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Random Quote: A boat without a ding or four is not being used
I will try to be as complete as possible. I am so frustrated at this point. My wife and I bought a 1996 Grady White 192, which has the original 96 Evinrude 150 Ocean Pro. We love the boat and both the boat and motor appeared to be very lightly used. We took it directly to the shop to have a bunch of preventative maintenance done. We had the spark plugs changed, compression checked, new lower unit oil, new water pump, impeller, thermostats. We also ended up replacing the voltage meter. The motor has run rough at low speeds since the day we test drove it. It does it at no wake zone speeds. We had an over heating problem that took us back and forth to the shop several times. We spent approx. 1600 on the engine. We were told the motor was in good shape and should last us for many years if serviced properly etc. Last weekend when we got ready to leave the island we were visiting I couldn't get the engine to start. We eventually ended up getting a tow to a friends dock. We left the boat over night b/c I wanted to try it the following day just to make sure it wasn't simply flooded? The next morning, it still would not start. It would turn over, but would never fire. So, we took it to a local marina. At first look, the head mechanic thought it was the carbs gummed up. He said there was a float needle that prevented too much gas from getting in the engine. But, apparently the carbs being gummed up prevented the needle from working properly. This made since to me because we had the suspicion our carbs needed cleaning b/c from day one it has run a little rough at no wake zone speeds (sends a vibration through the boat which goes away when the next level of jets kick in?). However, I got a call from the mechanic today saying it was not a carb problem at this point, it was an ignition part that wasn't a big deal. He went on to tell me the lower unit oil was more water than oil. So, at this point they recommended all new seals in the lower unit. He also stated they found significant metal shavings stuck to some magnet. He called back later stating the metal shavings were coming from the gears. He said they were pitting? and recommended I replace them. He didn't know how long they would last, could be one trip out or six months of trips out but he didn't expect them to last much any longer than six months. That gear box is 1200. Now, I don't know what to do. It was not clear to me if the new gear box included the new seals b/c just the seals were going to cost me 450. And, since the carbs didn't get cleaned, I fear I will still need to have that done soon too it get it running smoothly. Also, I know the trim/tilt motor will need replacing before next season. A new motor will cost me over 12000 installed and I am not in a position to do that. I guess my questions are.....does this make sense? I had the lower unit oil replaced in May or June and they didn't say anything to me about metal shavings in the oil (different mechanic). How long will the gears last once they start shaving? Do I need to have them replaced now? The engine had good compression in May.....how much life should remain on the engine? Can I get 3 to 5 years out of this engine if I replace the gears? Any advice would be very helpful. Thank you in advance for your time.
Where do we start ,man it sound to me like you don't know much about boats and that's not a crime ,I don't know a lot my self ,the way I see it with out offending anybody ,your boat might be at a place that don't have a lot of work.
Well to your questions ,a little bit of shaving coming from the lower it's not a big deal ,I will tell the shop to fix your starting problem and replace the LU oil then go home and get your self a Seloc or Clymer repair manual for around $30 ,run the boat and check the LU oil again but do it your self and then go from there, when ever you feel something wrong with the motor go to you repair manual then come to THT and ask questions then find a mechanic by recommendations.
Note I'm not even telling you to fix it your self ,because your probably not mechanically inclined but don't throw money on the motor just like that ,You've got your self a very reliable motor ,if you read a repair manual you'll find out that you can do a lot your self and save lots of money ,that motor is real simple and easy to work on ,but if you don't think you can do it at least get informed before you take it to the shop, my $.02
Agree with SeaHawk. I'm a bit skeptical about a shop that's recommending replacing the drive on a motor that's not running. I too think I would want to verify that water is indeed getting into the drive. Easy to pull the lower drive drain bolt and sample the oil.
I have this motor and it has been very reliable.
You also might post on one of the Forums that focuses specifically on Johnsons (google Johnson Outboard Forum).
I find it strange that the first mec change the oil in the lower unit oil and did not see water and now you have tons of water, need seals and even need to replace the gears?
Swade I have a 1996 200 ocean runner ,It never missed a beat in 13 years ,fuel economy compare to a 4 stroke is not worth the trade, but reliability and practically maintenance free will beat all four strokes and DFI ,now if I had the money to blow on a new boat and the time to justified the new technology of course I'll do it, but since money doesn't grow on trees .I'll stick to reliability and simplicity.
Based on what I am reading, fact that older two-strokes never ran good at slow speeds, the age of the motor, the reputation of Evinrude etc....
Get a new Yamaha, Honda or Suzuki four-stroke. You are beating a dead horse.
Will you help with at least the 10% or MORE for the down payment? ,if so then your comment has some value .
please read the hole thread before you post the next time.
I had a 1999 225. They are bulletproof, just smokey and thirsty. I would get a second opinion. My plug ALWAYS had some shavings on it from the day I bought it new until I traded it in 9 years (and running perfect) later. I am suspeciuos(sp?), get another mechanic to check it out.
Based on what I am reading, fact that older two-strokes never ran good at slow speeds, the age of the motor, the reputation of Evinrude etc....
Get a new Yamaha, Honda or Suzuki four-stroke. You are beating a dead horse.
It is not a Ficht. I hate it when people talk out out of their AZZs. The 60 deg v6 was and is a simple/ reliable and bullet proof motor. One of the best ever made. 2 and 3 thousand hrs is NOT uncommon.
I have a 96 150 OP 930 hrs and reliable until I had some ethanol issues now resolved. It will never run like a sewing machine, but I can help.
Have the LU pressure tested and replace seals. Shavings are not uncommon and occur because of wear. That`s why the plug is magnetic!
The gear lube being compromised does concern me. Go to a BRP factory shop. Where are you?
Mine also idled a little rough up to 1800. I`ve had the boat 2 years. Search here for Dunk`s decarb procedure. Do this every 50 hrs. Most of the failures of these motors occurs because the bottom ring gets hung up on carbon and the ring land explodes. Disconect the oil side of the VRO and premix 50-1. No cheap oil. Startron for e 10. You must use Champion QL series suppresion plugs or you may cause interference with the powerpack!!!! It calls for QL 78yc gapped at .030. It still idled a little rough. I called Monty Racing , who can build the snot out of these blocks. Try QL 77jc4 plugs @ .030 and let me know. Mine now idles beautifully. What are your compression #s measured with motor COLD.
I GREW UP IN THE `60s AND 70`S AND THE "OLD" 2 STROKES IDLED , AND RAN JUST FINE!!!
GFS
My buddy had a 94 ocean pro 175, and yeah it smokes and idles rough compared to the 4 stroke on the back of my rig, but it has been 100% reliable and he bought from a guy who lived across the road from me. Looked great, but I am like most on here tht believe it's probably worse on a motor to sit and not be run than to have 1000 hrs on it.
I also agree that if you look like a complete novice to some of the mechanics they will be tempted to try and sell you more than you need. Get the manual and familarize yourself with the motor.
Then don't be afraid to call BS if the guys working on it, always seem to find a laundry list of things.
I would tell you that LU seals can go out at any time, fishing line is a major culprit, but if a motor sits and sits, and the seals are not stressed then all of a sudden it's running again, the stress on the seals may cause damage as seal material has deteriated.
The motor itself is dependable, but I'd ask around for dependable mechanic.
Based on what I am reading, fact that older two-strokes never ran good at slow speeds, the age of the motor, the reputation of Evinrude etc....
Get a new Yamaha, Honda or Suzuki four-stroke. You are beating a dead horse.
This is actually the worst advice you could possibly give for this boat....Older grady's were designed to run on 2 stroke power....not a heavy 4 stroke. I know, we bought ours with a fresh set of Yam 4 strokes and wound up repowering her due to warranty issues, what a huge difference..... The older carbed 2 stroke engines, even though they smoke and suck fuel, are much much more reliable than today's high tech engines, there are many threads on here that discuss (mechanics included) that today's engines are designed to run 6-7 years efficiently, and that's about it...I mean check out the threads on the yamaha F225 corrosion issues that are popping up everywhere.....
I agree with what's already been stated, you need to find a new mechanic....those older rudes and johnsons were great engines if you could deal with a little smoke at slower speeds......Save your money, find a good mechanic through a forum, possibly evinrude or johnson forum and run her till she dies...which will probably be a long time.
Once up and running well, switching over to a synthetic oil like Pennzoil will also help with carbon build up and smoke, extending the life of the engine...
take the lower unit back to the first mechanic with the report from the second mechanic and see if the first mechanic agrees with that report. look for a used lower unit and get it checked out if you really need a new one. if the carbs are clean, stop worrying about them, just run some additives.
that was a pretty stupid thing for 10% more to say
__________________ Top Gun 1992 Donzi 22 Classic 454 King Cobra
A couple of people mention something about rust on A Yamaha and it is suddenly an epidemic of Ficht proportions. There have also been threads about rust on other motors including.... Etecs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by floridarob
This is actually the worst advice you could possibly give for this boat....Older grady's were designed to run on 2 stroke power....not a heavy 4 stroke. I know, we bought ours with a fresh set of Yam 4 strokes and wound up repowering her due to warranty issues, what a huge difference..... The older carbed 2 stroke engines, even though they smoke and suck fuel, are much much more reliable than today's high tech engines, there are many threads on here that discuss (mechanics included) that today's engines are designed to run 6-7 years efficiently, and that's about it...I mean check out the threads on the yamaha F225 corrosion issues that are popping up everywhere.....
I agree with what's already been stated, you need to find a new mechanic....those older rudes and johnsons were great engines if you could deal with a little smoke at slower speeds......Save your money, find a good mechanic through a forum, possibly evinrude or johnson forum and run her till she dies...which will probably be a long time.
Once up and running well, switching over to a synthetic oil like Pennzoil will also help with carbon build up and smoke, extending the life of the engine...
FloridaRob
30 Grady Marlin
250 Etecs
__________________ My Suzuki 200's have tons of Torque, please no more lame talk about having to change the oil. Fish On...
Lets not hijack this thread, the guy needs information on his 1996 Evinrude, not which brand is better then other, if you want to start a new thread go for .
When it comes to your motor it really doesn't matter much whether those 60 degree Eagle Series motors have a great reputation or not. You'll always find some folks who swear by them while others swear at them. Even these motors weren't designed to last forever. True, the technology involved with these motors is very simple especially compared with the engines they build today, but 13 years of salt water punctuated by extended periods of inactivity is going take its toll on any motor no matter what the reputation. And if the previous owner(s) took good care of your motor then it should run well for a long, long time. Unfortunately, most folks rode 'em hard & put 'em up wet.
With that being said, you must decide whether your motor is worth saving. A couple of guys recommended you buy a service manual. That is excellent advice. The OMC manual, around $25.00 on eBay, beats the others hands down. The OMC manual for this motor focuses only on the Eagle Series motors (150's & 175's) & can walk anyone with a basic mechanical knowledge through a total rebuild of that motor & gearcase. Parts for that motor are still readily available & can be obtained online. The bottom line is things are going to continue to break on that motor, but if you can do some of the work yourself you might still come out ahead. Things like the water pumps, thermostats, fuel filters, etc., are very simple maintenance items that could have saved you significant amounts of money had you done them yourself. The gearcase is pretty much plug-n-play if you buy a remanufactured unit. It's not difficult if you follow the directions in the service manual. Rebuilding those carbs is simple, there again, if you follow the directions in the service manual & the BRP kits are cheap. Lastly, replacing the tilt/trim motor is relatively easy as well. Just make sure it's not an issue with the relays, switches, or wiring first. The last time I bought one of those motors it cost almost $200.00.
In conclusion, if you want a maintenance free, hit the key & go motor then I would save my money & buy a new one. Otherwise, I'd buy a manual & make a commitment to do at least some of the maintenance myself.
Last edited by superbee69; 08-24-2009 at 05:24 AM.
Tech should pressure and vacumn test the gear case. should hold 15lb.
Gearcase teardown not needed to replace the seals. BRP has special tool to remove the seals.
More info after gearcase fixed. Check waterpump before reinstall of gear case. You get the correct waterpump by using the engine model number.
Advise on 1996 Evinrude Ocean Pro & Grady White 
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