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while I am waiting for the wind to come around and knock the chop down a little I decided to go ahead and swap the plugs. Do these look normal to you guys?
I am used to plugs that look drier than that, but the ones from this motor always look this way. When they're not fouled, and they haven't fouled since I fixed the poppit valve and raised the motor. Is this normal, or does it indicate too much oil in the mix?
This is probably the worst of the lot, which I don't think is too bad:
Anyhow, I put a clean, recently sandblasted and regapped set in.
That's pretty much what the plugs on our 250 HPDI look like when I change them after a 100 or so hours. Ours actually look a little grungier, wetter, etc. eventhough the engine runs great. I have never had a plug fouling problem with our engine in over 900 hours. Looking forward to hearing what the YDS comes up with.
Okay, so these are not totally out of line, I guess. Thanks. I was wondering.
Wind is forecast to lie down a bit this afternoon between now and 4:00...so I am going to try to get the boat out for a test run. The only changes I have made since getting my care package from SIM is to change the canister filter and the plugs. I am still trying to make one change at a time so I can identify which one fixes this.
I had it running in a garbage can full of water late yesterday. No real info here, but the YDS was saying:
I did the static tests, and could hear all the injectors firing, etc. I don't have a spark gap tester, so couldn't do that one.
It was going well until I increased the RPM a little bit to see what that TPS did, and blew the handle out of my industrial strength plastic garbage can. It got real loud real suddenly when that exhaust got un-submerged..
It had gotten up to 138 degrees in the can, and the plastic got soft and bowed out to the point where that solid fiberglass rod for the truck's lift system came right out. I had a heck of a time getting it back in with the can emptied and the plastic cooled and back in shape without the bow.
Those plugs are brutal and are only fit for the bin. Plugs leaving your engine should not be cleaned and reused as this is false economy. I know parts are hard for you to get but if the basics are not right than you will never have a healthy engine. I cannot believe that I steered you towards the pump when you were using those plugs and the same canister filter. These items would be the first stop in any fault finding as they are service items and therefore should be changed as a matter of course. I live in the west of Ireland and have to order all my parts from the US to save getting ripped off and waiting for some local numpty to get them in as no parts are stocked here so I can empathise with you on this score.
__________________ Thabhair dom an airgead agus beidh se cosuil le nua.
Those plugs have less than ten hours on them. I can't see any reason not to clean and re-gap plugs. these are not high tech items. It's just a spark. nothing more. It's all about the distance between two pieces of metal.
Put it this way, if I have to change spark plugs every ten hours....this HPDI is history. I'll give it away. That is totally unacceptable.
We took the boat out yesterday afternoon briefly. There were severe rain squalls all around us, so I did not take the laptop. But I couldn't stand it anymore. I wanted to see if it ran any better.
And it did. We were able to run at 4900-5000 RPM fairly reliably. I did shove the throttle all the way, after about a minute or two at 5000, and it started missing and bogging down. Then we had to turn around and head back. With gray skies and rain and wind, I can't see where the coral heads are. I did run it back up to 4900 RPM on the way back in, over a known clear sand section, and it did okay as long as I did not go full throttle. This is an improvement, from 3000 to 5000 RPM.
While waiting on weather, I installed the second Racor filter. Now the fuel runs through a 10 micron, and then a 2 micron. When I took the 10 micron out to move it to a new location in the bilge, I could see all this stuff floating in the clear separation bowl. There was about a half inch of water, but what was interesting was the stuff in the water. It looked like some kind of mucuous or something. When I tapped the side of the filter with my hand, I could see little flakes that looked like clear snow falling down from the filter into the settlement bowl. I have no idea what this stuff is. But now, there are three settlement bowls between the fuel tank and the pumps.
I am hoping to get back out with the YDS hooked up this afternoon.
Those plugs have less than ten hours on them. I can't see any reason not to clean and re-gap plugs. these are not high tech items. It's just a spark. nothing more. It's all about the distance between two pieces of metal.
Put it this way, if I have to change spark plugs every ten hours....this HPDI is history. I'll give it away. That is totally unacceptable.
We took the boat out yesterday afternoon briefly. There were severe rain squalls all around us, so I did not take the laptop. But I couldn't stand it anymore. I wanted to see if it ran any better.
And it did. We were able to run at 4900-5000 RPM fairly reliably. I did shove the throttle all the way, after about a minute or two at 5000, and it started missing and bogging down. Then we had to turn around and head back. With gray skies and rain and wind, I can't see where the coral heads are. I did run it back up to 4900 RPM on the way back in, over a known clear sand section, and it did okay as long as I did not go full throttle. This is an improvement, from 3000 to 5000 RPM.
While waiting on weather, I installed the second Racor filter. Now the fuel runs through a 10 micron, and then a 2 micron. When I took the 10 micron out to move it to a new location in the bilge, I could see all this stuff floating in the clear separation bowl. There was about a half inch of water, but what was interesting was the stuff in the water. It looked like some kind of mucuous or something. When I tapped the side of the filter with my hand, I could see little flakes that looked like clear snow falling down from the filter into the settlement bowl. I have no idea what this stuff is. But now, there are three settlement bowls between the fuel tank and the pumps.
I am hoping to get back out with the YDS hooked up this afternoon.
Have you checked the specs on the throttle posistion sensor to see if they are correct thru WOT? Just a thought from you saying this.
Sounds like you are making progress and I do agree with one thing at a time to figure out the culprit here. That crap in the filters would cause issues for sure but still I wonder about the TPS.
__________________ 2007 Lowe FM 185
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I am now thinking that it's just not worth it. I am going to get the boat running as well as I can, fresh filters and plugs, and sell it for a song.
And buy another panga with a carbed two stroke.
That 25 Contender will ride fantastic with a 250 Yahama ( 2 stroke, non hpdi), easy to work on and very reliable. You'll enjoy the flexability the hull gives you over the Panga. Rigging will be the same, and a great match for the hull.
Those plugs have less than ten hours on them. I can't see any reason not to clean and re-gap plugs. these are not high tech items. It's just a spark. nothing more. It's all about the distance between two pieces of metal.
Put it this way, if I have to change spark plugs every ten hours....this HPDI is history. I'll give it away. That is totally unacceptable.
We took the boat out yesterday afternoon briefly. There were severe rain squalls all around us, so I did not take the laptop. But I couldn't stand it anymore. I wanted to see if it ran any better.
And it did. We were able to run at 4900-5000 RPM fairly reliably. I did shove the throttle all the way, after about a minute or two at 5000, and it started missing and bogging down. Then we had to turn around and head back. With gray skies and rain and wind, I can't see where the coral heads are. I did run it back up to 4900 RPM on the way back in, over a known clear sand section, and it did okay as long as I did not go full throttle. This is an improvement, from 3000 to 5000 RPM.
While waiting on weather, I installed the second Racor filter. Now the fuel runs through a 10 micron, and then a 2 micron. When I took the 10 micron out to move it to a new location in the bilge, I could see all this stuff floating in the clear separation bowl. There was about a half inch of water, but what was interesting was the stuff in the water. It looked like some kind of mucuous or something. When I tapped the side of the filter with my hand, I could see little flakes that looked like clear snow falling down from the filter into the settlement bowl. I have no idea what this stuff is. But now, there are three settlement bowls between the fuel tank and the pumps.
I am hoping to get back out with the YDS hooked up this afternoon.
Hi Gringo,
Before you give up, please try one last thing.
1- Remove the additional 2 micron filter you previously added since this filter may be starving your engine for fuel which is why it bogs at higher RPM's.
2- Run it WOT from a clean remote fuel tank after you remove the 2 mic filter. Use clean fuel from a different gas station that you normally buy from.
You may have fixed the problem during previous attempts but caused a new issue with simialr symptoms by adding the 2 mic filter.
Good luck.
Hi Gringo,
Before you give up, please try one last thing.
1- Remove the additional 2 micron filter you previously added since this filter may be starving your engine for fuel which is why it bogs at higher RPM's.
2- Run it WOT from a clean remote fuel tank after you remove the 2 mic filter. Use clean fuel from a different gas station that you normally buy from.
You may have fixed the problem during previous attempts but caused a new issue with simialr symptoms by adding the 2 mic filter.
Good luck.
awsome feed back guys as a twin 300 hpdi owner this thread
has been a god send My latest problems were the low pressure pumps
a little pin hole dumping fuel into the crank case fouling plugs
and decreased power I also found out the tps likes to be set on the upper end of spec 6.0 6.1
a panga at your age will turn you off from boating
you have a awsome rig and are close to fixing it !
Gringo, that mucous you describe may be salt water entering your gas tank. My aluminum tank vent developed a small hole, and occasionally salt water would get in there. I would even filter the gas before it went in my tank like you have, with the special filter that catches water before it can go in the tank.
I'd take my Racor assembly apart, and my bowl would have this flem like substance, and my filter would have some light brown goo around it. My carbed 2 stroke would act funny at times (loss of power randomly). I hooked up a Pony tank and low and behold it it ran fine. So I now have a new external 26 gallon tank, problem solved (old aluminum tank encased by foam, I just drained it). BTW, big fan of your blog.
Well, I just spent the past two hours trying to see if I could even find the fuel tank. I removed the leaning post, and then all the screws around that big piece of decking that covers everything from the console to the transom. No go. Couldn't pry it up with flat pry bars, and I pryed pretty hard. I guess it's glued in or something. Makes me wonder why all the screws. It wouldn't budge without them.
So I gave up on that idea and put it all back together. I am not even sure the fuel tank is under that section. It could be under the console for all I know.
And while all these thoughts of running it on an external tank are academically interesting, the fact is that a six gallon tank wouldn't get me from one fuel station to the next with this beast. It gets about 2 mpg.
Right now I would trade it for a Carolina Skiff with a tiller outboard. Or a Hobie Cat on a trailer...
The fun started going out of continuously working on this thing some weeks ago. I would kinda like to just go fishing for a change.
You know, a daily driver kind of boat.
I haven't owned a motor this touchy since my 73 Norton 750 Commando. I had to tweak that bike as much as I rode it. An hour's tweaking was good for about an hour's riding.
Plugs are a small bit more complicated than you think. Lots of factors can affect their life like in your situation an engine running lean. Excessive heat etc will greatly affect the life of a plug and cleaning them will not be sufficient. Have a look on the ngk website if you need to compare your plug condition with a picture.
__________________ Thabhair dom an airgead agus beidh se cosuil le nua.
And while all these thoughts of running it on an external tank are academically interesting, the fact is that a six gallon tank wouldn't get me from one fuel station to the next with this beast. It gets about 2 mpg.
1) The external tank is to prove that the problem is with your fuel tank, not the engine.
2) The fuel tank is most likely under the deck glassed in.
