3/09 -- guess what -- port engine overheats
the only people that seem to care about this overheat issue are my mechanics - and im sure that is only because they want to get paid, and get my boat out of their shop.
does anyone have contact info for someone @ evinrude with the power to make a customer happy????
Last edited by slayride; 09-03-2009 at 12:39 PM.
Reason: add details
Have you been asked by the resident experts to provide your serial numbers yet? Also the only thing that would make me happy if I was in your shoes would be for them to disappear in the middle of the night.. considering they where fully insured. That is total b.s no matter what brand it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slayride
this problem appeared after other repair work had been completed.
the history, as best i can remember:
repair and maint work by dealer 1 in early 09
mid february - blew stbd hub off miami - 1 st time out after repairs by dealer 1
fixed and blew stbd hub 2 more times - took prop to shop and did prop swap myself
stbd hub blew on trip to keys - bought a used prop for replacement
port hub blows next day on same keys trip
drop off boat @ dealer # 1 - boat sits for 3 weeks untouched, different excuse every day.
pick up boat from dealer 1 (untouched) and take to dealer 2
--notice - no overheating - just blowing hubs ---
dealer 2 changes both water pumps - thermostats - zincs - gaskets - ect, says that dealer 1 had both water pumps installed improperly. went for a seatrail, ran at least 10 miles, everything ran good. "blown hubs were caused by lack of proper gasket installed under trim "fin"" i assume this refers to a prop hub cooling modification i have heard a rumor about?? anyway, everything seemed good.
fishing trip off lauderdale, 2 days after picking up boat, stbd engine dies, wont restart, get home on port - again, no port over heat.
drop boat off @ dealer # 2 - replace stbd emm and oil pump under warranty -- seatrail with dealer 2 mechanic -- stbd runs good, port overheats. remove poppet valve on seatrail - no more port overheat.
boat back to shop for poppet valve replacement under warranty
seatrail boat again - port over heats -- back to shop.
bitch and scream @ evinrude, they finally (takes 2 weeks) send local factory rep, who blames everything on "dirty water". so....remove all transducers (that have been in place since boat was new - 400hrs on old ficts, and 350hrs on these etecs) and add intake "clamshells" to inboard intakes.
seatrail again - port over heat again - and port engine will no longer shift @ end of seatrail, but did shift ok @ begining.
back 2 shop -- bla bla bla - fix lower unit shiftting problem under warranty - try some other overheat fix, dont remember what
seatrail again -- port still overheats -- stbd side blows prop hub !!!!
back 2 shop -- grasping @ straws --- swap lower units -- take to ramp -- run with clear hoses looking for water. dont really know out come as i was not there. recondition stbd hub, again.
back to shop - remove power head looking for blockage -- none found -- remove cylinder heads looking for blockage -- none found --- swap lower units back
seatrail again -- port overheats -- port lower unit will no go in gear @ end of seatrail, gears are wasted.
back to shop - replace lower unit under warranty - mechanic puts on new water pump and housing
seatrail again -- you guessed it !!!! port overheats
back to shop -- tear engine apart to replace water tube in mid housing.
seatrailed again yesterday 9/3/09 -- guess what -- port engine overheats
the only people that seem to care about this overheat issue are my mechanics - and im sure that is only because they want to get paid, and get my boat out of their shop.
does anyone have contact info for someone @ evinrude with the power to make a customer happy????
__________________ My Suzuki 200's have tons of Torque, please no more lame talk about having to change the oil. Fish On...
boat goes to dealer number 3 on friday, with mechanic from dealer number 2, for review by top tech with fresh eyes. maybe the whole thing will fall off the trailer on the way to the next shop.
I can certainly understand your enthusiasm. Since I see your are in Broward has Dusky looked at your rig? I understand that they may be the largest dealer for BRP in the states.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slayride
boat goes to dealer number 3 on friday, with mechanic from dealer number 2, for review by top tech with fresh eyes. maybe the whole thing will fall off the trailer on the way to the next shop.
__________________ My Suzuki 200's have tons of Torque, please no more lame talk about having to change the oil. Fish On...
slayride you've said:--notice - no overheating - just blowing hubs ---
dealer 2 changes both water pumps - thermostats - zincs - gaskets - ect,
I've got two questions
1) whats was causing the hubs blowing all the time?
2) which gasket did dealer 2 change ?
Man I really feel for you I always thought when I repower ,I'll stay with Evinrude ,but lately I've notice that BRP is not trying to help the consumer, when there are cases like yours , so I will keep researching and every time I find my self a step further away from an E tec ,so much for trying to buy domestic products , wish you luck.
I think a test run with the clear hose in the EMM cooling circuit will show air bubbles in the cooling water. The trick is to find out when and at what speed they start, and if they start suddenly as the boat comes up on plane, or if they steadily increase as the rpm's climb.
Water pressures should be monitored at those rpms also.
It sounds like the first dealer did not replace the round rubber gaskets that belong under the trim tab and that is what caused diminished cooling water to the prop hubs. They are only used on the Magnum gearcases.
__________________ ----------------
*... personally possessing more tools than talent !
__________________________________________________ _
Exactly, the gaskets i did not replace, they werent there in the first place so had to add them. every single cooling componet has been changed, I ran the motor without the pop it valve with same result so that needs to stop being asked about, sensors are out of the equasion because the motor is honest to god getting hot, computer and temp gun verify, New intake scoops, New gearcase, water pump kit, water tube, water tube grommett, exhaust adapter, adapter fittings, new overflow indicator, new thermostats, new pressure relief valve seal, spring and grommett, pulled every cooling hose off of motor and ran wire pipe cleaners in and out both directions, cleaned every cooling fitting from emm, fuel pump and block ports, pulled head and inspected with clean results. toe in is perfect 27 1/2 from steering eye to eye, no transducers on hull. No answers and no results so thats the bottom line, so any questions read the above then post. Not trying to insult anyone just understant the frustration of not making a customer happy, having your ass chewed by your boss non stop and having to scratch your head and wonder why Evinrude a company you have based your career on has basicly sold a motor with a 5 or 6 year warranty then halfway through just says ooooooh that motor is in "extended warranty and we cant help you" which is the most B.S. answer ever, when I buy a car the warranty is through and through until the warranty expires not halfway through you get a oh well your in extended warranty and things now change. I have had asked for help and exchange they turned their backs on me and gave me no answers, the motor will be fixed i gurantee that if it kills me, bankrupts me or makes me lose my certifications for saying something unpopular
You are a patient man. We have very good consumer protection laws here in Massachusetts. I would have called my lawyer months ago. I've been thinking about a pair of new 300 E-Tecs, but I think I'll wait until I see how this pans out... Good luck. BTW - This does not sound like it is a typical problem, and it sounds like your mechanic is quite capable, sometimes there are things going on inside an engine that arn't easily diagnosed, possible an overheat caused a warp, crack, etc. BRP should step up to the plate for you.
Last edited by FishingManiac; 09-03-2009 at 06:10 PM.
The only thing left could be E-10 fuel or a rigging issue. I would be pissed beyond words, but I am only a basher. So has Dusky had a shot at it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by OUTBOARDKILLER
Exactly, the gaskets i did not replace, they werent there in the first place so had to add them. every single cooling componet has been changed, I ran the motor without the pop it valve with same result so that needs to stop being asked about, sensors are out of the equasion because the motor is honest to god getting hot, computer and temp gun verify, New intake scoops, New gearcase, water pump kit, water tube, water tube grommett, exhaust adapter, adapter fittings, new overflow indicator, new thermostats, new pressure relief valve seal, spring and grommett, pulled every cooling hose off of motor and ran wire pipe cleaners in and out both directions, cleaned every cooling fitting from emm, fuel pump and block ports, pulled head and inspected with clean results. toe in is perfect 27 1/2 from steering eye to eye, no transducers on hull. No answers and no results so thats the bottom line, so any questions read the above then post. Not trying to insult anyone just understant the frustration of not making a customer happy, having your ass chewed by your boss non stop and having to scratch your head and wonder why Evinrude a company you have based your career on has basicly sold a motor with a 5 or 6 year warranty then halfway through just says ooooooh that motor is in "extended warranty and we cant help you" which is the most B.S. answer ever, when I buy a car the warranty is through and through until the warranty expires not halfway through you get a oh well your in extended warranty and things now change. I have had asked for help and exchange they turned their backs on me and gave me no answers, the motor will be fixed i gurantee that if it kills me, bankrupts me or makes me lose my certifications for saying something unpopular
__________________ My Suzuki 200's have tons of Torque, please no more lame talk about having to change the oil. Fish On...
Now the E-tecs over all I have had huge sucess with, the only problems are in the first few years of a model, Example these motors im working on are the 2nd year of E-tec,... And id pick the 250 H.O. over the 300, 1,000 cheaper but the exact same motor. 3.4 Cu inches. Yes these motors are something crazy but i hear ten times worse stuff with other models, Verados snapping cranks and shooting the flywheel out of the cowling into the boat with the customer, Yamaha Four strokes being shifted from forward to reverse too quickly and sucking water up into number 1 and 2 and locking the motors up. Im a big fan of 2 strokes and the advancements that Evinrude has made. dont get me wrong I love some Evinrudes.
This is a crazy story and feel your frustration. The blown hubs blows me away....I don't understand how that could be happening. Forgive me if it's a dumb question, but since you've been all over the cooling side, it there anyway something on the exhaust side could be causing this???? Restrictions letting exhaust gas transfer too much heat to the metal...??? Would too hot exhaust cause the hubs to get soft and blow out..???
The only thing left could be E-10 fuel or a rigging issue. I would be pissed beyond words, but I am only a basher. So has Dusky had a shot at it?
i called larry @ dusky and he did not want to get into the middle of the issue. i totally understand his position. he did lots of great work for me on the previous set of ficts on this boat.
This is a crazy story and feel your frustration. The blown hubs blows me away....I don't understand how that could be happening. Forgive me if it's a dumb question, but since you've been all over the cooling side, it there anyway something on the exhaust side could be causing this???? Restrictions letting exhaust gas transfer too much heat to the metal...??? Would too hot exhaust cause the hubs to get soft and blow out..???
your question needs to be addressed by the techs. dont know if that has been checked.
the hubs were not being cooled properly because of a missing gasket @ trim "fin" (according to the explanations i got)
an oil pump problem would also cause things to get hot????
does the evinrude software show how much oil is getting to the engine?
bent water tube has been replaced, engine still has exact same problems !!!!!
Since I see your are in Broward has Dusky looked at your rig? I understand that they may be the largest dealer for BRP in the states.
