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Old 04-28-2008, 09:09 AM
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Default Startron or Stabil Marine?

I'm putting this in an eTec 115.

Does it really mater? My season is short here and we have many cold mornings so we do get condensation. Stabilzer is not an option around here but something I use in every tank. I always used Stabil in my Merc carbed 2 stroke and it worked great, but now that I've jumped ahead in technology about 5 generations I'm wondering if I need to change course.

I'd like to hear your experience or what you use.

Tom
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Old 04-28-2008, 10:06 AM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Startron is what I use here to combat the effects of ethanol
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Old 04-28-2008, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Startron is crap. It does 10% of what it claims.. no manufacturer's service rep will recommend this to you. Stabil will suffice...
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Old 04-28-2008, 01:08 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Pri-G Treats more for the money and works very good even on old gas. I use it and Pri-D for diesels in all my equipment.
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Old 05-05-2008, 11:41 AM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Greg, Star Tron treats exactly the same amount of gas as Pri-G - both products in the 32 ounce size treat 512 gallons of gas.

Ohiolove - - did we run over your cat ort something? Which 10% works? By the way, we've had a bunch of service reps tell us they recommend Star Tron.
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Old 05-05-2008, 12:11 PM
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Default RE: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Here we go again.....

To quote from an earlier thread on the subject (search for Snake Oil):



Quote:
JackB - 11/1/2007 4:08 AM Matthew, I appreciate your taking the time to provide some answers about Startron on the forum. As long as you are here perhaps you could address the following statement made by a competitor. I am sure, being in the business, you are aware who it is but I did not copy the complete test results as they included the name brand of that competitor and I was not looking at giving them advertising since you are the one who was willing to step up to the plate. Keep in mind while you have all the expertise of an engineer many of the rest of us are just trying to sort through all the claims and find the best product to use with our engines. Anyway, here is the statement should you care to comment; Soltron, also re-packaged as Startron, is composed of odorless mineral spirits, a form of high-grade kerosene. Soltron makes the bold claim that the product contains biological enzymes that "eat" impurities in fuel including microorganisms, hence improve fuel stability. Fact is, enzymes are amino acids - not living organisms that "eat". Chemically, amino acids are typically not capable of surviving in a hydrocarbon base, including petroleum fuels. While Soltron provides "testimonials" from individual users regarding product effectiveness, independent laboratory testing for fuel stability tells a completely different story. We had Soltron independently tested by Saybolt - Core Laboratory, a well respected international petroleum testing laboratory that routinely conducts petroleum testing for major refiners. The industry standard ASTM-D2274 testing provided the following results. In summary, Soltron failed to improve fuel stability. In fact, it made the fuel, a California Air Resources Board mandated low-sulfur diesel (0.02%), less stable.


I've yet to see any scientifically valid evidence that this stuff (or most any additive) works. But, if it makes you feel good about pampering your engine, by all means, go ahead. I've done so myself at times. Call me a sucker, but it felt good....
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Old 05-05-2008, 12:55 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I use both.
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Old 05-05-2008, 02:00 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Quote:
billatstarbrite - 5/5/2008 2:41 PM

Greg, Star Tron treats exactly the same amount of gas as Pri-G - both products in the 32 ounce size treat 512 gallons of gas.

Ohiolove - - did we run over your cat ort something? Which 10% works? By the way, we've had a bunch of service reps tell us they recommend Star Tron.
Didn't know that....I knew it was much more economical than Stabil. Startron is probably easier to find than Pri-G. Thanks

Stevens....I have diesel farm tanks that sit outside year round and you can believe the Pri-D works, noticeable difference in filter change for water and start ups.
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Old 05-05-2008, 02:40 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I use Startron in my diesel and in my outboard. I've been running diesel over 2 years old with no problems. Both engines seem to run better with it so either it effects the running quality or has a psychological effect upon me or maybe both. Run it in the lawn mower also! Cranks first pull almost every time.
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Old 05-05-2008, 03:00 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Just to clarify; I'm not saying additives like Startron or Stabil or Pri-D don't work. They might work just fine for all I know, I just haven't seen any hard evidence of such other than the many testimonials from users stating they notice a difference before & after. I didn't notice anything in my several engines (diesels and gas, 2-stroke and 4). But, then again, I like to think that I buy good gas from clean tanks and, unfortunately, at the rate my engine slurps it up, it never gets a chance to grow very old.
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Old 05-05-2008, 04:34 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I use neither during the season. I only stabilize (w PRI-G) the fuel when the boat gets pulled in early Dec.. She gets launched in April, and I've never had a problem. IMO, Startron and those other products are snake oil. If you have more than a few teaspoons of water in your fuel, you are getting it from somewhere else not from the Ethanol type Gas sucking it in from the air.
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Old 05-05-2008, 05:17 PM
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Default RE: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I have used E-Zorb by MDR and have never had an ethanol/water related problem.
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Old 05-09-2008, 11:19 AM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Glad to hear E-Zorb is working for you. Just so you know, it's an emulsifier, while Star Tron is an enzyme-based de-emulsifier and Pri-G is a chemical-based additive (it's not an emulsifier, either). We make emulsifiers too, but we do not recommend them for use in E10 gas.

All three of these products have their fans, but they are three completely different products.
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Old 05-09-2008, 11:41 AM
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Default RE: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I just switched from regular Stabil to Stabil Marine formula. I don't have any evidence of any kind but Stabil has always worked for me.
The new Marine formula is supposed to clean fuel system and combat the affects of ethanal. My gut says to continue to trust Stabil.

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Old 05-09-2008, 12:17 PM
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Default RE: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Quote:
bmkshort - 5/9/2008 11:41 AM

I just switched from regular Stabil to Stabil Marine formula. I don't have any evidence of any kind but Stabil has always worked for me.
The new Marine formula is supposed to clean fuel system and combat the affects of ethanal. My gut says to continue to trust Stabil.
make that 2 of us.
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Old 05-09-2008, 12:59 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I at times feel like the advocate for PRI-G but I have absolutely no expertise in fuel additive and, like many folks on the forum, am just trying to wade through the claims. Billatstarbrite, I sure wish that you would elaborate on your statement about the actual differences in the products, especially between PRI-G and Startron. Especially when it comes to layup. The Startron site says; "In a boat that is being used regularly, Star TronŽ prevents most phase separation that occurs from daily condensation." What about a boat that is laid up for several months. I would not mind seeing test results from an independent labratory, something that PRI-G offers as in the most recent posting on their website as follows;
IMPORTANT UPDATE: PRI-G Proven to Inhibit Phase Separation in E-10 Gasoline

The results are in. Independent laboratory tests by Intertek Caleb Brett confirm PRI-G capability to inhibit phase separation in E-10 gasoline. First, water was progressively added to the E-10 gasoline to determine the point of phase separation. Then, a sample of the same fuel was treated with PRI-G, and the test repeated. Not only did phase separation not occur, PRI-G continued to work as additional water was added.

Test Fuel % Water Added Results
E-10 Untreated 0.5 Fail - Phase Separation
E-10 PRI-G Treated 0.5 Pass - Clear and Bright
E-10 PRI-G Treated 0.6 Pass - Clear and Bright
E-10 PRI-G Treated 0.7 Pass - Clear and Bright

PRI-G contains no harsh alcohol components and is completely safe to use in all engine types.

I have my questions about that test as well as I don't know at what level we could expect phase separation or at what point PRI-G failed. Many of us are worried about the winter layup period and whether to keep tanks full or empty. You also mention that E-Zorb is an emulsifier not suitable for ethanol gas but I noticed at the marine store that there is now a separate E-zorb specifically for E-10. Is that also an emulsifier? The only good news I have heard is a consortium of 24 senators that want to roll back the mandatory ethanol usage.

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Old 05-09-2008, 01:09 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

I use Stabil Marine formula for every fillup. I keep the tanks full too - as I had problems with another boat in regards to water in the fuel. I was told to keep the tanks full and the condensation would not be able to form as there would be no room for air. Seemed logical to me so I started doing it Never had a water problem again.

Now I fill up every time after using the boat, adding Stabil Marine.

Sometimes, just because I like to possibly waste money, I dump a pint of Sea Foam into each tank and run it through the engine

Do not know if it does any good, but it does not hurt either. So I do it. My spark plugs remain clean. Whatever that means.
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Old 05-09-2008, 02:38 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

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Old 05-09-2008, 05:51 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

Just try to find Evinrude 4+2. One of the E-Tec dealers here is using/pushing something else I've never even heard of.

No One carries the Evinrude stabilizer, and you can't ship the stuff without spending a fortune.

Tom
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Old 05-11-2008, 02:39 PM
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Default Re: Startron or Stabil Marine?

"I sure wish that you would elaborate on your statement about the actual differences in the products, especially between PRI-G and Startron. Especially when it comes to layup. The Startron site says; "In a boat that is being used regularly, Star TronŽ prevents most phase separation that occurs from daily condensation." What about a boat that is laid up for several months."

The biggest difference is simple: Star Tron uses enzymes to do what it does. Pri-G uses a chemical approach. No other product on the market (that we're aware of) uses enzymes. Enzymes keep working and can treat an inordinate volume (one ounce of our product treats 16 gallons) , while chemical approaches (and we make these, too) tend to be a "1 ounce treats x ounces" approach. There is nothing wrong with either approach, but you need to realize the difference. Pri-G and Star Tron and E-Zorb use completely different methodologies. Those who say they're all the same are incorrect.

Use whatever makes you feel best.

As for the layup question, our product will stabilize gasoline for up to 12 months, in addition to its other benefits (cleaning up carbon, making fuel burn more completely, treating moistures in fuel, etc etc).

Star Tron was not fomulated to pass ASTM tests, so we don't subject it to these tests. The enzyme base will not react as a chemical base will. That's why comparing it to a STP, Pri-G or any other additive is irrelevant.

MY comment about emulsifiers was only that we do not suggest them for use with E-10 gasoline.
E10 is a completely different animal than regular unadulterated gasoline.
We make emulsifiers and we actively use all of our products in our own boats and cars, so take that for whatever it's worth.
GM did extensive testing on emulsified gasoline (read SAE test #760547 for the details) and came to the conclusion the problems made it not worth pursuing.

No engine manufacturer will EVER endorse/suggest/recommend any additive that they do not make (or sell via a private label deal). Period.
Don't take that to mean the additive is or is not worthwhile. The stuff could be the greatest thing on the planet, but they can't say so in public. It would imply their engines are less than good-to-go from the factory for use on whatever gas you can buy. That would open up a can of worms that lawyers would crawl into, so it will never happen.
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