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Old 02-13-2008, 11:17 AM
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Default Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

I hope this will get somebody's attention. I just finished raising the motor on my third boat. The gelcoat was pulled off on all three. 3M 5200 and maybe 4200 are the problems. Stop it! This grinds my butt. 3M 101 works perfect for this. I cannot believe that professionals are mounting motors too low and using glue to seal them up. Clearly the people who make the decision to use 5200 this are not planning on ever taking that motor off the boat.
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:32 AM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Are you talking about the bolts or the the whole mounting bracket? When I raided my engines, I sealed my holes with 5200 but did not glue the bracket on at all - just a little black 101 around the seams to give it a "finished" look.
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:38 AM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

I've heard of 5200 pulling gelcoat off before. When I had my motor hung, I predrilled the holes slightly oversize and then sealed up the core with 2 coats of epoxy. Redrilled at the correct size and then used marine silicone to seal between the the bolts, the transom and the engine.

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Old 02-13-2008, 12:25 PM
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Default RE: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Just for clarification, I am just talking about sealing the bolt holes. When 5200 is used, I can pull out all the bolts and the motor is stuck. I am suprised there is no consenses on what sealants to use. Even on this forum, there are a lot of different opinions. 5200 is a adhesive/sealant and says it is permanent, which would exclude bolt holes.
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:27 PM
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Default RE: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

I had a new motor rigged that would have suited you vacottonking. I took it out to get the break-in done. Got a little water in the bilge Yep, they saved money by not using any sealant, none, zip I'm not sure what they used when I took it back, but it doesn't leak I hope the ex rigger was able to find work so he could buy more crack
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:54 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

On the tube of 5200 it says "Through-Hull Fittings". I can see why people would use it for anything going through the hull below the waterline do to their packaging.
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Old 02-13-2008, 01:12 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Just use 4200 and be done with it. 4200 will not rip the gelcoat off like the 5200.

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Old 02-13-2008, 01:31 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

The new 35' Everglades cabin boat I saw must have had 4 tubes of the shat between the three motors.......sloppiest job I've ever seen for 350K in boat.................
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Old 02-13-2008, 03:27 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

I recently pulled a Bennet trim tab off and the mounting plate was sealed with a black rubbery sealant. It was almost impossible to remove but some heat and a putty knife did the trick. Now I have to re-powdercoat the mounting plate because the sealant ripped the old coating off. Does 5200 come in black?
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Old 02-13-2008, 04:45 PM
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Default RE: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Riggers routinely rig outboards too deep so they don't get cavitation complaints. Fortunately, when my motors were hung on several years ago, they didn't use any 5200 to glue the motors to the bracket. I'm now running three holes higher and getting way better fuel mileage and somewhat higher top end speed. With bracketed motors, there no need to use any sealant on the OUTSIDE of the bracket at all. BTW, my bracket never leaks a drop inside.
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Old 02-13-2008, 05:53 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Yes, 5200 comes in black.... If I suspected that 5200 was the sealant in play, I'd use Kryptonite or other product designed specifically to neutralize the stuff before any prying. Friends of mine report that good old WD40 will give the same result if you spray it a few days before and repeat to keep the sealant wet... I haven't tried it myself, but have seen other petroleum based stuff turn 5200 into cream cheese (or at least that consistency).
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Old 02-13-2008, 07:18 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

The only things I use 5200 in are my inboard prop nuts instead of some type of thread locker and screws into fiberglass where the hole is a little enlarged over time. I use Life Caulk and Life Seal around the boat. That 5200 is shat in stupid folks hands. Oh that $hit should never be used on through-hulls no not ever. The next time you have to remove a through hull some knucklehead used 5200 on try a heat gun. That is the true kryptonite for 5200.
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Old 02-13-2008, 07:21 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

3M makes a release agent just for this. I'll look it up for yous
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Old 02-13-2008, 07:45 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

No they don't sorry
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Old 02-13-2008, 08:02 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

If you rig it right the first time, you can use 5200...makes certain that everything stays watertight forever and no chance of anything ever working loose from vibration, etc.
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Old 02-14-2008, 03:06 AM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Quote:
littletunny - 2/13/2008 4:12 PM Just use 4200 and be done with it. 4200 will not rip the gelcoat off like the 5200.
Exactly.

Check into 3M's product information. 4200 and 5200 have the same SEALANT properties. 5200 however is much more of anADHESIVE than 4200.

Your motor is fastened to boat mechanically. You don't need an ADHESIVE to holdthe motor on. You need a SEALANT to seal the bolt holes.
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Old 02-14-2008, 08:43 AM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

All my through hulls were done with 5200 and I just removed them with no issues or trouble at all. It only seems to be a problem with large surface areas (like my trim tab plates). A little bead around a through hull shouldnt be an issue at all.
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Old 02-14-2008, 08:54 AM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

Exactly, as long as you don't goop the crap out of the mounting bolts, it's no problem. All you need is a small ring around the holes and a little on the bolts and it's no problem removing the engines later if needed. Plus, 5200 is much more durable than any silicone. Try beating the crap out of a boat offshore all the time and I gauruntee the silicon will break loose from the mounting surface and allow water intrusion, not 5200. I always use 5200 on my boat, and my engines come off once a year, ya'll need to quit whining!
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Old 02-14-2008, 12:49 PM
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Default RE: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

3M 101 is not silicone. It is a polysulfide designed for sealing a mechanical connection (ie BOLTS). Perfect for sealing the bolt holes without pulling off gelcoat if you ever need to make a change.

I agree with one point that has been made by Sundance: "If you rig it right the first time, you can use 5200" That assumes also that the motor will never need replacing. I am sure there are some people who can apply 5200 in a manor that does not get it on the gelcoat in a way that it will not pull off the gelcoat for that occasional motor that either needs raising or needs replacing. But my limited experience tells me that most boats have the first motor put on too low, and most boats will eventually get a second motor. And most applications get enough on the gelcoat to cause it to pull off. So the exception is that it will not pull off the gelcoat but the rule is that 5200 is and adhesive and will pull off the gelcoat. Therefore 5200 is not the best option (I still say that 4200 is the wrong stuff as well since it is also an adhesive, but at least it is about half the strength of 5200)

Sure - gelcoat is not that hard to repair. And sure - no water is going to get through 5200.

But why not use a product like 3M 101 which is not silicone, and is for above and below the water line and will not come off and will not leak and then you want have the problems if you need to move or change the motor.

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Old 02-14-2008, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Stop using Adhesive to Seal Outboard Bolts - Please

The thing I do like about 5200 is that it is the best thing I have found that adheres to stainless steel. Most sealants will not stick well at all. Even 4200. If you think your motor bolts arent moving at speed you are wrong. Your whole boat is flexing and moving including your transom. At least with 5200 you stand a better chance that it will adhere to and flex with the movement. Once the sealant loses its bond with the bolt, it will leak. I take some 60 grit in a palm sander and give any surface that sealant will be applied to a good roughening up to help with this. Like Sundance said, a nice ring will do. Any more is just a problem and accompishes nothing.
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